WTF Book Club - 03 - July 27 2010

Discussion in 'WTF @ TFW Transformers Podcast' started by Vangelus, Aug 1, 2010.

  1. cgibsonREX

    cgibsonREX Knight of Cybertron

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    The business with the Fallen is not all that difficult, he was only in the DW comic before the movie. It's not like they took Optimus Prime and said that Prime is the same guy across all realities. From my understanding it seems like everyone took the business with The Fallen and made it harder to understand than what it really is. Yes we know that time flows differently across all realities so whats not to say that he did what he did in the comics and since that reality came to a dead end traveled to the movie-verse and obviously not as strong as he use to be was killed off by movie-Prime. This explanation is a hell of a lot simpler this - Multiversal singularity.

    And as for Alpha Trion being one of The-13, does not change who he is. Yeah he's a God now but so is Vector Prime and he seems normal just like any other bot. What's not to say that for whatever reason he not able to use his God like powers in other realities like Animated and G1. Maybe he chooses to live among his brothers than to place his self above them. And for Shattered Glass, thats not an alternate reality, it's a "negative universe" which everything positive is now negative. So whats not to say that there might be a Unicron and Primus in this universe as well since it works differently from other alternate realities?

    And for WFC being the new catch all for all continuity. I believe once a story is written it's written if something is added to it later cool. But I believe WFC to be it's own thing not interfering with anything that came before out side of the Gods involved with the series. I even get the feeling that WFC is it's own continuity outside of Prime, yes they share the same back story but I feel the games will split onto it's own continuity from the Prime TV series. Which is why some elements are different from the book. The Prime TV series will take it's history from the Exodus book running it's own course and WFC fills it's plot holes with the Exodus book going it's own way. Thats that idea I got when we were told at BotCon that WFC is its own continuity but "take that as you will". The Exodus book is still War for Cybertron so we can't limit WFC to just the game only. WFC (Exodus) can even be envisioned using the design style from Prime.
     
  2. GogDog

    GogDog Logic's wayward son Veteran

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    No, Hasbro said very plainly at SDCC that Prime follows WFC and they are in continuity.
     
  3. prime292

    prime292 Well-Known Member

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    Book Club Crew,
    Been loving the book club. Cant wait for the Drift miniseries, not sure why peeps would hate on this guy and get all worked up. Maybe you guys can help me out...what the hell is a "MarySue"? From what I get folks dislike Drift because he brings to much hawtness to the party but I'm a big fan and am pump about his mini series. I'm enjoying the Iron hide series and am still loving the Wreckers. More of that please. I have not read comics for at least 10 years and the Wreckers got me back in the game.
    Thanks
     
  4. cgibsonREX

    cgibsonREX Knight of Cybertron

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  5. ronin0510

    ronin0510 Well-Known Member

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    The only thing that gets me about the whole WFC and TF: Prime thing is Matt Tieger telling us repeatedly that its the G1 prequel. LOL I just wonder if what he had wanted and what actually came to be, were just two different things according to Hasbro.

    Also doesn't this whole continuity thing make the whole Alternity line like really important. LOL
     
  6. cgibsonREX

    cgibsonREX Knight of Cybertron

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    Thats the point I was trying to make, that the WFC game is it's own thing and so is Prime and that both series pull back story from the WFC book. Hasbro can be so vague sometimes I would not be surprised if my statement is true. But only time will tell LOL!
     
  7. Creaky

    Creaky King of Puppies

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    Love the book clubs, specially since I just got the iphone app. :D  I was particularly keen to hear Vangelus opinions on the Punch/Counterpunch mini-series, and I totally agree. I was, much like Vangelus, a fan of PCP before he became cool. (So to speak.) He, along with Hardhead and an inherited Dragstrip were my first ever transformers, and so take a special place in my heart. I totally agree that PCP could in theory be the basis for some bloody great fiction, but I think his concept is one that works on a lot of levels, and it may prove overwhelming to a writer, because, like vangelus said - he's a spy movie and a psychological thriller, and I think you could even add elements of horror in there too, PCP hasn't had enough fiction for us to be sure where exactly he lies along the path of messed up robots, and I'm interested in whatever IDW do to flesh him out, even if it doesn't fit in with the fanon I developed over the past twenty years of adoring the character based on thirty seconds of cartoon and a toy. :D 

    About Universal Singularities, I'm actually a fan of the idea, but I agree it doesn't really make much sense to go back and retcon characters that have already been made. I think it's a concept that has a crap load of possitbilities (I'm thinking in terms of scale like the Cthullu Mythos, or Warhammer's Chaos Gods) but I think it needs qualifiers that prehaps the nature of their existance is such that they aren't always aware of their greater identity and honestly believe they are simply another resident of their universe, until such time as their task becomes clear. I don't know, I love the concept, but I'm very wary of Hasbro possibly overriding other people's creations... I think perhaps if they imply the concept, and develop it in such as away that it is referenced, perhaps openly at times, but is something that we never get to see as readers/viewers. I dunno. It's a toughie. If they go ahead with it, I just gotta hope they realise that they gotta do it right.



    Wall of text: OVER.
     
  8. Rhinox

    Rhinox We bring surreal to life

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    I just wanted to say thanks for the Book Club. It allows me, a non comic reader, to keep up on the generalities of what is going on in Transformers fiction. I appreciate that.


    In terms of this new continuity origin thing, I think I understand why they're doing this, though I can't say it works well retroactively.


    Has anyone read the old Dragonlance Chronicles books? They were the first books of this series that introduced an entirely new gameworld, yet there were repeated references to historical events and other things that had happened before but weren't written at the time of these books. The writers had sat down before writing the books themselves and made sure there was this history that they could reference and build on for their own story, thus giving it a much more epic feel. I mean, instead of feeling like it's a new world, totally made from scratch and just now being fleshed out, you got a feel that there was history there, that the story was a natural outcropping of that history. It made the whole books feel more epic because they were building them on a solid base that they'd agreed upon rather than just starting to worldbuild in the books themselves.

    I see Hasbro trying to do that with Transformers, moving it from just a toy line with fiction property into true science fiction. One of the best steps they can take to make that move is to solidify a cannon that all future stories can reference and grow from, give new writers that platform from which to spring their stories rather than just expecting another reboot every single year. They're trying to make Transformers more than just another Power Rangers show with toys like it really was during the A/E/C years and I appreciate that.

    Again, this approach doesn't work when you try to shoehorn in on previously established fiction, like Beast Wars, Animated, et al, but going forward, I think it's a great move that should really elevate Transformers fiction from the novelty it kind of is now to a truely serious science fiction universe and given the respect it deserves as such.
     
  9. VaderPrime1

    VaderPrime1 Prepare for termination!

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    After hearing so much good stuff about Last Stand of the Wreckers, I bought the first 2 issues for my iPod. IT'S AMAZING!!! I can't wait to get the rest.

    I don;t entirely agree with the way Hasbro is going about with the continuities. I think I'll only follow that way of thinking from here on out, because everything will be written with that mindset. It doesn't work too well with other story lines that have already been made prior. If they do it well it might go along smoothly... only time will tell.
     
  10. Fit For natalie

    Fit For natalie tfwiki nerd

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    The problem with this is while Hasbro most likely signs off on characters and concepts the movie people can use, Hasbro has no real say on the direction of the production of these movies, because Hasbro does not contribute to the budget. Do you think a family friendly company like Hasbro would approve of the direction the movies have been going in? The sexualised innuendo? The potentially offensive minority, ethnic and foriegner portrayals?

    Consider this - in 2008, IDW and Hasbro announced Transformers: The Thirteen around the same time IDW revealed (then was forced to retract once Bay found out) at SDCC that The Fallen was to be the main villain of Revenge of the Fallen. This book was to be written by Simon Furman and would involve the Thirteen we knew about at the time (Vector Prime, The Fallen).

    As we saw from the prequel comics, novels and stuff based on earlier drafts of ROTF script, the story about the Fallen, how many early Primes there were and how he was brought low on Earth was changed significantly in the final movie. For all we know Orci and Kurtzman's initial treatment that Hasbro saw earlier on was even more different than that.

    What I am saying is, if Hasbro and IDW were planning a big 13 hoopla seemingly based upon their own 13 canon written by the man who created the 13 and The Fallen, all to feed off of The Fallen's movie debut, but they then suddenly backed off, it seems to me that Hasbro, as I believe Brian Goldner has said before, they had no say on the direction of the character or the movie.
     
  11. GWolfv2

    GWolfv2 Deathsaurus - A name you can trust for peace

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    Singularities, like female transformers, I would say just accept it don't analyse it.

    Oh and given Ironhide 4, I think we can say A3 is in fact insane and is in fact a bit of a dick :D 
     
  12. Fit For natalie

    Fit For natalie tfwiki nerd

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    I'm one of those canon-mongers Vangelus made fun of, so I gots to analyse it, if only to decide that we have to rewrite an article (The Fallen) or just leave it alone and make a small note because Hasbro screwed up (Alpha Trion articles).
     
  13. Drift

    Drift Banned

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    New one?
     
  14. Vangelus

    Vangelus Long Live the New Flesh Moderator Content Contributor

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    We only just recorded it tonight, it'll come soon. ;) 
     
  15. Drift

    Drift Banned

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    looking fprward 2 it