They do cost only few dollars to make after tooling is paid off , that's why I said that most 3rds party companies make 2k run and I even mentioned after how many units quakewave was paid off and yes your mark up prices is exactly 50%

You keep mentioned that you run an actual business. I do too as you have seen on my emails , and is not a toy company , this is just an hobby for me , not that is nothing wrong with it.

I own 2 small business on which I have over 32 employees , so what ever cost you are saying you have I know them well , that's why my accountant is there for .

But I think you are taking this personal and if you feel offended by any of my earlier comments please accept my apologies. .

I was only showing everybody all the process from creating a figure to the date they receive it.

You can mark you prices even 200% that's up you , I don't think is right , I don't think is fair. Why not just charge only 20% extra , I know you are a fan and I know you want to help the fans too , so what do you say ?

 

Is a shame that all their hard work was copied like that , I think hexatron is a great figure even tough I don't own one , but I have seen reviews and its great

 

Why is it not right or fair for a retailer to make a profit for marketing, selling, and delivering a product? Every store owner in the world has to mark up their stock in order to make a living. You seem to think that 20% is a "fair" number, but you also constantly discount the expenses of running a business, making it sound like you expect guys like Sidecutter to act as your forwarding service, free of charge.
Everyone needs to make a cut, and the amount of that cut needs to be scaled to the costs of the location of the business. That may seem "unfair" to people on the outside, but if a business doesn't charge a sustainable price, then it won't be a business for long.
I'm not sure where you're located, but if it's the US, then you know there are expenses (both business and personal) in the US that are higher here than in other parts of the world; those expenses end up being passed on to consumers. What's break-even for you might not be even close to that for any given retailer. You can make these toys out of the goodness of your heart, but it's not cool to trash on folks who are just trying to make a living.
All that said, you seem to be earnestly wanting to help out the fans, so hopefully the project works out well for the industry as a whole.

 

I do like the idea of being charged less, that's for sure. One thing that keeps a lot of people away from 3rd party toys is the price. Lower the price and one may not be able to profit as much per individual figure, but the chance of selling more figures could increase.

 

Do you make any money off of your small businesses? Why not run them for free and give your employees all income from the business?


I support your position that nobody should make money from transformers. I have PM'd you my address so you can mail me Kronos and Titan. If you're going to pay for shipping, I want international 2-day expedited mail, none of this boat shit.

 

First of all you haven't pm. Your adress , second if its a free shipping why would you choose the way of shipping and third , yes I do make money of my 2 small bussiness , that doesn't mean that I make all the money and keep my employees starving either .

I am not saying that people shoul not make any money by reselling something but 50% is a lot. No matter how they want to put it

 

Well, all I have to say is...Arafat, your product looks to be quality so far, and I appreciate the low price at which it is being offered, and Sidecutter, thanks for being such a damned good retailer. The back and forth here, has been probably one of the most interesting topics I've seen discussed on tfw2005.

 

Nah, there's no need and no point in making any justifications for our decisions or the way we do/did things. Ultimately we cannot change the mind of someone who would support the "original" or one who thinks supporting KOs is the way to stick it up to the man. Heck I don't think anyone besides those who know me personally or been through what I/we did would give a shit that I personally spent over a year full time without pay on Cyclops and MMC spent like what 2 years? on Hex (I still call him hex) and yes we can't blame anyone but ourselves for making the choices to do this and not competent enough to create and deliver figures with a snap of the fingers.

But just on the topic of the company's decision on choosing not to work with any resellers if they carried CloneDroid's figure I personally think that its not that the bosses are on a high horse and I don't think what we do for a living is right or what CD is doing is wrong. Its more of an action and consequence effect. Like you step on my toes I have to push you back kinda thing ya know?

And don't ask me more I ain't commenting any further lol

 

Don't need you to comment bro, just nice to see you here. What's up and how you doing?

 

Dam dude. The guys sticking up for the fans an you come off sounding like a demanding douch. That will win a company over

 

That'll be off topic lol. you can always pm me

 

Sooo... basically you're just giving them away? That's well... cool and all... but some of these 3P designers are very talented & I feel they deserve to make a living from it. I've no problem paying a reasonable amount to ensure everyone's happy if I want them to succeed and grow.

Overall though, I feel you're giving us a lot of mixed information... I hope everyone is taking everything with a grain (or a plateful if you're wise) of salt. Again... does Daca Toys have any completed "in-the-hands-of-customers" products? All I've seen (that I know of) is 3D renders...

 

I'm adopting his position, shouldn't he take it as a compliment?

ARAFAT's position is that distributors and retailers are charging "too much" (whatever the number is), and his justification is that Dada toys (his company) is gonna have a much lower profit margin, including stuff like free shipping along the distribution chain. He also doesn't understand "why" anyone would ever try to make the profit they're making, and should try to make less. He's even said he's not making money off of Dada toys.

Oddly, when he runs his own 2 small businesses besides Dada toys, he also makes a profit, he just doesn't think other companies should "keep their employee starving"

So now, not only are companies that he's criticizing making "too much profit" off of poor customers, they are also not paying their employees enough.

I think next logical step is for him to step up and support his position by giving away his toys for free, and also tell us what his other businesses are.

I'd also like to know what model of Ferrari all of his employees are driving, since he clearly takes better care of them than poor Captured Prey/TF Source/BBTS does their employees.

Free Titans and Kronos for everyone!

Dude, just ship them to Pasadena and hand them out at the door of Botcon convention center.

 

We've seen grey prototypes of Titan and Kronos, which were apparently created for free for him by the factory he uses:

That last part is what pisses me off. Who are you to tell other people how much money they should try to make? No one's selling meth here, we're talking fucking toys. If distributor X, toy company Y, or retailer Z wants to charge a certain price, go for it. If the market supports it, more power to them, if the market doesn't, then they've fucked themselves and consumers get their shit on discount down the road.

We're not in a fucking commune.

If Dada Toys wants to price its products lower with zero (or negative) profit margin, direct distribution, free shipping, GO FOR IT. Rule the third party market. I dare you.

But speak with your own actions (i.e. your products).

And i really hope Titan and Kronos are good, because if they bomb, this is gonna be hilarious.

 

Actually, by distributors, he means retailers. So basically his position is just that we retailers are charging too much.

And 15% markup over cost (a profit margin of 13%, in this case) is ridiculous. After we paid the payment processing fees off the gross sale total, which means we pay a payment fee even for your shipping cost...and pay the profit taxes to Uncle Sam, we'd get about $9 out of the whole thing in real, possible profit, but that only counts the fees and taxes. Out of that $9 I'm supposed to find money to expand, to travel to do shows like BotCon, to help compensate for items that have a GROSS margin before those costs of around 10%, to pay rent, put food on the table, pay for a family if applicable, etc, etc, etc.

At that rate? I'd have to sell 439 - yes, 439 - of Kronos JUST to pay for the cost - no profit at all - of attending BotCon in Pasadena as a dealer. And that would be all by my lonesome, without potentially needing to fly out anyone to assist me and feeding them, not accounting for possible vehicle maintenance and repairs to make sure it was safe to do so...when you look at that and imagine trying to do that with everything it's obviously not realistic.

 

Gotta say: for all that Arafat's heart might be in the right place, and even his sentiment not entirely without value, you know you're fighting a losing battle when Sidecutter takes up the opposition. Be hard for anyone to claim the man wasn't providing an honest-to-goodness service to the Western TF fandom, with grassroots knowledge on what it takes to get it done. Most new businesses fail. Just the fact that Captured Prey is still going strong would be indication enough, but that Sidecutter's been such a bloody gent throughout - well, it's hard to take up arms against his business practices.

And that's how capitalism works. There was a gap in the market - a consumerbase crying out for an alternative to the big names (which also have their merits, don't get me wrong) - and someone willing to go the distance to supply that demand at prices that make sense for everyone. I wish we had more companies like CP.

But could there be a cheaper way for a retailer/distributer to do business? Can't rule it out. Someone with a lot of financial backing might be able to scale everything up and bring costs down. A name with a lot of clout in the marketplace might be able to guarantee widerspread sales with relatively less work. A loss leader might be able to seal such a name for themselves. Really savvy deals and innovative business practices can carry an entrepreneur a fair old way. There's always room for improvement.

But that doesn't mean we can't be grateful for the people already putting in the time and the effort to do an amazing job. More power to you if you think you can do it better. You'll make more money and/or claim more market share just for doing that; and existing companies will have to take notice. Maybe you'll change the face of the hobby for large swathes of the world - and for that possibility I wholeheartedly welcome you to try.

But yeah, I'm grateful for BBTS, TF Source, Kapow, Captured Prey et al. They fill gaps in the market, and they continue to offer something I want. That they make money doing it doesn't detract from that. Hell, I'd be more worried if they didn't. How much money they make is their business. I'm going to vote with my wallet and if they start losing out then they'll do something about it. I don't see any cartels here. Just businesses doing business.

 

I don't really get into many KOs so maybe I don't see the bigger picture. But how is this any different to a company doing a KO of a mainline toy?

I'm not condoning the practice of KOs but I didn't see any of this backlash on the KO masterpiece threads.... Just kinda seems like double standards to me. If this fandom wants to righteous and frown on KO practices it should be consistent and frown upon ALL KO companies not just when it suits?

 

Remember something you are not only selling 1 product you are selling several from different companies. So your numbers are wrong again , 3% credit card , sales tax you are actually forward this to the costumers in your state you are not actually paying for it. Tax bracket will the depens on how much your bussines makes a year , you also mentioned that storage space an 20x20 storage. Shouldn't be more than what $200 a month ?? Shipping supplies you buy them in bulks so you save a lot there too .


I didn't want to single you out but since you were the one replying

 

Option zero , I won't actually respond to you since I seem its clear that you have something wrong up there in the roof , I never said that prototypes were free I actually mentioned that they costed $1900. , what is free are factory samples not prototypes. And please try to keep it clean no cursing ok?

 

I might go down to my local store that sells iPods and kick off that they are not selling them as cheap as they buy them