To be fair. Some of these cartoons IMHO don't belong together.
Cartoon Bayformers got really redundant in season 2 with mcguffins and later the Predacons weren't that great.
Nick TMNT goes up and down in episodes.
Samurai Jack was really superb. Final season was rushed however.
And Voltron, admittely did not see because I don't have Netflix right now.

 

Of course, every effort can have its ups and downs and shortcomings... But, they are not trite by design. Yes, TF: Prime took a lot from Bayformers and didn't always work. I really dislike the magical mystical lore, the oversaturation of mcguffins, the pseudo-biblical Primes. All that Bayformers excrement. But at the very least, the production value was consistently impressive, the characters were being treated with genuine respect, the voice acting was incredible, the Decepticons were not semi-sentient mechanical pokemon. TF: Prime, in quite a few ways was what the Bayformers movies should be. But, maybe not what Transformers should be.

Check out Voltron when you get the chance, it's really great. Especially if you have seen Avatar: The Last Airbender and Legend of Korra, I think you'll like it a lot. It has a lot of what Transformers should have.

 

I do think the 70M bduget iwas confirmed after TLK, but again this was always the plan, and considering they always said that they wanted a smaller scale movie, with fewer robots, i think a movie around 70-90M budget was always the plan and considering the announcement that the Bee movie would cost less than the Bay movies came around the time Deadpool came out and studios started to plan out smaller scale action movies with lower budget, after the sucess of Deadpool.

Of course its always possible we could learn later if TLK affected the budget of the Bee movie, from what they've been telling us before TLK came out, it seems a movie that cost less than 147m was always the plan

 

You seem to have forgotten that the point of Transformers is to sell toys.

All that other stuff IS the fluff. For Transformers the toys are ultimately the thing that mattered.

 

How many decades until Hasbro realises the value of their own property is far beyond toys? Supposedly they took that lesson when they killed Prime in the '86 movie. To their surprise, back then, people really cared for those characters. That's why they felt invested in the toys. G1 managed to make people see characters in the plastic, rather than plastic in the characters. The fiction has time and time again surpassed the purpose of mere toy ad. But, yet, Hasbro is yet to learn from their mistakes. It's like owning Star Wars, or Lord of the Rings and seeing no further value to it other than using it to sell bubblegum. The biggest sin of Bayformers (and also the Unicron Trilogy) is enforcing this stigma, that prevents the public from taking the property seriously, despite some incredible works of fiction through the years in various media. And we keep supporting this? No other fandom would have done the same.

 

Knight still wins in the end because being a relatively brand new director, it works in his favor to be put in charge of what is still a multi-billion dollar franchise so early on. Even if it is pretty much out of desparation on Paramount's part and Travis for whatever reason thinks he can save the sinking ship.

THIS I disagree with. Namely because Hasbro doesn't realize the value of their own property in toys anymore, despite being a toy company. Just look at how shoddy the TF5 line is with the deluxes, which are supposed to be the biggest sellers. A 100% price hike for shittier figures.

All Hasbro is doing is making lousy figures that are only loosely based on characters in the film, and not even completely either, as evidenced by several Decepticons missing toys while freakin Berserker got one despite never leaving captivity. Hasbro doesn't have a goddamn clue what to do with Transformers but the powers above strike them dead if they even so much as think about pulling out an reorganizing to figure out what went wrong. They need to shore up the toylines before even thinking about allowing another shitshow film.

 

i'll say again,

the original purpose of comic books was to sell chewing gum

clearly transformers has grown past solely being a toy advertisement

 

Thats pretty bad. Production costs, marketing, and profit splitting may keep this film from making any money. It might've lost money.

 

I don't. I want a complete reboot. Something tells me I would've been disappointed in the continuation of these plot threads anyway.

 

I just checked this and there aren't really if not any comic writers who wrote those movies.

 

Good man!

Also, love shin Godzilla

 

I disagree.

I get the point you're making, but I still don't agree. There were plenty of people who disliked Spider-Man Homecoming, but those who I guess you could say "loved" it, were far more vocal. I mean, how do you go up against a Marvel juggernaut with a negative opinion? Go read "The Last Movie You Saw..." thread and watch people stand up and say they didn't like this Marvel movie, or that one, or any of them and you'll see a bunch of people dogpile on them in quick succession. Just because people haven't said they didn't like it, doesn't mean they did like it. Word of mouth travels better than we'd like to think and I'll be honest, it swayed me. I didn't go see the movie, so I personally cannot comment on it. I'll watch it when it comes to home video/digital, so I can give it a fair assessment, but word of mouth worked. Would you rather sit in a theater for 90-100-120 minutes (possibly more) on a maybe? Or would you rather just wait for it to come home to you and pay $5.00 for a digital rental, or buy it for $20.00 and you're done? That's part of the problem.

It's fair to say that the market was saturated and it made it difficult for movies to compete against one another, but... If they're GOOD movies, they'll gain traction and then mow down the competition. So, the level of how good or bad a movie is, DOES reflect on the box office.

TF1 made it because it was new and exciting and there was some real eye candy in it. (No, I'm not talking about Megan Fox, I am indeed talking about the Transformers themselves.)
ROTF was basically given a free pass, even though the critics slaughtered it because it was more robot eye candy and we got to see some cool stuff such as Optimus taking down The Fallen. (On the flip side, we got to see Turturro's butt, so was it really a win? ...no. No, it was not.)
DOTM pulled it off because it toned down the ridiculous humor (though, there was still enough), made the story a lot more serious and gave us an actual story with a real, genuine mystery with one of the best twists in recent cinema. (If you didn't read the novelization, you were shocked when Sentinel killed Ironhide and made clear his decision to go after Earth.) It worked because it was written well.
AOE had serious issues but was the most down to Earth of the films, thus far and people took issue more with questionable scenes (Romeo & Juliet) and let them dominate the rest of the discussion. They focused too much on the explosions and loudness, which has become commonplace in this franchise, so why they were shocked by it being in the FOURTH film is beyond me. Everyone agrees that the film is too long and is a detriment to it. That said, outside of some off-putting scenes and the over-the-top carnage towards the end, the film was written quite well but drowned out by its visual and auditory problems. (Of which there were many.)
TLK was just a mess. It took two different films and crammed them into one and it showed. It suffered for it. On their own, each piece was written well, but when both square pegs were being forced into the same round hole, disaster was not only bound to happen but did happen. That's not an issue of it couldn't compete, that's an issue of it was never competition material, to begin with. Anyone in their right mind should've looked at what Bay was doing and said "No. Nope. Nuh uh. No."

Still, not a valid point you're making, here.
1. Guaranteed success. Marvel can basically print money, now.
2. As soon as the first reviews came in, this was doomed from the beginning. It had nothing to do with timing, it was just a BAD film.
3. Haven't seen it, can't comment on it, but it wasn't money or time that was the issue, nor was it the competition. I just had other more important things I had to do. (I will see it, though.)
4. It was successful and nothing really stood in its way. I get the point you're making, again, but still...
5. No one, and I mean no one, saw this one. Everybody and their brother avoided this like the plague, on top of bad word of mouth. The only reason competition dominated it was because people wanted to see a REAL film.
6. It was a mess of a film and even the fans and general audience turned on it. Competition, nothing. It just is a stank mess.
7. I've already said what I needed to say, above.
8. Can't comment on it, but heard it was good. It didn't have any effect on TLK. TLK just bombed because it sucked.
9. Oh, please. This one was dead in the water once it left dock. Even before it hit theaters, it wasn't tracking well. Early critics reviews thrashed it because the film had promise and Besson BLEW it. Competition had nothing to do with it.
10. Again, not an issue of competition. It just didn't live up to expectations. Was it a good film, as films go? Sure, why not? Was it a good adaptation? No. I haven't read the books and even I know it didn't even come close to the original vision.

Good choice, bad choice.

That makes you suck. Shame on you. There's no excuse.

Well, maybe try and do the right thing and actually rent them so they make some money. Even rentals and sales at the home video point do help the financials of a film.

TLK proves that the people are right in wanting a new director. I was a big Bay fan and supporter, from the beginning. I was wrong, in the end. He had some hits and misses, but in the end, it was all pretty much a miss. (Financially, they were successful, but his "art" was not.) No one's missing the point except you and those who liked your post. It's not an irrelevant point, it's absolutely THE point. And no, don't disregard how good the movie is or the production quality, they are incredibly important. GOTG2 making more or less than the first isn't an issue when it makes the kind of money it made. The point is, it made its money back and was SUCCESSFUL. TLK didn't and was not.

If Marvel had put out a bunch of films this year and expected everyone to go and see them, along with a bunch of GOOD DC movies, as well as a bunch of Star Wars and other Disney movies, then you'd have a point. Here's the problem with your examples:

Wonder Woman. The FIRST good DC movie. It not only made money and was successful, but it was critically successful as well and the audience liked it. There was Man Of Steel, Batman V Superman: Dawn Of Justice and Suicide Squad. All were financially successful, but the critics couldn't really stand them and they failed with audiences. They just so happened to make enough money out of the curious among us, and a few die hard fans, but that doesn't make them good films. When Wonder Woman, the one everyone expected to tank comes out on top, then you know there's a problem with the formula. DC doesn't have it, Marvel does. Good production quality and values, written and directed well. It made its money because it DESERVED it. Guess what? Zach Snyder ultimately had no hand in it and someone else took over and it worked. Zach Snyder is the common problem with the DCU thus far, much like Bay is the common problem with the TFU thus far.

The problem isn't that there were too many movies, the problem was there were only a handful of good movies lost at sea in a sea of BAD movies. TLK was a tsunami of awful when you really sit down and look at it. I love the movieverse, I buy the toys, they bring me joy, but even I can admit TLK was a disaster and the competition had ZERO to do with it. Some of the movies it was competing against, haven't even made it to China yet, or the other countries it failed in. Bay was the problem, he will always be the problem, getting rid of him WILL fix at least that part of the problem. GOTG2 barely beat the first one, financially because it wasn't as strong of a film as the first one was. The first one's an instant classic with a lot of heart. Vol2 is trying to recapture the magic of the first and just simply cannot do it because it was bloated with spectacle, rather than heart. That's a problem. That has nothing to do with competition.

Power Rangers came out the week before Beauty & The Beast, THAT is an example of competition being the problem. Critics and fans, even just mildly, admitted PR was actually a pretty good movie with potential. It wasn't strong enough to fight off Disney's juggernaut. Even if it didn't have to compete with B&TB, it still wasn't the strongest film, but the timing was certainly part of what did it in. TLK doesn't have that luxury. It just sucked.

Incorrect. People do. All the time. Look at YouTube reviewers. They do it because they're movie fans, not just critics. Take Jeremy Jahns for example. He goes and sees these films. If he can do it, others can too. They choose not to based on reviews and word of mouth. If better movies are made, the competition will become an issue. When they're made like this years films are, competition isn't an issue.

And when you're proven wrong, I surely hope you come back here ready to eat crow. Because the TF movies can be salvaged by people with a little thing we all like to call... TALENT.

*mic drop*

 

!

 

Hmm.....So instead of Han Solo, Deadpool and Incredibles 2.

It's going up against an animated Spider-man movie, Aqua-Man and a post Apocalyptic movie (Mortal Engines) that feature Machines that "Eat each other to stay alive"?

Well the competition is less intense but it doesn't get them out of the fryer IMO. But I am relieved that I'll have a "Bayformer-less" Summer for the most part. Sure there might be a Trailer as early as the Spring but we won't be as bombarded with BumbleBay Spinoff news until the Fall.

 

Q. Can I view the TFW2005 news page without movie spoilers?
A. Yes you can. Transformers News Without Movie Spoilers.

You always count on this...

 

............???????

The 3rd article down is Bayformer oriented.

 

Perhaps, but if it had been a better series they might have had faith in one possibly weak entry. Consider the opening weekend box office takes, before word-of-mouth had any real impact possible:
TF 2007 - $70.5m
ROF 2009 - $109m
DOM 2011 - $116m
AOE 2014 - $100m
TLK 2017 - $45m

 

Oh... Oops.
No this is the site that doesn't have stuff like trailers or intetviews. But toys are still viewable. This is taken from the rules.

 

I'm going to quote myself here, because this was on Facebook earlier... *political topic edited out*



Worst year since 2006. Has nothing to do with how many movies are out there. It has to do with quality.

TLK wasn't quality. Make the next one be a good film and you'll see the series rebound.

 

Over? The nightmare's only going to get worse.

Bayformers IS suffering; I just didn't know there were so many masochists in the world.



But in all seriousness this is very sad news.

Transformers is long overdue for a reboot now, and the thought of this dreary, and tired movie series might continue to shuffle along like the decaying zombie that it's become leads me to accept that we'll never get a true transformers movie.

But when in Rome...