I've really enjoyed the movieverse, and I actually think AOE is the strongest entry besides the original 2007 movie. It had a great villain, a much improved human cast (really dislike shia), excellent effects, and it opened up a lot of really interesting plot possibilities by hinting at significantly expanded history, etc.....

Which TLK completely wasted. It was intended to tie everything together...instead, they threw out the Quintessons completely in favor of a main villain who looked nothing at all like what we saw of the creators in the previous movie, with no actual explanation provided for her, no evidence of her race, no tie-in with the seed, or seeding worlds, no explanation of the knights, no storyline whatsoever explaining the dinobots, a mess of a plot that didn't actually tie anything together, and the decepticons relegated to comic relief with absolutely no competence. Bank robbers? Really? What the hell are they robbing banks for? What does megatron actually want? And oh, yeah, Earth is Unicron, but they didn't do anything with that plot. There wasn't a single compelling enemy to fight against. Prime was only a threat for a few minutes, none of the decepticons were a threat, barricade had more fight footage in tie-in commercials than in the movie itself. The biggest fight was against...a bunch of no-name constructs who yet again had no explanation......

TLK was just absolutely horrible on every level, and IMO irreparably damaged any possible plot-focused approach to the current movieverse.

 

Actually, I'd say Monster-a-go-go is worse than TLK and Cry Wilderness.

At least TLK has knights. MAGG at the end, claims, "there was, no monster." Then again, noone in Cry Wilderness actaully, "cried 'Wilderness.'"

 

First off, how the hell are the movies less silly than anything that came before it? You're telling me Wheelie's rhymes, B.O.T, Carnage in C-Minor, Rhinox farting, Rumble turning into a tree, I could go on for days, etc. are less silly? Where is this great version of Transformers that normal people would think is less stupid?

Who are these "characters in the plastic" in G1 that the movie characters fare so poorly against? I love G1, but most all of the characters in the cartoon were simple, basic archetypes. I'm not even saying that's a bad thing for a half hour toy commercial, but it wasn't because it had much depth. In fact, the success of Transformers is actually the complete opposite reason. It's partially because Transformers is so shallow a concept with the most basic characters and stories that the brand became successful.

The movies aren't perfect, but they're actually one of the main reasons the brand has been as popular as it has been.

We Transformers fans on sites like this are huge minorities within the general public. The preferences of Transformers fans like myself are so different from the general population that I talk with it's not even funny. That's one thing this fandom has not come to terms with. Be glad that the Transformers movies, although TLK has struggled compared to the others, were fun, over-the-top, summer action flicks that the general public have largely enjoyed. Transformers has always been cheesy, over-the-top entertainment made to sell toys, whatever one may think of the films.

I actually like AoE the best and think it surpasses the 2007 movie. I don't think TLK was anywhere near as good, although it had parts I like for sure. Too bad it didn't run well with what AoE started.

 

Ok, I don't agree with that article, and I found that it didn't had all the facts straight. Here's one:

Correction; All of the Transformers Live-action movies had a post-credit scene, except for AOE which lacked one. And Transformers had these post-credit scenes before Marvel started the trend. The author of this article though does not realize that.

Also;

He thinks he talks for everyone, but he does not. There are more Transformer styles out there, not just Bayformers and G1. So many TF fans like other styles than those. And it's clear that the one that wrote this article want the movie to be pure G1, but that is no guarantee for the movie to succeed, seeing as how small percentage the G1 fans are in comparison to the general public that watch these movies.

Next movie that will come out, the Bumblebee movie, seems to be heavily based on G1 due to being in the 80's and Bee's altmode is a bug. We'll see how good that one fares. Though I have already seen people hating on that one as well.

 

I'm just gonna answer the question in the title:

Yes.

 

Nope, the worst of the prequels is considered as good as the first bayformer movie.

put it this way. TLK is better than the emoji movie. but you know what's gotten better reviews? Underworld. Resident Evil. Sharknado. 50 shades. And Twilight. Our franchise has become such a joke and we're so accepting of garbage we'd take poop on a plate and call it chocolate.

Let's look here

TF Fandom. Latest installment gets 16%. People rush to defend it and love it.

Mass Effect Fandom. Latest installment gets 74%. People call it utter garbage and horrible.

What's the difference? One has standards. We've gotten to the point where our movies are so awful but we're kind of like dung beetles eating away while others look in disgust.

 

sad but true

 

A RT score can't quite cut it. Phantom Menace is at a 55% with 6/10 rating from critics and 59% rating of an average 3.3/5 rating. IMDB score is 6.5/10.

Transformers (2007)is at 5.8/10 with 57 % but strangely has 85% with 4.1/5 average rating. IMDB score is 7.1/10.

If you want my opinion, the Phantom Menace you can watch but some of the spectacle feels really dated. I mean is the fight between the Gungans and droids still amazing to look at? I will say the lightsaber fight between Darth Maul, Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan is still awesome but I don't know what else.

Meanwhile Transformers has some of the best summer blockbuster effects that still stood the test of time. Blackout transforming? Optimus transforming?

More power to the people who liked it. Also quick correction that 50 Shades Darker is 9% which technically is lower.

Sharknado is technically bad but that was its purpose which is why people accept it.

If I'm being realistic had RE: The Final Chapter and Underworld:Blood Wars got more than 100 reviews aggregated out there, I have reasons to say that they would be on the same level as TLK.

And are we really still talking about Twilight?

Like I said, if it works for some people I'm happy for them at least.

 

And that's why we'll never get something like MCU, Deadpool, Nolanverse or Logan. Because we have the mindset that it's fine to sit with the dung beetles and munch away. It's amazing that Guardians of the Galaxy gets good movies considering they've been B tier up until 07 or so, while TF gets movies where the actors have no idea whats going on. Like I said, we love mediocrity and will rush to defend it.

 

So in terms of Transformers, what is excellent to you? The 1986 movie? Beast Wars? Transformers: Animated? The G1 cartoon?

 

have you read any of simon furmans comments, arguably one of the most influential comic writers in the TF realm, and his observations on the movies? he has on numerous occasions pointed out how it's missed the mark

have you seen the interviews with buzz dixon and flint dille ? they said that they wrote stories for the cartoon with superficial kid appeal, but with a backbone that was built on a foundation of not talking down to them -- its why so many older people can still appreciate "G1" now. in spite of all its flaws, at the time, it was a revolutionary show. the entire crew, from voice director to storyboarder to screenwriters involved poured their entire creative energy into every show. if all you got was a "silly toy commercial", once again, i question your critical thinking and analytical skills

i'm sorry but there is nothing revolutionary about these movies aside from the CG. and transformers is about more than visuals -- hell, the brand is built on the tagline, MORE THAN MEETS THE EYE!

 

right? guardians of the galaxy is actually a good reference for the direction TF movies should go in

 

YES! there should have been a universal voice after the 2nd TF movie to never allow it to happen again. it seems TF fans like having shit rubbed in their face, very masochistic

 

Furman may be a legend among Transformers writers, but that doesn't mean his word is the end all of everything Transformers. Hell, most of the comics, including Furman's G1 Marvel Comics and the more recent IDW Publishing series, are not things most members of the general public would be even remotely interested in. The live actions films need to appease to the general public in many countries and not just fans. I think most people would agree that the first four films were huge financial successes, which means that they appeased enough people among the general public. Transformers comics only interest the hardcore fans.

   

LOL to the infinitieth power! LOL especially at this statement: "if all you got was a "silly toy commercial", once again, i question your critical thinking and analytical skills." To even question somebody's critical thinking skills for seeing a simple cartoon meant to sell toys is for what it is means we are entering a very strange place and going down a path of fallacy I don't want to head down.

Have you ever heard of Donald Glut? He was a writer on the G1 cartoon. I have seen in him person, although I have not met him. Here is what he had to say (TFWiki being the source) about the G1 cartoon, which is a cartoon I love very much:

"No one, not even the story editors, looked at these scripts very carefully. I seem to remember the show being on a really tight schedule, and we had to crank these scripts out fast. I wrote some of them in a single day, first draft, and they went almost immediately to the storyboard artists after Bryce or an assistant gave them a rather cursory read. We were not trying to create art, just get them done fast, and get paid... None of the writing on this series, in my opinion, was good or passionate or, sometimes (my own included, like The Autobot Run) even adequate. But we got paid well for writing them fast.... I was never a fan of any of the characters."

Unlike Glut, I actually love many of the characters, even being the one-note archetypes most of them are. I love the G1 cartoon. I really love the second half of the second season and the third season. I love episodes like "Webworld," "The Golden Lagoon," "Madman's Paradise," and others. Sure, there are extremely rare moments where the cartoon touches subjects that go a little deeper, but for the most it's an extremely fun but shallow cartoon meant to sell toys. They were not aiming for high art.

There are moments here and there in many Transformers continuities, including the live action movies, that I think are touching or profound, but for the most part every Transformers continuity is entertainment meant to sell toys.

And if you think the Sunbow cartoon is something deeper than most people realize that is fine if you have some good evidence to back it up, but by the same token don't just think everyone who disagrees with you lacks "critical thinking skills" for not seeing what you see, and don't think people who also enjoy the Transformers films, whether on a superficial or deeper level, are idiots who lack "critical thinking skills."

Is anyone in this thread saying they are revolutionary? I think the point being made is that there are plenty of people who enjoy some or all of the films for being summer entertainment. I didn't even like TLK as much its predecessors, but by the same token it's far from the worst thing ever made. It's a flawed movie with glaring issues that also has many redeeming parts and qualities here and there.

 

Honestly? None are good movies. 86 I like for nostolgia but it's not something amazing the way Return of the King would be or Deadpool.

As for series, BW, Prime and Galaxy Force told their stories well, as did Animated after midseason 1 or so.


Also the idea that the comics wouldn't translate well to comics? GOTG, Captain America, Iron Man, and the MCU would disagree with you. So would Deadpool. Logan shows that you can change material but keep it true to what the characters are. Meanwhile in bayformers, you get movies that take time to explain underage relationships while the director wants giant robot testicles. Imagine a 100lb bag of stuff. 16lb mixed in is good stuff. 84lb is hot manure. Now you stir them to mix it. That's what we got in TLK.

 

OK glad to see that nostalgia is the only thing you have. I would say IMO, Deadpool is a pretty fragile movie... Replace Deadpool with some generic superhero and the result is a far less entertaining movie and maybe even a bland one.

In terms of the series, I would agree with BW the most. Prime.... If you didn't realize started to be mcguffin heavy towards like season 2 and then in season 3, they had the whole Predacons things which I felt was underutilised. I grew up with Galaxy Force and I just felt was fine..... Animated I think is underrated and that is a series influenced by Bayformers to some capacity.

Also when have I said anything about the last couple of sentences? I never said comics don't work as movies. By the way, while the MCU films are fun but to me they are also quite formulaic as soon as you keep watching. My belief in the TF movies is there is some potential but it's never realized because you're right... The direction denies this. Sentinel Prime is a great opportunity to explore so much more of Optimus... It's explored but not in the way I wanted to be. Unicron is Earth? Oh geez... What a great opportunity to explain why the robots land or want to destroy Earth.... In fact, I made this thread for fun because that whole idea was never explored.
I don't think Unicron was a bad idea....

Now we have a new director for the movies (The Bumblebee movie), I'm curious because I like being open-minded. I'm not a huge fan of Zack Snyder and his visual style but I never dismissed Wonder Woman and I gave it a chance. Turns out, they hit a note. Reboot or not.... I'm hoping for the best in the future.

 

Yea don't get me wrong, I grew up on G1. I'll rewatch it. But it's not a cohesive story and the plot doesn't progress from episode to episode the way BW did. But that was a cartoon show in the 80s with a smaller budget than a movie series in this decade with 30 years of lore.

Marvel could have used crap stories as well. We could get things like Loeb's run on Ultimates or so [incest] or campy Cap. Instead Marvel used the best material and relied on Ed Brubaker as their consultant for everything Cap (who is the writer on the best Cap run in most people's opinions). I HATED when he killed Steve Rogers but I was so hooked then I realized it all came together so well. Brubaker's Cap focused not just on Cap and heroism, but about him as a person and those around him (Sharon, Bucky, Falcon and then others who he has lost or those who want to be him). Meanwhile we get Optimus telling grimlock [who he just met] to fight for him or he'll slit his throat. Yea that's some great characterization there... why does the MCU get Cap so right and why does the bayformer series get Prime so wrong? I'd have thought it's easier the other way around, just adapt IDW, DW or G1/G2 Prime to the movie, whereas Cap has so many years of being a plastic character it was worrying as a big Cap fan.

 

Yeah, but given the film's name is Deadpool and the character is famous for his 4th wall breaking, completely no-shit-giving psychosis-induced violence, the one thing you came to see the film for is done exceptionally well.

Compare to Transformers where the titular robots get progressively less and less screentime to the point even big OP himself, advertised as the new main villain, doesn't get more than five minutes as evil before resuming back to being a good guy..with NO transformation scenes.

 

Yep exactly. A character as silly and not serious as Deadpool gets a great movie while the TF series instead focus on explaining why the underage relationship is legal. As for the MCU chasing the mcguffix, that's what ties them together, the plot of Infinity War. Marvel first established characters such as Iron man, Hulk, Thor, Cap and Ant Man while showing us Bucky, War Machine, Hawkeye and Black Widow alongside them. Then they bring them together in the Avengers movies. In a world where Deadpool who gets shot in the ass is a good movie, or why people like Groot and Rocket, I don't see why TF can't have any characterization at all. People love Loki but how about movie Shockwave? Any personality? Nah. IDW shockwave was a character. Bayformer was a prop. Even Starlord, a B tier at best has more character to him than Ironhound (since both are pretty much the same character outside of voice and look). How much personality did Sideswipe have before he was killed off... off panel of all things. Meanwhile people cared more for Antony than they did that Ratchet died.

 

There is.... You just don't attach to it well....
Optimus- A hero who tries to fight for freedom and best interest of others. In fact, I think TFWiki wrote this best.

"As obsessively as Megatron strives to achieve his objective, Optimus is equally as dedicated to stopping him, even at the cost of his life, his world, and—if necessary—his own people. It was on his order that the AllSpark was jettisoned into space, dooming Cybertron to a slow death and his people to a nomadic life. The sacrifices he has made weigh heavily on his spark, but they must be done, for there is no other choice. He knows the ambitions that lurk in Megatron's spark, and they must never see the light of day. Lives must be kept free from the threat of Megatron's tyranny, no matter the cost. This obsession with the defeat of Megatron has robbed Optimus of some of his early idealism. This has created a certain ruthlessness beneath his otherwise honest and caring personality. Prime is not one for second chances and is willing to consider any action that might lead to victory, short of directly sacrificing those he cares about."

Bumblebee- He's a brave Autobot who also happens to be vain. You know like the scene where he changes Camaro form in the 2007 film? He can also be a great wingman/friend i.e. with Sam Witwicky.

Megatron- A tyrant who wants nothing more than to save Cybertron and its people. By far, I think the most interesting of the main robot cast.

Ironhide and Hound are actually completely different. Hound just loves spouting one-liners in battle which more than what Ironhide is capable of. He fights to the last bullet. Ironhide isn't that boisterous of a character, he can get annoyed he's a little more laid-back. The one thing they do share is being heavy characters though.

Sideswipe never died.... At least no evidence there is canonically speaking.... I'm not going to lie, a part of me died when Ratchet died, I went, "There goes another Autobot from the 2007 movie...."

It's really not fair to say the Transformers don't have character when clearly they do. What they don't do is push forward with these characteristics and develop them further onscreen which is at fault because of so many other things. The closest we have ever gotten is perhaps with Optimus in AOE.