You mean the eaxct same proccess we were told of countless times in the Almanac and at Botcon interviews and at Eric's interview to this very site? But suddenly became "bullshit" as soon as somebody saw a random fan saying his new desings were ugly even if again the Almanacs showed visual evidence that it wasn't like that at all? I'm 99% sure what he said was complete defensive balloney, things like that just don't magically change, specially not after all the dated concept art, hasbro interviews and even early completely different sketches by Derrick himself we saw.
Well "Joe vs" and that show about the Mere Cats aren't bad but I have to agree. Their line up sucks! They've got G1 TF and G.I.Joe airing at 12am while "Honey I shrunk the kids" airs for like 2 hrs every day???! I thought the whole point of this venture was to re-air their old releases, get a buzz and then create new versions...that don't steal from shows with Mr. T in them. I guarantee that most people would check in to watch classic shows like Inhumaniods, Jem and Visionary's over any of the crap they currently show in the prime time spot now. How far ahead did they think this through? I mean old Batman shows...? .....Oh well, Prime is mediocre at best and the New G.I......Ateam travesty can do things I wont say in church. So if Hub folds then so be it. They had all the potential in the world and yet folded in the forth quarter like a athletes do. Cut your losses Hasbro and give us the direct to video G1 Transformer and G.I.joe movies like we've been asking for for years!!!! DUH!
Wow, I get a couple of hours of sleep and this whole thing blows up and way out of proportion. I've read the SEC report and also did some digging through my sources (I know the guys working on the loan). Notwithstanding what Deadline reports this financing/share repurchase has NOTHING to do with the Hub's ratings. I'll cite to publicly available sources where possible (where there is no source, you're going to have to trust me). Discovery is issuing $500 million of notes under an indenture it entered into in 2009. In 2009, Discovery issued $500 million of notes and used the proceeds to repay existing indebtedness. See: http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1437107/000095012309036598/0000950123-09-036598-index.htmWhat Discovery was free at any time to issue more notes under the Indenture, but didn't need to/want to at the time. In December 2010, (which is BEFORE any quality Hub ratings were available), Discovery announced it was repurchasing $500 million of Class C common stock. Discovery made clear in December 2010 that it would be issuing these Notes in order to finance the purchase price. See: Investor Relations : Discovery Corporation : Investor Relations News Release As is typical in large corporate transactions, there is a large window of time between when the deal is announced and when the notes are priced and ready to be sold to the public. The notes were priced on June 13, and there was a corresponding SEC filing. EDGAR Filing Documents for 0001193125-11-163883 That's the end of the real story. Moreover, Discovery as a network is doing fine. The company had $453 million of cash at March 31, 2011, and $1 billion available under an undrawn revolving credit facility that doesn't mature until 2013. Analysts, the guys who look at these things for a living, suspect that Discovery will have free cash flow of over $700 million annually. Fitch Rates Discovery's Proposed Note Offering 'BBB' - pymnts.com In English, then, Discovery has cash and can pay its debts and the financing won't affect anything. TL/DR: Nothing to see here. Recent filings are NOT related to the Hub or the Hub's performance. The debt relates to a transaction announced in December well before any useful Hub ratings were generated. For those of you wanting a little more color on how the Hub got pulled into this, it's really kind of simple. The notes being issued are senior secured notes. This means that in order to get the financing, Discovery has to pledge assets. Discovery's key assets are its television networks (as a technical matter, each network is run out of its own subsidiary, so the asset is the shares in the subsidiary). As a matter of corporate finance, the value of a company's equity is equal to the value of all its assets minus the value of all it's liabilities (I know this is oversimplified, but trust me it works this way). People buying these new Notes are going to want to know that the assets being pledged are worth enough to support the debt if this whole thing tanks. As such, the purchasers are looking at the worth of each network, including the Hub. Because the Hub is part of the security for the notes, the creditors have an incentive to drive the price down (the lower/more conservative the price of the asset, the more security they can take). One obvious way to offset a potentially lower value for a subsidiary is to lower the sub's liabilities. The largest liability that the Hub has it the licensing fees it pays to air content. Here, Discovery has a bit of an advantage. Hasbro owns some of the content being aired (and therefore controls the amount of the licensing fees). The Hub just happens to be a joint venture between Discovery and (wait for it) Hasbro. So in order to ensure that the Hub's value is maximized for this financing, Discovery likely went to their partner and said "Hey, can you cut us a break on these fees for a little while?" Hasbro, being the good guys they are, clearly said yes. This, too, was likely in the works since December. TM/DR: The changes to licensing fees are not performance related and are, instead, related to making sure the Hub's value as collateral is high. At bottom, this is an interesting deal for those of us in the corporate financing space, but isn't reflective of the Hub's performance and doesn't say anything about whether the network will be here tomorrow. Everyone can, hopefully, breathe easier (at least until there is an announcement that Discovery can't make an interest payment).
I don't think it was defensive baloney at all. And I also don't think that the process is any different from what we've been told either. With your 'evidence' that there are many sketches in the Almanacs of characters looking different from the final versions, you simply seemed to imply that every sketch, every revision, went through an approval process by Hasbro, and judging by the many different sketches per character in the Almanac, surely that must mean the man failed to pass the approval rounds alot of times That's bullshit. -Alot of sketches and mockups (like the line of Prowls, going from G1 colorscheme to black/gold) can come from one single round of concepting, just showing different options to pick. -Alot of the material shown probably wasn't even meant to be shown for approval by Hasbro, just own sketches and concepts to get to the final image to show. -Any creative product goes through a couple of rounds to set the style and define the characters. Just because there's a pre-final image of Prime in the book doesn't mean Hasbro did not approve that at that time, and that it somehow wasn't fit for what was needed at that time. -Eric and Derrick going back an forth working on a character, something both guys have talked about before, is NOT a case of Derrick creating a design and Hasbro changing it because it sucks. It's exactly what they said it is: two guys sketching until they come to a final version they both agree upon, and THEN it's off for approval. Not saying there haven't been characters that had to go back to the drawing board. Not saying there haven't been characters that were improved by (for example) Eric Siebenaler. Not sure what you do for a living, but I just have this feeling you are not familiar with this type of work process at all, which makes you jump to entirely wrong conclusions. I completely understand that you just don't like the post-Animated/Almanac designs Wyatt has cooked up, but even then you are wrong in your conclusions, because some of the designs from Almanac 2 were created after Animated ended, and without Hasbro's approval. It's also silly that somebody is applying that a person doesn't know what he's doing and needs Hasbro's help with everything, when the guy was hired because all parties involved liked what he was doing. Oh, and he was art director and lead character designer, but I guess that means jack shit nowadays. You definitely have your moments when you are totally right on a subject, I've seen you bring good arguments to the table in some discussions, but this is not one of those times. You're flat-out wrong, proven wrong, and worst of all, you just won't admit it. Which makes it a bit more sad that you're saying "TFW is just a mine for people that don't understand anything about anything but still feel the need to comment", because that's exactly what you are doing in this case. Sorry that all this doesn't have anything to do with the topic at hand, but your comment just asked for the kind of reply I gave you. You're cool, but stop talking shit.
Ignore that.... I aggree with your last comment about TF Prime. But I'm willing to compromise. If Hasbro is listening you need to give us a show or some direct to video movies that are true to G1 lore with little to no contact with annoying humans, that way Bayformer/TFPrime haters wont complain so much. .....In fact those other outlets wont even be an after thought for me.
I'm not that much surprised, since the channel is on a premium package for some cable companies. Hell, I'm lucky to even get the Hub with WOW! Cable. But I'm sure other channels had low ratings in their first few years when they started up, so hopefully the Hub will do better in the near future.
You know, maybe The Hub would do better if it were on basic/extended Cable instead of premium packages. I can barely afford the cable I already have, so getting the premium package is out of the question like it probably is for many Americans these days. Not to mention, since they are running animated shows targeted towards kids and geared towards their product lines, perhaps it would be more beneficial for Hasbro & Discovery Communications to consider the market revenue that would be generated for a more mass exposure of said product lines.
Wow maybe this means that prices should start going DOWN on everything instead of up so people can afford things that they NEED and WANT. Maybe GAS should go down so it doesn't cost and arm and a leg to get to somewhere you want to go. This is economy sucks and it is only getting worse.
the best bet is to put adds on other network that this its a new network like cartoonetwork all the nick channels. IT IS THE FUTURE OF ALL TRANSFORMERS SHOWS FROM NOW TILL THE END! we as Fans of the TF universe we should tell people about the hub and watch it!
Netflix is available for free on all three game consoles if you've already got a subscription, and I'm pretty sure you can view Hulu on all of them as well. No need for a computer, you can still sit on your nice comfy sofa and watch it all without paying for a premium cable package.
I for one would like to thank you for this wholly informative post. While I may not understand all of it, I got out of it what I needed to, which is; these filings really shouldn't mean anything to any of us, and don't reflect on the Hub's performance in the slightest.
Dan vs. THE HUB!!!!! *shakes fists angrily and stares into the sky* Anyways, yeah, I don't think we should worry. If Prime gets cancelled, it gets cancelled, but Hasbro has declared their intentions to keep Prime alive for a while, so they'll at least finish off the season before ending the network if they can't get another major player to pick Prime up.
I second this. This needs to be somehow summarized on the frontpage, if only to quiet some of the alarmists. This might have been addressed earlier in the thread, too, but how do the Hub's ratings compare to what Discovery Kids was pulling in?
My cable is with comcast and it s for all three,internet,cable,phone the bill is around 145 a month and i have the Hub. Me and my lil girl watch i hope the this doesnt stop the Hub
It's really too bad Hasbro hasn't put out any toys the HUB is showing. Sales from toys advertised would put things in to perspective.
I dont know anything about TV ratings or anything like that, so I'm not gonna pretend. But right this minute, The Hub is showing Fraggle Rock. To be followed by MIB: The Series, Batman Beyond, a few game shows, then Honey I Shrunk the Kids. This is a premium cable channel?? If you wanna go a little later, we have back to back episodes of Family Ties, Happy Days, and Laverne and Shirley. Transformers Prime and My Little Pony are scattered in there at some point. And they "hiatis" GI Joe Renegades, a show I was looking forward to them developing a little better and moving them past the "A-Team" concept in further seasons. They seem committed to TF Prime (a show I dont really watch. I simply cannot get past how annoying those children are), which is good for those who watch it, but so many of their other programming choices leave me puzzled. I dont know that many kids today who rush home from school and jump in front of the tv to watch Men in Black: The series. GI Joe and Transformers are big names for Hasbro, but they run the 80s cartoon at midnight?? I just dont get it...
I used to have Directv where I used to live and The Hub came with our package, but I now have standard cable (Nickelodeon, Tbs, CN, etc.). I rely on Youtube to view the new episodes. In my opinion, they should push for their channel to get into the basic cable package of most, if not all cable companies and get more shows that appeal to a greater demographic.
