Should Bumble get the hate the Movie Op gets? (SPOILERS)

Discussion in 'Transformers Earthspark and Cartoon Discussion' started by bellpeppers, Jul 28, 2013.

  1. Jamocha101

    Jamocha101 Well-Known Member

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    Yes. He should have been much more courteous.
     
  2. updatedude

    updatedude Well-Known Member

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    Others have given their view, and I basically agree.

    I mean, did Bee kill Megatron? Yes. This is war, killing is part of it. They're all murderers.

    But although all's fair in love and war, there are still certain rules. Are these rules arbitrary? Yes. At the end of the day, whoever survives, wins. BUT, these rules decide whether you're a soldier, or a war criminal.

    Fighting and killing on the field is one thing. Using ambush, superior weaponry etc is "acceptable". That's why when Movie Prime fought and killed Decepticons in the forest, or when he was slashing through droves of them in DotM, no one really brings those times up.

    But where Prime Bumblebee killed Megatron during a mission, Movie Optimus executed a prisoner of war, as well as killed someone who was offering a truce. The "give me your face" thing wasn't so much that he killed the Fallen, but that it was a really weird "Bond One Liner" to use, not to mention an unnecessarily gruesome way to kill your opponent.

    Basically, Prime Bee acted like a soldier, while Movie Optimus acted like a war criminal.
     
  3. Wallu

    Wallu The Amazing of Amazing

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    He seems to thin he is a character in Prime. You.. get used to it.
     
  4. DepthWave

    DepthWave Decepticon Storm Trooper.

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    Wallu, you are right- that is quite slim.
     
  5. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP Be strong enough to be gentle

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    I don't see a problem with Bumblebee killing Megatron.

    Which is to say, I don't have a problem with Megatron being killed like that, but it shouldn't have been Bumblebee. The voice thing is THE weakest justification ever, because it's so petty. He didn't even really miss his voice, since he could still communicate just fine with everyone. Why is that somehow equal to a life? Plus, his voice? Seriously? Because that's more important than, say, all the other people Megatron has killed, like Optimus? It was stupid to have Bumblebee kill Megatron, but there were no moral questions. He was entirely justified in killing him, but the reason he did and the fact that it was him was ridiculous.
     
  6. Galvatron II

    Galvatron II I can type whatever here?

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    Well, Bumblebee didn't execute a defenseless prisoner. He didn't murder Megatron, he killed him in the heat of battle.

    Yes, there's a difference.
     
  7. JetFormers

    JetFormers « Ultima Ratio Hecate »

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    I like a non mute BB.
     
  8. Rob

    Rob Prowl Fan

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    No completely different
     
  9. Jamocha101

    Jamocha101 Well-Known Member

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    I fear lingering off topic, but I'm tempted to propose a bit of insight to possibly aid in quelling your agony.

    Consider the following.

    It seems as though it's possible that you had taken Bumblebee's line too literally in assuming that the justification for his homicide was the robbing of his voice (however sadistic ripping out somebody's internal functionaries no matter how inconveniencing it is to the victim is beside the point). While pragmatically you're correct that it would have been a comparatively weak justification that the murder was entirely centered around revenge for forced organ extraction, don't forget that he added the broader, "you will never rob anybody of anything else, ever again." Which ambiguously speaks for the deeper animosity harvested out of contempt for not only what Megatron has taken from Bumblebee, but everybody around him; inevitably referring to the destruction that he had inflicted upon Cybertron.

    Additonally, the spectra potentially widens when all things are considered; the very persona of Megatron's killer relays a broad statement that, and I quote from everybody's favorite Autobot, "the least likely are always the most dangerous." The "bug," who barely comes up to Optimus's hip in height and likely weighs one-fifth of Megatron, whom had endured heartbreaking experiences through out the course of the war that robbed him and any other war-born native of ever seeing their planet in its golden age, had been the one to do in the Big Bad. While it can be interpreted, thereof, as a "typical" underdog-to-wonderdog occurrence, I insist that the aforementioned trope is usually applied to more generic scenarios in which the formerly "New Meat" (i.e., Smokescreen), whom has minimal historic build-up with the villain, is the one to wow everybody with the delivering the blow. Contrast Bumblebee, whom has legitimate "history" with Megatron, which includes, but is not limited to the following:

    1. Megatron has ripped out Bumblebee's voice box.
    2. Megatron has blasted Bumblebee in a similar situation, wherein the latter had jumped in front of Optimus to save him in a battle.
    3. Bumblebee has been in Megatron's head, and vice versa, leading to his being possessed by the latter.
    4. Megatron has nearly killed Bumblebee's best friend.
    5. More fundamentally, Megatron has destroyed the planet that Bumblebee and his fellow Cybertronians once called home.

    Consider number three in particular; in the events of this early season one occurrence, Megatron had downloaded himself into Bumblebee's processor to thereby cease his psychic control and, like a parasite, force his victim to do his bidding. As an unfortunate result, Bumblebee had indirectly been the reason that Megatron was revived and had been alive this entire time in the first place. The immorality of taking over somebody else's body aside, I reiterate in simplest form: it is Bumblebee's fault that Megatron is alive. Inasmuch, the irony of Bumblebee cutting off the life force of the war's main antagonizing figurehead is all the more strengthened. Another irony could be extracted in this scenario when one thinks of the inward torture that is inflicted upon Megatron if ever he were to face the reality of the situation (and perhaps he did, taking his last dying gasps); theoretically, death heeded by Optimus, his main rival whom he quite possibly hates most in life and once had a meaningful friendship with, might have been the only acceptable sentence as far as he was concerned. Inasmuch, he could be tortured by the notion that it hadn't even been his arch nemesis that had done the deed, no. It had been the otherwise diminutive scout whom Megatron had provided minimal regards to. A classic, And I Must Scream, if only he hadn't actually died.

    Speaking of irony, contemplate the notion that the last thing Megatron had heard was the voice of the Autobot that he had forcefully ripped it out of.

    If you would like to think of it more cinematically, many fans attest to the breath of fresh air germinating from the broken chain of Optimus expectantly killing Megatron.

    lol but idk u probly rite

    An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth plus seven times more, buddy. Beside the ambiguity of the fact that Bumblebee's voice was a smidgen of all the things Megatron had actually "taken."
     
  10. kaijuguy19

    kaijuguy19 Keyblade Wielder

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    Bee said "You took my voice. You will never rob anyone of anything again!" which meant that Bee never wanted to see Megatron harm anyone ever again. If you think about it Megatron actually did a lot of things that made Bee ticked off other then his voice like almost killing Raf,being mind controlled,and taking Optimus away when he was Orion so it made some sense that Bee was the one to kill Megs because Megs did a lot of things against Bee to make things personal.

    As for the voice have you ever thought that perhaps Bee doesn't like to talk in beeps and boops? If you recall back in Minus one Bee took offense to that comment that Smokescreen made about him comunicating just fine without a normal voice. That's like telling someone who's mute that does sign language that how come you'd like to talk if you can comunicate with sign language just fine. For all we know Bee may miss talking like a normal person and had to deal with having to talk in beeps and boops for a long time.
     
  11. DepthWave

    DepthWave Decepticon Storm Trooper.

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    If Prime hadn't had demanded the Autobots to supervise the children, they would have never been put in danger.
    And who tried out to reach a mind of another person? Bad Megatron - wanted to get his mind to his own body.

    It's like you see a hostile person under your window, then you through at them a bomb, and then your friends start telling everyone, how bad it was of a hostile person to stand under your window, because the house lacks one of its walls now.

    But we all know that, right? This is what was supposed to be written here.
     
  12. Rob

    Rob Prowl Fan

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    No 2 completely different things
     
  13. kaijuguy19

    kaijuguy19 Keyblade Wielder

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    How do we know that? For all we know Megatron would've still gone after any kind of human near them and he would've still used that bargain tatic in the last episode of season 2.

    They had to find a way to get the information of the virus Optimus had caught at the time how were they supposed to know Megatron was able to follow them?
     
  14. DepthWave

    DepthWave Decepticon Storm Trooper.

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    That was obvious since the first episode.
    Megatron could pick any human and threaten anyone with this. They became "special" because of the Autobots treatment.
    And this is the reason why Megatron had no right to get out of BumbleBee's head to his own?
     
  15. DepthWave

    DepthWave Decepticon Storm Trooper.

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    Megatron offered Bee- Bot a fair bargin, then he was quite a gentle guest with not trying to kill anyone in a dirty way, in which BumbleBee killed him.
    People keep telling that Megatron was deceitful and bad by all means, but his actions for the most part of the show were much more reasonable than the Autobots'.
     
  16. kaijuguy19

    kaijuguy19 Keyblade Wielder

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    The two Vehicons who had escpaed in the first episode would still reported to Megatron about it so I think it's safe to say that Megatron would've still targeted the kids for any other purpose in the end.

    Megatron was a bloodthirsty tyrant who would do anything to get his way by violent means. Would anyone in their right mind would let the one guy who destroyed his homeworld and everyone around him be set free?

    But how do we know that Megatron would keep his end of the bargain? He proved that he didn't keep his end of the bargain in the last episode of Season 2 so what's to say that he won't outright backstab Bee in the end if Bee accepted the offer? This is Megatron we're talking about. Whatever honor and dignaty he had left was gone a long time ago.
     
  17. Autovolt 127

    Autovolt 127 Get In The Titan, Prime!

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    Hell no. Bumblebee grew a pair and got awesome in my books. I'm just glad I finally have a Bumblebee i can like again (even if it was just this one episode)
     
  18. UltraPrimus56

    UltraPrimus56 In the ruins of paradise

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  19. UltraPrimus56

    UltraPrimus56 In the ruins of paradise

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    I like this man.
     
  20. AMG

    AMG Old School

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    No he shouldn't (but TFP Bumblebee is the worst version of the character ever).