And in a lot of ways, the movies feel like it was basically "Hey, this was in the old cartoon so let's use it because it's cool and also REFERENCE so we can act like we 'get' Transformers and its fans". Like how a ROTF borrowed the plot from Fire on the Mountain or DOTM lifted The Ultimate Doom's main idea wholesale, but instead of expanding on those ideas or understanding why fans enjoyed the original versions, it's "DURRRR LET'S HAVE SOME ROBOTS FIGHT AND DESTROY CITIES AND FAMOUS LANDMARKS AND ALSO EXPLOSIONS BECAUSE KEWL". I'm not saying we should let fanboys write/direct these movies (God no), but maybe they should have someone who understands the history of the series and bring them in. Hell, imagine how much better the movies would be if they used someone like Simon Furman as a story consultant*.

*Or Sixshot as a ninja consultant

 

Another they didn't understand the source material haven't heard this before. Enough that complaints gotten old especially when it's becoming clear the fans are the ones with the problem.

First fire on the mountain isn't what ROTF was based off of it was based off of the marvel comic story the new order. What did fans enjoy about that story I don't know really but what was the core of it basically the idea of Buster protecting the Matrix from Shockwave who wants to use it to build an army you also have Prime being pretty much killed and if I recall Buster saving him. These ideas build the core of ROTF.

Also the Dinobots were in New Order guess what their role was being recruited to fight against Shockwave after that they pretty much did nothing and failed in fact Age of Extinction used them a lot like the New order did except they didn't talk but same idea. Everything in these movies can be traced back to G1 and more importantly comes off rather faithful replace The Fallen with Shockwave and have Prime disassembled rather than killed and you have a pretty accurate adaptation certainly more accurate than anything Marvel studios done.

Which of course leads to another truth I'm going to tell you the marvel movies have more story than Transformers well here's a fun fact for the day, in the transformer movies usually about a third of the movie is action it about averages out to that in each film. While in the better written and better story called the Avengers about half the movie is action even worse if you told someone all the action scenes they would actually understand the story, when you don't even need to hear any of the dialog scenes to get the story you're plot is paper thin. Can't do that with a transformer movie.

The transformer movies are actually very faithful New world order hit the most of the important plot points of the story. Dark was a mixture not really an adaptation at all however it certainly captured one of the most important scenes from Megatron's master plan and actually improved it the scene with the autobots leaving beats the G1 version in every conceivable way. Age was very similar to for all Mankind and Lockdown's arc was very similar to Animated. Megatron's arc was similar but different from animated.

 

I agree that going too fan heavy is a really bad idea. A film like Serenity was almost impossible to follow for anyone new because you needed to know the series Firefly really well to get the movie. It shouldn't be a requirement to have watched any of the cartoons or read any of the comic books for people to get a Transformers movie.

I don't really need G1 Starscream, Armada Starscream, Animated Starscream, or Transformers Prime Starscream, but it would be nice to feel like the production team understands the nuts and bolts of the character instead of well let's call the jet Starscream and on rare occasions throw in a line that kind of sounds like a past Starscream.

 

Prime and the High Moon games I understand. But IIRC, Animated was conceptualized as a backup idea in case the first movie bombed at the box office. That way, if the movie failed, Hasbro could have Animated to fall back on.

 

I don't even think Hasbro cares about RID...the fact its more or less getting canned is a good sign of that.

Exactly...jesus Ash I'm always agreeing with you.

 

I too agree with Ash. The MCU is very accessible and you don't need a Master's in Marvel comics history to have fun with them, they take the great stories penned by guys like Stan Lee and adapt them for a general audience. But with TF, it feels like they have superficial winks/nods to G1 and such and they arbitrarily assign characters the old names that sound cool.

As an example of the movies' issues...take Starscream. I don't expect every iteration to be exactly like G1 Screamer. That's silly. But I expect every bot named Starscream to at least have a desire to overthrow Megatron, details can be different beyond that.

Or look at Shockwave, most on-screen versions are unfailingly loyal to Megatron while practically every comic iteration has tried to take command of the Decepticons. I expect at least broad, defining traits to be part of new versions of older characters.

 

Yeah, great point!

Except Optimus specifically said exactly that in the first film while fighting for Earth against Decepticon tyranny, like he has in every single film, not to mention killing his mentor specifically because he betrayed that very idea after teaching it to Optimus himself, not to mention fighting for Cybertronian freedom against the Creators, etc., etc., etc.

Hell, he even allowed humans the freedom to kick the Autobots off the planet when he thought MAYBE they had half a chance of making a go of it themselves at the start of TF:RotF, only to let humanity THINK they'd left at their behest so they could still return and save them from enslavement even though Earth was TOTALLY treating them like shit.

But okay, sure, the movies haven't upheld Prime's motto AT ALL, lol.

>_>

P.S. Movies are expensive. OF COURSE they're in it for the money.

Larry Hama would like to have a word with you about being a "story consultant" on G.I. Joe: The Rise of Cobra.

Also, latter-day Furman is easily some of the very worst Transformers writing I've seen in my entire life.

:-\

Not particularly good examples.

Firstly, there's the possibility that Starscream himself was part of the F-22 missile strike against Megatron in the first film. And then there's the whole conversation between the two of them aboard the Nemesis in TF:RotF. Starscream did NOTHING to help resurrect Megatron, "left him to die," took command of the Decepticons, and Megatron beat the shit out of him for it.

Yup! That's Starscream, all right.

Oh, and look, there's Shockwave in TF:DotM representing BOTH versions of his character, being a loyal Decepticon and doing his duty AND actually commanding more Decepticons himself than we really ever see Megatron order around. He didn't really even NEED to overthrow Megatron, since he himself was already in command on the field and since his and Megatron's goals were in alignment AND moments away from success.

Why WOULDN'T he stay the course at that point?!?

IT IS ONLY LOGICAL.

 

The thing is, the movies continue to rake in hundreds of millions of dollars, which fuels the fire. Regardless of whether you loved or hated AoE, you cannot deny it made big bucks. And the live-action franchise pulls in new people to the franchise and fandom ALL the time. Hell, it's how I wound up a member of the fandom.

It does seem unfortunate that the movies are overshadowing the cartoons and what not, but there's not much the average fan can do.

 

i'm glad that here is a lot of transformers' movies in the future but i think these movies are going about the wrong way

 

If I can see more of the Dinobots I'm okay with that. The Creators I'm very curious how they will look and be treated in the film.

 

TF movies are terrible to watch, I never knew who is fighting who, fighting scenes are absolute chaotic with most robots being gray and silver, Prime ripping faces and heads off, killing his own kind and speaking of "freedom is the right of...blabla..."

the only bot people/kids really care about is Bumblebee, because he is portrayed as "the friend figure" for children with some bad ass elements. But is Prime still the father figure like in the cartoon? What about other Autobots, anyone who is also likeable? Anyone of the Decepticons who is not a generic silver-colored guy?

The MCU is full of interesting characters, Tony Stark, Starlord, Cap, Hawkeye and Ant Man are not difficult to distinguish, even without their costumes. TF movies don`t have that, you only root for 1-2 characters. Maybe.

 

Sadly, I concur. I actually like the movie toys (especially ROTF) even though I don't like the designs but the toys were made of seemingly better plastics (compared to now) and the transformations were challenging.

Yeah, I'm hoping we get some story resolution with the Creators...actually, I want a reboot of the series...

I concur with you. The only improvement I find is that the action sequences are too confusing - especially with and DOTM and AOE. I honestly couldn't follow the action from the first two movies...too frantic and I really dislike the 'shaky cam' effects.

 

It is a problem that if you aren't a robot named Prime, Bumblebee or Megatron you only get a few lines to try to stand out as a character. If you are lucky enough to even have lines in the film.

 

Well, my nerd life is now complete. I could care less who directs it or how bad the acting is etc. I just want to see more bots, more carnage, and more depth to the story/stories. Not to mention the insane amount of toys we will all be eating up like tic-tacs!

 

So Wheelie didn't get a bunch of scenes or what about Starscream can't forget Sentinel or Lockdown. Why did people care when Ironhide died why did a lot of people fan or no fan alike care because they got enough to like him. The Autobots in Age certainly didn't get any lines are you done telling this lie because no matter how many times you say it it doesn't change the fact that people cared when they died.

What is good writing what is considered good story or character or anything? For example Why was Jurassic World a success, was the story great no it was just a monster slasher movie with dinosaurs for the most part, was the character great no it was the typical stuff you would expect in a Spielberg film even though it wasn't one but nothing special. On paper it's very simplistic the characters are kind of cliche so what clicked? What made this work for me as well? (Note I was going to use a transformer example but my choices wouldn't of helped.)

What is good writing what is a good story and what is good character development? What makes a character interesting what makes Steve or Tony more interesting than Optimus. What makes the story of Avengers or Jurassic World more interesting than Dark of the Moon. What really makes the characters more interesting or deep. What is it that makes those two an example of good writing what is defined as good writing and storytelling?

 

Let's focus on a 5th movie before an 8th movie.   Talk about thinking ahead. Too far ahead. You sure you'll have enough ideas to get to an 8th movie?

 

Yeah. What was the Fallen beyond "random threat from nowhere and Megatron's dominatrix"? He was superfluous and barely in the movie despite it being names for him. And I don't know what kind of "revenge" he was even after. Just one example of how much of a clusterfuck these movies are.

 

He basically wanted to take revenge on the Primes that banished him and ruin his plans by taking out Optimus which he did manage to do and to finish his job at taking Earth's resources to bring back Cybertron. Yeah it didn't explain much about his personalty other then his motives sure but his motives were at least clear.

 

Well would you look at that yet another example of people not paying attention the purpose of the Fallen was to establish the backstory of the war and the transformer race as a whole. The Fallen doesn't really have much of a personality never has.

His personality is pretty much this he is cold, calm, mostly respectful to his followers, he is collected never losing his cool over really anything this goes so far to the point where he is board line emotionless not showing any emotion really until the end. He is wise having infinite knowledge of their race, he is patient as he was willing to wait twenty thousand years to have his revenge, and is intelligent using Sam as bait to lure in Optimus as well as using Sam to find and earn the Matrix for him hence why he waits until near the end of the battle to show himself, he is also very cautious as he refused to return to Earth until Prime was dead and took the Matrix while Prime was being healed by it doing everything to avoid a confrontation with him. The Fallen was also quite spiteful and petty his entire motivation being the result of something that happened twenty thousand years ago and still holding his grudge against humanity for his defeat.

So yes he had a personality and he had a purpose in the plot a fight scene doesn't make a character or even a villain when the hell will people will realize this!?