Transformers Henkei C-07 and C-08 are Sunstreaker and Prowl

I'm sorry, but for the price difference, I don't see myself picking up the Takara version of Sunstreaker or Prowl, even with the changes that Takara has been making with Henkei so far. I'll buy the Hasbro versions with no regret.

Whether or not Takara does the other Seekers that didn't see a retail US release, I don't really care. The ones that did see retail release were the ones that I actually wanted, so no regrets there, either.

I will be waiting to see what Takara does with Powerglide, though. Seriously, White Powerglide is Greenscream 2.0 (major fail). If Henkei Powerglide is red, then that is the Powerglide I buy. It would be a pipe dream for me if the Henkei version also gutted the flame gimmick from the engines and gave us semi-real-looking engines instead.

Speaking of pipe dreams, a Henkei Cliffjumper with an appropriately re-molded head and spoiler would be something great to see.

As for something that shouldn't be a dream, how about Hasbro remembering that the Classics line is supposed to be about Classics, not the movie line. Galvatron turned into a major failure because of this. His alt mode should have been some weird cannon, not a tank. The first set of Classics didn't have all "real" alt modes and it worked well. Keep the Classics classic, and have the repaints from other lines just be "Universe" with no mention of Classic on the package.

Oh yeah, put out that freaking Classics Cosmos design, for pity's sake Hasbro! It didn't make it into the first round of Classics and was going to be put out in Titanium before the plug got pulled on that. So, put it out where it was originally intended to go!

Other than the first two paragraphs, that's my rant for the day.

From this thread:

http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/showth...=172529&page=3

Just trying to warn you guys, I'd be careful about any further discussion of the toys which shall not be named.

Anyways,

There is a big pool of awesome Japanese Transformers that will never be released over here. It would definitely be cool to see them take Classics in their own direction, kind of like they did with Alternators.

Victory Leo + Star Saber would be awesome.

True that! I also wanted Galvatron as a "weird cannon thingy".

But you have to keep in mind that Universe Classics it's not the same as Classics. And Hasbro decided to keep this subline with "realistic" alt modes in preparation for next movie's line.

-airfox

I actually don't mind the tank design modification as much as I mind the small size of it. But I do agree - Classics 2.0 should more or less stick to designs that clearly harken back to the originals. Even where Powergilde is concerned, fine, make him bigger & update his design, but do NOT recolor him white. That was a colossal mistake imo.

I think the other major flub with Universe is the character selection they're (re)launching the line with. Regardless of how cool the designs *might* be, I still don't think Powerglide, a non-combining Onslaught or Octane make as much sense as "Classics follow-up characters" compared to Suntreaker & Prowl. And look who some of the Wave 2 guys are: a non-combining Silverbolt and teeny weeny tank mode Galvatron. That's a whole lot of no rhyme nor reason imo - and is exactly why my excitement for this new line went out the window and got replaced by Animated hype instead.

If they're not careful and end up doing with Universe what they did with Alternators - releasing extremely secondary characters, new characters aka no-names and repaints that make NO sense (ala what they did with Devastator and are doing again with Blaster), this is one guy who won't be collecting it.

Agreed with Galvatron - the thing I liked the least about him was how SMALL he is. Only benefit of him being a deluxe that I can see is creating an inferiority complex which is fitting for the typically insane Decepticon leader.

As for Powerglide, I'll be curious to see what Takara does - I might have to hold off to see what their plans are with his Henkei version.

Then again, I'm not paying double the price for an Ultra when I have both Universe and Animated on my plate.

This would be a good place to use that Titanium Shockwave mold.

Edit:
Or rather, the Classics/Universe line would be. I forgot what thread I was reading there for a minute. Whoops.

Hmmmm, I was hoping for a Cliffjumper with a new head, but these 2 are good also.


Now I can't wait to see pics of them and then decide which versions I like more.

Yeah, it seems like everybody who was able to fork over bucketloads of cash to get the Botcon Seekers gets all pissy when someone suggests that these toys some day be made available to the "common man." If you ask me, the fact that they've had them for 2 years before we've been able to even speculate about getting some for us ought to be enough consolation prize for them. (They'd be singing our tune if they weren't fortunate enough to have them.)

Anyway, who cares...this should be a place to voice what you want, no matter how many times others have said it. After all, how else do we let Takara and Hasbro know?

One thing I do know is that Sunstreaker and Prowl are definitely going to be posed triumphantly on my Classics shelf the very instant I can get either the Hasbro or Takara version in my hot little hands. And if I can put a Thundercracker next to them, then I'll be all too anxious to send Takara my hard-earned dollars!

i'm amazed at how the engineering that used to get applied for alts and bt's are now in deluxe size figs! i mean, the engineering for these toys are just awesome!!!!

sorry if i sound like a noob, guys, coz i am.


transformers classics are just WoW!

wut?

i expected takatomy releasing their classics due to timely release of universe. yay!

For your first point, I don't really see such a thing hurting FP in the future as Takara will not make a habit out of doing every toy FP does. I don't expect a Dreadwind from them. (and I did mention an anime colored T-cracker already.)

As for your second point, yes the old toolings would be trashed, but the engineering and prototypes of the wings are done and owned by FP. New toolings could be made from those a whole lot easier than having to make new ones.

I am hoping for a classics Thundercracker and Skywarp. I am getting the Takara Starscream and Megatron. Maybe Grimlock and Mirage also anyway I do have the Botcon set but I would like them to match the Takara Starscream. I plan on keeping all that I have and just adding Takara's line to it. Picture below of my Decepticons. I plan on buying Prowl and Sunstreaker both the Hasbro and Takara versions I really like the classic line.

Gotta say I was a little surprised to see the front page news this morning regarding Sunstreaker & Prowl being in the Henkei line. Always loved Sunstreaker so I'll buy both versions without hesitation. I'm sure TakaraTomy's version will be tweaked in some way as others have mentioned.

Repainted Universe 'bots? I too would be enticed to buy a red Powerglide....but knowing me and my buying habits I'm sure I'll jump on all of the Hasbro versions the first time I come across them @ retail. That said, I'll probably end up w/ 2 versions of most of these.

That picture is still amazing.

I dont have a problem with the tank anymore, especially if the decision to make him a tank allowed him to have more poseability than he would if he were a cannon. But a deluxe? I'll be sticking with my Leader sized E. Galvatron which is easy to mod into a cannon, thank you.

I smell something:
1 (Gold?) chromed Optimus/Convoy
1 (Purple) chromed Megatron
1 (Yellow) chromed Bubble Bee
1 (original color) chromed Star scream
1 Purple (chromed) and dark Astrotrain.
1 Blue/Silver Chromed (F1 formula)
1 Silver Chromed Prowl
1 Yellow Chromed SunStreak
1 Clear Plastic (Crystal) Rodimus
1 Crystal Plastic Optimus
1 Dark Optimus
1 Dark Rodimus(Botcon?)

I can't think of all the special verisions here.

You botcon seeker complainers are unbelieveable. I would much rather see Red powerglide and sideswipe and smokescreen prowl or any of the other unreleased figures before botcon seekers.

When people use terms like "the masses" and "the common man" I think you forget there is little to no mass market for those figures except for a severely limited number of vocal collectors that missed the boat. If you are still seeking Botcon seekers, you are hardly the masses or the common man being denied your "rights" You are a collector and the product you want is available through the collector market. The TRUE "Common man" are 5-year old children and they don't know or care that there will never be retail thundercracker classics.

Anywho... I really hope for some chrome on Sunstreaker on his engines.

Let me guess...you already have the figures?

Also, please cite your sources regarding the numbers and viability of the mass market.

Well Takara bringing two more Autobots to only 3 Decepticons. Little out numbered if you ask me.
What figures are listed in Wave 1 for the Hasbro Classics 2.0 line? Right now the only Decepticons are Starscream, Megs, and Astrotrain that are different molds. Right? I would think we need more Decepticons. Do we know if there is a Wave 2? If so who is in that?

Yeah, but a Powerglide that is in scale with other Autobots in robot mode would be even sweeter.

Hasbro has done these market tests and decided against it. Just because they don't give the fandom a written report with all of their reasoning for every marketing decision they make doesn't mean they don't exist and are not true.

Hasbro makes decisions based on business rules and if there was a business case for profit they would have done it.

And me having the figures doesn't make you any more the "common man" because the common man in the Hasbro toy market is 5-year old kids. You are a fringe collector so your opinion means close to nothing and has very very very little impact on Hasbro's Mass retail market releases. If the figure sales cannot appeal to a mass market of 5-year olds, it won't happen. And having 6 of the same mold in different colors of a non-show, unknown character on a mediocre selling toy line is not a recipe for success.

Thundercracker doesn't have a fanbase in japan... So the only way you will see him in Japan is as a chase or exclusive that will be harder to get than Botcon seekers.

This has all been discussed to death before. And the only reason you won't accept reality because you want companies like Hasbro and Takara to lose money so you, a fringe collector, no where close to the primary market, can have a valuble item for retail price.

If they're not going to "accept reality" or whatever, then why do you feel the need to badger them every time its brought up?
Wouldn't it just be easier to ignore them, and let them live in this fantasy land that they refuse to leave, or are you just trying to be a troll? If the staff doesn't like people bringing it up at the drop of the hat, they'll step in. If you're that bothered by it, maybe you could PM the staff.
It seems like you have even more of an agenda than they do at this point, and while I get a little annoyed at how often the topic gets brought up, I'm even more annoyed by the people who feel it's their god-given duty in life to jump down their throats at the very mention of it.

You are my new hero.

How do you know Takara will not make a habit of it?

What if Takara "pleases" the fan community and releases in Henkei not only T-cracker and the other seekers, but Jazz out of Cyb Crosswise, Ironhide/Ratchet out of Energon Tow-Line, etc? If I'm willing to believe that Thundercracker is within the realm of possibilities, then so are the others.

I know you did, which is why I was also saying they could release T-cracker with "classics style wing decorations".

Fair enough. Still, IIRC creating the steel tooling itself is pretty expensive, so I'm not sure how much savings would there be in that scenario.

Please, cite yours.

-airfox

Am I the only person that really likes Powerglide the way he is? An A-10 Warthog in maroon is fine for a 2.99 mini figure, but surely a more military colour scheme is more appropriate for a larger figure in a 'realistic vehicles' line? Also, I think planes should be big and would encourage Hasbro to go more for 'in scale with other figures in vehicle mode'. Personally I'd have swapped Onslaught with Tankor, assuming Onslaught isn't actually part of some completely-unrevealed-despite-it-being-almost-due-for-release combiner team.

-Nick

Encore #11 says hi. Yup, TakTomy would lose lots of money by releasing repaints of Starscream, ahem Thundercracker and Skywarp. Not to mention its never been done before, right?

The "reality" is you don't have the answers either. You really have no idea what is going to be released and what isn't.

So am I late to the game or does the email I just got from BBTS, saying that Dirge is now part of the Henkei releases, the first time it's been confirmed?

"JAPANESE TF CLASSICS: Jetfire / Skyfire and Dirge have just been added
to
the Henkei Classics menu. Each will presumably receive some sort of
chrome paint job upgrade, and be packaged in the cool Japanese boxes.
http://www.bigbadtoystore.com/bbts/m...&category=4165
"

Must be an error, as the listing itself is still Ramjet.

That's what I was thinking, but it's an interesting typo.

Heck of a typo!

I can imagine BBTS newsletter with news of Henkei Thundercracker's release linking to a listing of Skywarp.

-airfox

But I can go by previous example and not constantly demand that Hastak make poor business decisions to appease a statistically insignificant portion of the population. Six of the same mold on the shelves at retail was a mistake then and is a mistake now. It isn't good business. It would be 4 of the same mold now that we see Ramjet exists.

And Encore 11# = Collectors line, Henkei = Mass Market. It makes even *LESS* sense to sell basically two of the same product with the same colorschemes at the same time.

The difference is I don't demand or feel I have "the right" to own any figure and I do not expect companies to make decisions to harm their retail market to please me. I had to pay lots of money for my Astrotrain and Huffer because it is not economically feasible to release them at retail when I know it is possible for them to have released them at retail prices. My 'opinion' on how popular *I* feel the mold would have been is meaningless because Hasbro feels they would not have been successful at retail so they decided against it. If someone makes a Shortround SEASPRAY I better get it while I can instead of 'demanding' a retail release of him.

Why can't they release the rest of my classics seekers though? Don't they see they'd sell like hotcakes?

Way to blow it, Hasbro/Takara.

Who's demanding them to release it? All the posts I have read have been more of the tone of "wow, wouldn't it be great if..." or "gosh, I really wish they would..." Nowhere in this thread is there a "release this NOW dammit" type thread that you referenced. My feeling toward the subject is the former, since as a family man who can't just throw 300 dollars at a hunk of plastic, I'd still like someday to have a piece like this--even if I have to paint it myself.

But since you do wish to go by "precedent," how many of us went and hunted down the Skywarp target exclusive? Apparently that was hot enough to get released.

The tone of your (and others) posts just seems to further bolster my theory: those who own the Botcon Thundercracker are incredibly afraid that other people might some day be able to own the toy they have, and thus all the screaming of bloody murder when someone even suggests (or wishes) it.

Calm down.

Why are you grouping Hasbro and TakTomy together? They are separate companies that cater to different markets. Hasbro products are generally designed for the mass market, whereas TakTomy favors the older collector oriented one.

Some are saying they want TakTomy to release all the botcon seekers, others like myself, just want Thundercracker. I'd agree it is unlikely to see all the botcon seekers released but I don't think it is unreasonable to think that TakTomy would release Thundercracker.

As for Henkei being a mass market line. I'm gonna have to disagree. All the Henkei figures feature paint deco in homage to the G1 line and there is no cartoon, comic(yes, I know a manga is included with the figures) marketing it to children.

This means powerglide will be made. YES!

Wow... so based on posts by nkelsh (and others), all of those who own Botcon Thundercracker are afraid of other people owning it? Even though some Botcon Thundercracker owners have posted in this and other threads that they favor a Henkei release of the toy? Generalizations FTL.

-airfox

Pardon...not all... but perhaps most. Certainly those who post plaintively and jump down the throat of everyone who suggest it.

Apologies, again.

I support a Henkei release of Thundercracker and the others (not necessarily exactly the same as the Botcon versions, though I wouldn't care if they were - and yes, I am a BC-seekers owner) if only for the reason that it would hopefully tone down the recurring thread derailments of people venting their "HOW DARE HASBRO/FP/BOTH!" frustrations.

Oh by the way, I'm pretty sure the subject of this thread is actually about Universe Prowl and Sunstreaker being in the Henkei line - at least that's what the header on this thread seems to say.

I am not against it. If the japanese market does make the decision to do it, I am not going to cry over any of the secondary market repercussions. Personally, I don't trade frequently on the secondary so the outbound value is not a concern to me as I almost only consume.

I just don't think the expectations of fans are reasonable, or the chances that it will happen is high, and I question the wisdom of releasing Classics Seekers at the same time as Encore reissue Seekers with the same paint job because they are both aimed at the collectors market. And if they do re-use the starscream mold in japan, we can fully expect a Skywarp before a Thundercracker which further complicates the whole messy affair. I also see lots of other things that deserve precedence over botcon seekers at the retail market.

Right now, I think repaints of Prowl and Sunstreaker will have much more appeal than Botcon seekers. I would like to see two uses of a mold before we see 6 of the same mold in a line. And Personally I would like to see a Mary Sue like Sunstorm which would probably appeal to more collectors than a TC would as many collectors have TC.

Personally I want them to ditch the crappy LoC mini figs and replace them with G1-inspired scouts. But Of course I am not going to claim that hasbro or Takara is keeping Seaspray and Botcon Huffer and OTFCC Brawn out of the hands of the "common man".

This thread is in gross need of re-railment. Back on-topic, folks.

Just thought of this, but would Prowl have the 'straight' sirens or the 'V' ones?

I really doubt it. So far, all the Japanese classics have just been repaints of their Hasbro counterparts.
Besides, the V shaped light bar was to make it look more like an actual Japanese police car; I can't imagine for the Japanese release of
this figure that they'd want to straighten it out.

I was thinking that the American release had a straight light bar. Perhaps I should go back and look again.

I think what I'm looking forward to with Prowl, aside from having him look quite majestic standing on my shelf next to Prime, is the opportunity for myself to repaint extras of him into other Autobot cars...

Someone mentioned the possibility of Henkei Sunstorm... loving that idea...

Apparently, at one point he was going to have a straight one. In fact, the official pictues that we got from the New York toy Fair are of him with it instead of the angled one, though the evidence since the event has pointed to the actual production version having the angular version (even with the picture of Prowl on the back of the packaging having the straight light-bar on him).

Yes please!

Just let me know when Japanese classics is going to release TC, Ramjet, and Dirge.

And me having the figures doesn't make you any more the "common man" because the common man in the Hasbro toy market is 5-year old kids. You are a fringe collector so your opinion means close to nothing and has very very very little impact on Hasbro's Mass retail market releases. If the figure sales cannot appeal to a mass market of 5-year olds, it won't happen. And having 6 of the same mold in different colors of a non-show, unknown character on a mediocre selling toy line is not a recipe for success.

So, the fans shouldn't have an opinion, then? Hasbro is always correct and nothing should ever be brought to debate? The board would be fairly pointless if this was the case.

Besides, I was under the impression the target audience for Transformers was 8-12 year olds rather than 5-year olds, although this is not particularly pertinent to the topic at hand.

So the only way you will see him in Japan is as a chase or exclusive that will be harder to get than Botcon seekers.

This is nothing but a conjecture, and even if it were true, the exclusive Green G1 Ratchet figure was very difficult to obtain, and was available for $130. The Botcon Thundercracker figure sells loose for $200. I can't see the exclusive being rarer than the Ratchet figure, and $130 MISB would probably be more palatable to many fans.

Heck of a typo!

Not really- if the newsletter's author is not a fan, he may have forgotten that the white one was Ramjet and not Dirge, but knows that all three exist as a result of those busts BBTS was selling a few months ago.

Considering that Hasbro designed these with an eye towards enhancing repaint potential, I'd definitely hold off on something like that until you see which ones they DON'T do themselves. But that's just me.

Are you sure those dates are correct? Because I was about to pre-order them from BBTS, thinking that they'd be here before the universe release. but if that's not going to be the case, then I can save myself $30+ by getting them stateside.