I know it's a little unfair since we just started TFP S2 but I'd like to see how TFP rates to BW so far.

I grew up with G1 but after looking back at the stories, it doesn't make sense and doesn't hold my attention as well as Beast wars does. I say that so no one thingks, I'm a new comer, or trhat i'm stuck on only G1 as the best.
To me BW was a more complete and consistant story line once you get into season 2and 3 so it's considered my favorite searies over all.

TFP is gaining momentum. Due to the advancements in technology, the look is better. The fight scenes and action scenes are more intense, dynamic, and expressive. however, it has it's opportunities when it comes to over all plot.

Comparing BW S1 to TFP S1, I think TFP wins but seasons 2 and 3 of BW blew me out of the waters and only time will tell if TFP cant top it.

Right now TFP is winning me over BW but hasn't completely taken the cake. How do the rest of you guys feel?

 

Beast Wars has a better story-arc (thus far), but I like that Transformers in Prime don't lose their teeth or have rubber duckies. That's the only thing that used to bug me about BW.

 

It's still too soon for me. I might be ready to say after season two of Prime which series I like more. I do really love Prime, I'll say that much for now. However, I did really love Beast Wars as well.

 

I am not going to say that I like one over the other, but I am enjoying Prime just as much as I enjoyed Beast Wars.

I think Season 1 of Prime had a lot of filler episodes, while the writers got used to writing for television, it was a learning experience for them. Season 2 will be where we begin to see the fruits of their labor. So far they're doing great!

 

As of now, I think Beast Wars was a more solid series. Prime is barely getting anywhere. Some of the episodes are fun but there's no overarching story or a balance of well-developed characters.

 

I think one major advantage that Beast Wars had over Prime that I can't seem changing is that prime takes itself very seriously. Sure, there is humour in prime, but the style doesn't lend itself to variety. This means episodes like "Coming of the Fuzors" are simply not possible, as the western motif only works if you allow for parody. Personally, I found the western motif to have been done spectacularly, and it was elements such of this that helped make the story behind Beast Wars exciting.

Prime has plenty of potential, but due to the style it has established is has a lot less flexibility. Although this doesn't count Prime out, I think it does make it more of a challenge for them to full out beat Beast Wars.

Further, by this time in Beast Wars, while still keeping much of the humour, managed to up the stakes incredibly. Prime appears to be afraid of raising the stakes and keeping them raised. Any time something of significance happens, it unhappens too quickly. If they have something planned to fix this, then Prime once again has the potential to beat Beast Wars.

I'm by no means discounting Prime, but I'm really not super hopeful at this point that it will succeed in the very difficult task of replacing Beast Wars as my top series. I will still however watch Prime and enjoy it.

 

i think season one of BW had a fair amount of filler too - or at least episodes that occured that didnt overtly affect the major plot ark--- season 2 and 3 are when the show really grew into its' own. I think right now Prime has a lot of seeded potential, both in character development and significant plot arks. Mech, Dreadwing, Starscream

Spoiler

controlling insecticons?

, Jack's coming of age, bumblebee's voice, Ratchet's

Spoiler

"demons"

-- and that is only a sample of what we've seen in season one and Orion Pax 3pt., and the teaser lines of the next 4 episodes. I think when you look back on Beast Wars where it was sitting after the opening of season 2, it really is just a matter of opinion which is/was/will be better--- cause both shows had a lot of good things going on.

Personally i think i like Prime better cause it is more mature and realistic--- we don't have characters like waspinator who gets blown in little pieces almost every episode and return without a dent like in a Looney Tunes cartoon.

well i appreciate BW downright silliness sometimes - i really appreciate that Prime is making a concerted effort to make it more realistic and serious (and in so doing really mature the franchise, goes hand in hand with the whole aligned continuity thing---- which IMO isnt necesarily about perfect, error-free plot development from book to game to cartoon, but more about making the characterization and themes consistent across media's for the years to come.

I also, for the record, dont feel that Prime's characterization was weak in season 1-- he is a Prime, he can't be swayed by emotion if he is going to perform the job of protecting an entire race, it's part of bearing the Matrix, it dampens your emotionally responses so that you are able to make the hard, strategic decisions that are required of the Autobot leader (while still maintaining a code of ethics at that)- in keeping with the realism of this show, he has been portrayed as a no-nonsense, stoic, leader who is too concerned with managing the war and avoid any further casualities (cliff, almost Raf, innocent humans) to look at funny pictures on the internet. Optimus Primal had a similar characterization to him, though BW was obviously willing to play with the audience more.


also- it just occured to me- but IMO it s a pretty big deal--- BW didnt have any human characters to deal with - definetly is a factor in terms how the show is structured and written

 

Let's see, Beast Wars, a show with a developed and engaging over-arching plot with developed characters that are almost all genuinely likable and have amazingly realistic interactions...

...Or Prime, a boring, standard show with a plot that seems deathly afraid of anything resembling evolution that hits the reset button at every opportunity with a lopsided cast and largely terrible character interactions?

Beast Wars all the way. It's Optimus and Megatron had a real, engaging dynamic and relationship that wasn't told through flashbacks and narration. Near the end of Season 1 Megatron approached Optimus with a truce, and their fianl lines, as small as they were, showed a more intersting dynamic than anything betweeen Prime Megatron and Optimus. With one simple exchange we saw that Megatron could read Optimus Primal like a book, and Primal knew that. No such dynamic exists in Prime. We've been told that a dynamic like that existed at one point, but we're never shown it. That's where Prime ultimately falls flat. It tells so much and shows so little.

And while we're at it, the aliens plot was also exceedingly well built up. There were the overt signs, but there were subtle but focused-on hints all throughout, like there being a second moon to begin with, but also Rhinox deducing there was an anomaly with it's mass, indicating it was not all it seemed to be. Prime's plot is Unicron being Earth, which is ridiculous for a few reasons. Unicron sin't even established as a physical, real entity until the very end when the never-before-heard-of "prophecy" is introduced with three eps left. Dark Energon, which is supposedly his will in physical form, sure as shit doesn't act like it. It's never shown to have come from Earth before the final ep. In fact, that just makes Megatron finding it in deep space a major plot hole. How did it get into deep space? And to make matetrs worse Unicron is dealt with almost immediately with no signs that he could return. With the aliens they knew they weren't beating them, merely destroying their machine. The aliens never even stuck around to watch, so you knew for certain they weren't gone.

Just compare the first season finales. BW Season 1's finale changed EVERYTHING. Characters had changed physically and mentally, the world had changed, the story moved forward. Prime has reverted literally right back to where it was. Nobody's any different, the story is the exact same "Megatron has some vague plan that may or may not come to pass any time soon." Optimus Primal's character changed after he, well, died. He was a lot less laid-back, he took fewer risks. Dying left an impact on him. Prime Optimus literally does not recall a single thing about any of Season 2 so far. The character has not learned anything from this experience tehy built up as so epic and important. That's just shit writing.

Now bear in mind Prime is not awful at all, just extremely flawed compared to even the not perfect Beast Wars. Beast Wars first four episodes really weren't good. They established characters and the setting decently, but it was clear they weren't sure where everyone was going to fit in. That was resolved almost instantly, however, because the writers saw what they'd made and figured out the logical progression. Prime is almost backwards, starting out extremely strong with characters that seemed by and large already in place, but then devolved as the characters soon became one-track personalities and the story became too muddled and too busy referencing what had happened before to be concerned with the now. So much of the crucial story elements are told in concept art flashbacks and narration. That is not good story telling. We want to see the history, not have someone read it to us.

You mean how Prime is almost entirely devoid of humour? Beast Wars knew it was a cartoon and embraced it. Itw as a show for kids, and kids can accept the heavy stuff, but it also knew it could get away with being silly and lighthearted in a total tounge-in-cheek way. Prime's only humour is bad one-liners (that are often repeated, sucking any actual humour out by over-analyising it. See: "I NEEDED THAT") or situatonal "gags" that are dwelled on far too long. (Bulkhead's girly scream in Scraplets. Initially funny, but when you spend a full minute on it teh joke becomes tired and annoying) Plus, Beast Wars handled it's slapstick humour in a way that felt totally acceptable with the subject matter. BW is literally the only show I've ever seen to pull off a fart joke episode followed by a tragic animal death episode and with no noticable shift in mood. I'd like to see Prime do that. Oh, but it won't, because Prime can't risk having fun.

If Beast Wars is the exciting, fun-loving, hard working life of the party who treats all his friends with respect and lives life to the fullest, Prime is the dull, secluded hipster who tries his best but only prefers to interact with only his most like-minded friends and complains about stuff being too mainstream, but nonetheless acts polite and has a few new and interesting ideas, even if he doesn't have a lot of faith in them. Both are great people and are great to talk to, but after a while Prime starts to bring you down and you see Beast Wars pull up in his classic mustang asking if anyone else wants to go check out that new water park after work and you politely bid Prime a good day before trying not to run to the door.

 

If we're talking about in terms of season 1 then yes Beast Wars wins but Prime still has a long way to go before it can be fair to judge them as complete series. For all we know Prime may beat Beast Wars one day so I'd say let Prime finish ut's run first before compairing it to Beast Wars.

If people still want to then the logical route to go with is to compiar their first seasons.

 

That's what I've done. Specifically comparing JUST Season 1 and Aftermath/Coming of the Fuzors to Prime's Season 1 and Orion Pax three-parter, Beast Wars wins. I felt super excited after the resolution to Season 1 of Beast Wars. We had new characters, new setting, things had changed, new plots were already starting. Prime just made me angry since we are literally back to square one. No immediate new developements, no visible lasting impact on any characters. (least of all Optimus himself who's oblivious to it all)

 

Um, hmmmm, uhhhhhhhh. Hmmf. I refuse to choose.

 

Beast Wars >> Prime

 

See I think that I actually prefer the first 26 episodes of Prime to the first season of Beast Wars. But the 26 episodes of Beast Wars that followed (seasons two and three) were two of the best seasons of any cartoon I've ever watched. So I'm waiting to see if Prime's following seasons will end up anywhere close to Beast Wars. However, given how much I loved those two seasons of Beast Wars, I doubt that Prime could possibly match them.

 

Like I said, Prime flew out of the starting gates like a champ while Beast Wars sort of opted for a slower, but acceptable brisk pace, prefering to take it's time at first and get it's footing before going into full stride. Which I think is why Prime seems to be slowing down after the first leg of the race. Now they're matching speed and Beast wars pulls ahead, still energized while Prime tries it's hardest to keep up but trips and gets delayed even further while Beast Wars rockets ahead. It's still anyone's race but Beast Wars has a clear lead. At this point it seems the best Prime can hope for is a close second or tie.

 

Who knows? Perhaps Prime can suprise us and even beat Beast Wars ont eh #1 list! Like I said if we give Prime time to catch up it may bring us something awsome! Animated was able to improve itself overt ime too the same may happen for Prime!

 

It could, but this is not a comparrison of "if" Prime gets better later, it's a comparrison so far.

For everytime one brings up the possibility to get better, they also inadvertently bring up the possibility to get worse.

 

I know that.

 

I think the mere fact Prime gets compared to Beast Wars so often is points in it's favour. You never saw the UT or RID seriously compared to Beast Wars. Not even the movies. With the exception of Animated there hasn't been a noteworthy subject for comparrison.

 

Maybe we can try to make a comparison of Beast Wars and Animated. They are both considered to be the best TF shows out there and thye both finished thier runs. It would make an intresting thread and topic.