Looks like Bay is indeed back for a Fifth Round

Discussion in 'Transformers News and Rumors' started by eagc7, Jan 4, 2016.

  1. shellformer

    shellformer @

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    This doesn't really make sense because it isn't like people appreciate the Bay films for at least having continuity or whatever. If Hasbro just shrugged and said they're doing other Transformers films and these turned out to actually be memorable for good reasons nobody would mind. All anyone needs to say is "we're doing new stories with new directors" and there would be no issues.

    I mean, it isn't like Bay fucking invented Transformers as a franchise. There's a million things that have been done previously and many times that if you just had good writers who're allowed to think outside the box.

    Massive marketing, aiming towards children and total dedication to spectacle goes a long way. Remember Avatar? That film that made a whole lot of money? And look at all the Marvel films. They're not going to be remembered for anything other than "that period that overdid superheroes".

    There's a big chunk of people who'll go and watch anything that looks cool because they don't have a particularly developed sense of why they like a film or what makes something good action. They'll watch Man of Steel as happily as they'll watch Fury Road.
     
  2. SouthtownKid

    SouthtownKid Headmaster

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    Sure, if children were watching these movies. Which they aren't. It's all young adults/adults.
     
  3. MnemonicSyntax

    MnemonicSyntax Macrodata Refinement - SVR'D Access

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    As opposed to what then?

    Sometimes something that looks cool is good enough.
     
  4. deaculpa

    deaculpa Stand Alone Complex

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    [​IMG]
     
  5. G.B. Blackrock

    G.B. Blackrock Autobot Ally

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    Actually, they can.

    The thing is, they're also thoroughly enjoyed by a lot of a people. Tons. More than most movies are, in fact.

    While that makes me despair for most people's sense of taste, it does mean money and attention to the franchise that is good for those of us who are fans, even if we hate the movies (I do, myself). It has meant that toys exist that likely would never have existed had the movies not done as well.

    But the reality remains. These movies are widely loved and widely hated. They are, almost by definition, divisive. The gap between those who love them and those who hate them is pretty huge.
     
  6. EagleTron

    EagleTron Well-Known Member

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    They are right, movies are not made to make money!
    300 hundred million is not good!
    Being one of the most viewed movies of all times is not good.

    NOT!
     
  7. TFXProtector

    TFXProtector TFW2005 Supporter

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    *points to bold part* I don't think that's fair to say or even your call. There's something about the movies that calls out to each audience member, whether it's the humor, the characters, the special effects (that includes the bots themselves) or the cars used, there's something that draws people in. That doesn't mean they have bad taste or they're stupid, they can be quite the opposite, really.

    Films like Transformers aren't meant to be anything more than eye candy with a bit of story mixed in. The first thing that comes to mind when I think of escapism. That's what people want: An escape from reality. Whether it's 10 minutes or 110, it's an escape for a little bit before having to go back to reality.

    Anyone, of any creed, background, age, mentality, etc can appreciate taking a break for a moment and these movies allow that.

    If they were thinking man movies, they'd be overblown more than they are, more boring than they tend to be and they'd be ripped apart for that as well. "It's too talky!" "It's too heady!" "It's just so downtrodden and sad!" "It's utter hopelessness, why does the truck guy robot keep trying to save us? Why?!"

    This is the problem with Transformers.

    The movies are enjoyed by ALL walks of life because they're ridiculous escapism. Kids want to be able to hang out with the Transformers, they want to be Sam, the hero and they love the flashy colors and loud explosions. The parents love that it's a way to entertain their kids for a while so they don't have to, and secretly...they like 'em a little bit too. The first movie? Mothers approved of it and said to take kids to see it. No joke.

    This all started because of a businessman on a trip to Japan found a new toy to bring to the states. It started off as a TOY. A plaything. Things we discarded as a child, things we destroyed and didn't put much stock into as a kid. Neither did the parents.

    Marvel made a comic book out of it with silly names such as Buster Witwicky, stories pertaining to the Carwash of Doom (Seriously?!) and a cartoon that was so full of camp, even Power Rangers said "Let's emulate that!" (and then they went overboard with it and far surpassed what TF was capable of.)

    It's pretty hard to have respect and look at the whole thing with a straight face and say "Yeah, we can make a legitimate movie out of this!" Somehow they did, they also played to the franchise's strengths: Silliness, escapism, science FICTION, outlandish fantasy.

    IDW tries to make the comics work, but I (and quite a few others) find them boring, too dark, too serious and not enough in step with what Transformers started out as.

    The movies, while not perfect, are pretty much what you can expect from a franchise such as this.

    Star Wars, for example, a saga that covers life and death, love and hurt, hope and fear, and by episode 7...joy. I go to those films because they're a story with colorful characters and a deeper meaning. Especially 7.

    Transformers covers robots beating the everloving shit out of each other, blowing stuff up bigger and better than last time, with colorful characters (literally colorful) and puddle depth.

    I have no desire to collect Star Wars. It's nice to look at, nice to visit, but it's exasperating because it takes you through all of the parts of the human condition. Transformers, I have an overwhelming desire to collect because they're fun, they're awesome toys and I don't need to think about the human condition for a few minutes while turning one of them from a robot to a dragon.

    Just because someone likes Transformers doesn't mean they have bad taste, it just means they have a wide range when it comes to their taste. Plenty of intelligent and classy people went to see the Transformers films, they'd be outright offended if they saw your post.

    People think the trend in horrible movies is because people are getting stupider and their lack of effort is leading to our personal destruction, but it's just not true. There are plenty of us from the older generations who have good taste, we just don't need heavy handed entertainment every time we walk into the theater or put a video on screen.

    Some movies? Sure, Hollywood is going for the lowest common denominator, but in general, a lot of movies do try, even if they ultimately fail. Problem is, the films that are critically acclaimed are usually a mess in some fashion or another.

    For example: Steven Soderburgh's Haywire. Critics LOVED it, it was one of their darlings, but it was an awful film. It was boring, the fight sequences, while brutal and eye catching, were few and far between and the mystery in the film wasn't all that thrilling in what was supposed to be a thriller. Did terribly at the box office.

    Movies like Transformers just work simply because we want to see Saturday morning cartoons come to life and beat the piss out of each other. That's what it's always been basically, that's pretty much what it will continue to be. Go ahead and change it if you must, but don't be surprised if it blows up in our faces when it happens.

    Sometimes a working formula shouldn't be messed with. Sometimes I think the movies even happening were a bad idea. I love the movie series, I do, so this is coming from someone who's an actual fan.

    I think the movies shouldn't have been made. They've shown how truly UGLY the fandom is at heart. I've seen more horrible and vicious comments from the people in the fandom during the movie years than I ever have and I remember what the message boards were like back when they all opened for the first time. Bottalk, for example. I remember Renaud. Oh...do I. *shudders*

    But the movie era? Pure and utter insanity with evil mixed in. Death threats, in fighting, belittlings, pretty much anything negative. I'm not sure it was worth it, even though the toys were cool.
     
  8. Hollywood Hoist

    Hollywood Hoist Well-Known Member

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    Massive marketing doesn't automatically mean huge success. Look at Lone Ranger, John Carter, Jupiter Ascending. Most movies are directed to the teenage, young adult market, which is why almost no superhero movies are rated R. Battleship had a lot of similarities and was almost trying to emulate Bay's style and that certainly wasn't a big hit.

    Avatar is a good movie. I found it memorable, I'm looking forward to seeing the sequels. It was an impressive feat for a film not based on any previous material to be the huge success that it was.

    People don't need a degree in film appreciation to enjoy a movie. A film doesn't have to be a masterpiece to be entertaining. When it comes to films like Transformers, all that matters to most audience is, were they entertained.

    I love watching movies that me think, but I also like movies that take me for a ride. I don't remember roller coasters or fire works displays, but they're sure fun at the time.

    There is very little in the film world I haven't experienced or studied, but it doesn't change that my opinion of a movie is no more valid than any one else.
     
  9. Hollywood Hoist

    Hollywood Hoist Well-Known Member

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    I wasn't saying there weren't people who hated the movies. Those who hate the movies are totally justified and I would never try to convince them to like them. There are some who hate the films who try to say NO ONE likes the films and that's where they are wrong.

    I enjoy the movies, but I don't recommend them often to people who want a fun action film. I usually tell people that the TF films aren't that good, but I was entertained. I wouldn't recommend Citizen Kane to the average movie goer, though I personally think the film deserves it's place as one of the greatest films ever made.
     
  10. Hollywood Hoist

    Hollywood Hoist Well-Known Member

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    However there are some films that the money is not the primary goal of the film. Sure everyone wants people to see their movie and for it to be successful, but it's not necessarily the primary reason that a film exists. When it comes to TF films, yeah, they are there to make moneyl
     
  11. shellformer

    shellformer @

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    It's literally a children's franchise, with an enormous toy industry supporting the films. If it was strictly for people above the age of 15 they wouldn't bother with a tie-in toyline yet mysteriously the film lines have massively outmatched Generations and whatever TV show lines happened at the same time.

    I'm saying people will go and watch AoE because it looks cool and then also go and watch Fury Road because it looks cool. There is a huge difference in quality between these two despite both being the same genre but lots of people don't make a distinction. A lot of people will watch spectacle for the sake of spectacle without caring for whether it was done with skill. That explains why the Bay films can draw in large amounts of cash.

    I'm not saying that every film must be educational or life-changing or any nonsense like that. I very much enjoyed Fury Road which is all about taking you for a ride, quite literally so. I'm simply pointing out that a film can be both spectacular and well done. Excusing a bad film with that it's spectacular is just tiresome.
     
  12. G.B. Blackrock

    G.B. Blackrock Autobot Ally

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    Dude, way overlong response to a throwaway line. I was actually trying to be fair, despite my admitted disdain for the movies, by saying how they've been good for the franchise.
     
  13. G.B. Blackrock

    G.B. Blackrock Autobot Ally

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    I was simply responding to your choice of words.

    To someone who says "no one likes the films" or "everyone hates them"... yes, I agree with everything in your posts.

    But "they can't be that hated" is a factually incorrect statement. I was trying to point out that the fact that many people love these films doesn't preclude the hatred that many people claim to have. These movies are that divisive.
     
  14. EagleTron

    EagleTron Well-Known Member

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    Everybody should know that I meant to say movie theater intended movies, big budget movies and especially Transformers Live Action movies. We are on the same side here.
     
  15. Autovolt 127

    Autovolt 127 Get In The Titan, Prime!

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    So true.
     
  16. Moy

    Moy Constructicons!

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    Your words are gold.
    [​IMG]
     
  17. TFXProtector

    TFXProtector TFW2005 Supporter

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    How arrogant are you? Your words were a stepping stone, started my post, but my post was about more than just what you said. It was about all of what I talked about.

    Way to discount my opinion and what I had to say. What a shitty way to interact with someone who has a point that differs from your's. I'll remember to do that next time when you post.

    Oh wait, no I won't. That's why you're going on the block list.

    Thank you. See, Blackrock? People DID read my post. It was more than just responding to you. Put that ego in check, chief.
     
  18. optimusprime42

    optimusprime42 Autobot Leader

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    i read there will be no humans in it... but i read mark wahlberg is returning with megan fox maybe shia
     
  19. TFXProtector

    TFXProtector TFW2005 Supporter

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    No humans? lol Trust me, there will be humans in 5. These movies won't sell without humans in them, especially big name stars.
     
  20. Beastwarsfan95

    Beastwarsfan95 Putting the ‘Bi’ in Bionicle.

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    Great. Everyone gear up for over-the-top violence, gratuitous swearing and tons of tasteless sex jokes.

    Oh, ya, and you may see a Transformer or two.