So though I don't think the writers of TF2 have put out out any thing spectacular their other efforts seam much more organized and put together. Does anybody have links or copies of original / unedited scripts or treatments for either movie. I am curious to see how element like the twins and jolt or dealt with before the final cut. Bay stated much of the humor was made up in the recording sessions so what were the twins originally written as? Also I am very curious to see what was written before the writers strike and what wasn't. I have a very strong feeling that the lack of structure in the second and third acts has alot to do with the writers having to include things because bay had already begun preproduction on them.
i doubt that it has to do with the writers trying to work with what bay allready did, the writers just suck...what movies have the writers done that have been any good?
I'm not saying the movies they have done are good but even star trek has basics things like character development, and a general plot, this movie has even more issues then the first one and i'm curious if their was ever a good story in there.
From most accounts, the writers developed a small 30 oage script treatment before the writers strike so Bay could start previsualisation. sometime during the strike this 30 page treatment got expanded to 60 pages reflecting a lot of things Bay wanted in. so the writers came back from the strike and fleshed out the 60 page script treatment. Look, this is a $200 million dollar movie. Its extreamly rare for anything at this budgetary scale to be anything but a collaborative effort. You can't really blame one person for the story when they all brainstormed on it together. This wasn't some script sitting around the film studio offices waiting to get made. This (and Star trek) were film studios holding an intellectual property, and wanting a film to be made for it. The writers are hired to write the script to sepc after some story brainstorming...as in here is the basic plot, here are the characters, here is what we want of the characters personality...get to it. Even then new script drafts may be needed, and this all goes back and forth sometimes even while the film is shooting. But for the most part writers (especialy hired ones) typicaly have little power once the film starts shooting.
the problem is the writers dont consider TFs as serious material to write about. furman should have been the writer imo
Orci and Kurtzman wrote the rebooted Star Trek, which to my surprise, was much better than I expected. Then again, they didn't have Bay as director. And considering the ending to the movie, I didn't feel that Prime's ending speech (as in the 1st) and the loss of "Emperor Palpatine/Fallen" didn't leave any real room to do a 3rd TF film. I mean financially, they could, but I felt this film kinda prevented itself from doing a third film storywise.
Well they didnt need a story for the sequel why would they need it for the third, I'm kidding, kinda. There is still plenty left over to do another movie. You have missing seekers, Decepticons all over the planet, a missing matrix, the hatchlings. plenty of story fodder.
star trek was pretty good, i'll give you that, but im not a star trek fan, and from what i understand star trek fans hated the movie...
We know that Springer was originally in the film, and Jolt wasn't. It's highly unlikely that the characters we're swapped as such, since Springers role wouldn't have fit Jolts (even though he barely had one). (i'm dying to see the unreleased concept art for him) My guess for the cut of Springer is that 1, there was already one flying Autobot (Jetfire) and two, he would've been too militaristic for the current Autobots (again, all cars or in case of Jetfire, a spy plane, not an attack one) I believe from *very* early on, the idea of the twins had been Sideswipe/Sunstreaker - when the Stingray was offered to Bay, and twins we're the Beat/Trax - Sideswipe suited the Stingray more, and Bay wanted more 'kid/audience friendly' twins - so the idea was swapped from SS/SS to Skids/Mudflap - new characters that don't have any relevance to prior incarnations. Arcee too, was no doubtedly reduced is size of character - since what we see of her in the film, had no time to show her combined form, I assume she did have a larger role at least in some point of the film which was ultimately dropped due to Bay not liking her. Soundwave too, may have at one point been considered to come to earth, but dropped (again, could've been Bay's decision). We did see concept artwork of a alt mode for him. Orci had also stated that he'd written in a scene with Cullen driving Prime as a hologram, considered having the TF's speak in vehicle mode and explain what happened with Barricade - yet none of this happened.... All in all, I don't think the writers are entirely blameless, but I would point my finger towards Bay a lot more than I would Orci/Kurtzman. Bay is not someone you could really argue with. I think had they been given a bit more liberty the script would've held together a bit better and characters would've gotten a bit more characterisation. I like certain aspects of his film-making. I do not like his arrogance that he thinks he always knows what's best. The mixed reviews from both fans and critics shows this.
im blaming the writers, bay is the director, yes, but its the writers responsibility to give a good script for the director to work with
No one's to blame... movie was awesome. A great example of a fun, summer action movie based on a bad ass ACTION FIGURE TOY LINE.
Still, on an overall broader level, the movie worked as a piece of cinema. ROTF was a meandering wreck of a movie.
I honestly think there were too many cooks in the kitchen. I think Bay wrote a lot of this crap himself and Orci, Kurtzman and Kruger just had to make Bay's vision plausible. It's unfortunate.
Actually, as a Star Trek fan myself, and sometime reader of the forums, to my mind the latest Trek movie was well received by fans, with the exception of a smaller number of fans who felt that 'their' Trek had been thrown out the window. I find it troubling that I really enjoyed Star Trek and its reboot, yet can't stand the Transformers movies...I guess you could say the difference is Bay.
No, there are plenty of problems with the ST script, but as with TF1, the director was able to hide or at least distract from the flaws. And last TF, Speilerg was likely looking over Mr. Bay's shoulder. This time out, they literally started shooting without a script. The writer's strike created an already tenuous circumstance for getting this film written, shot and in theaters on schedule. It should be no surprise to anyone that the screenplay wasn't even up to the writer's normal level, and Bay was so successful that he seemed to have free reign to do as he wished.
Like Transformers, there are some fans that won't let go of the past. Most Trek fans enjoyed the new film.
