Excatly.

 

Think about the movies you just mentioned. Now think about how many scenes in each of those films was just human characters or humans in make up effects talking to each other on a film set or talking in front of a green screen? Even in a film with a monster budget like Avatar you have you have scenes where it's just people talking in a room without any special effects going on. It's one of the tricks Hollywood uses to cut down on the budget in the slow parts of the film that every movie needs.

Transformers set off of Earth and with no humans couldn't pull off this budget cutting trick. Every scene with a character in it would have to be a special effects shot. Since Cybertron is nothing like Earth they can't use the old budget cutting trick of a desert or somewhere else standing in for an alien planet.

With the complex CGI models and photo realistic lighting it would be too expensive to make without humans and Earth taking up screen time.

 

...because the TF movies' makers are hesitant to go anywhere where they can't showcase some luscious new expensive sports car going 120 MPH or the Hot Chick Of The Week wearing tight jeans?

Not to mention the fact that "Star Wars" and "Star Trek" are kind of poor examples to be using in terms of depicting an alien world, since, aside from the focus on mainly-human characters (non-Earthlings though they are), most of what passes for alien worlds in those movies that isn't green-screened in is either built on a studio soundstage - Ceti Alpha V, the Genesis Planet; or a location shoot - Tunisia = Tatooine (OT & Prequels), Norway = Hoth, the California Redwoods = Endor; or both - Dodger Stadium = Delta Vega.

Setting the bulk of a TF movie on Cybertron would require a sh**-ton of green-screening - good luck finding a suitable location to substitute, and Primus knows how they'd build sets meant to accommodate characters far larger than any human - because in the end it would probably STILL end up having to somehow involve human actors.

ALTHOUGH...I still think that doing that would be really good fodder for a time-travel reboot of the franchise, but that's beside the point.

 

That part I can actually agree with. And you're right, that's actually one of the reasons I hated the first movie. They had too much focus on the human characters and almost no focus on Transformers. I kept thinking they do know this is suppose to be a TRANSFORMERS movie right? However that's also one of the things I feel the sequels have actually done BETTER than original film.

RotF, DotM, AoE, for all their problems they actually have scenes where ONLY Transformers are talking. No humans what so ever. The first movie, any time there should of been of Transformers, they cut away from it completely to show what the humans were doing. Bumblebee's final confrontation with Barricade for example, that entire fight scene doesn't even exist because they were focused on Sam and Mikala running from Frenzy the whole freaking time. They could of cut back to them every once in a while sure but having the entire scene focused on them was stupid as hell.

I'd also like to point out at this point that the budget for these movies keeps dropping. The sequels don't have anywhere near the budget that the first movie did yet they're able to shoot scenes that are entirely effects where the first movie couldn't. Though they've also managed to save on the budget because the first movie used a mixture of CGI and actual set models. When Bumblebee was being dragged by the tow truck, that was actually a set piece. The frozen Megatron was an actual statue, that was never a CGI rendering. Oh and Scorponok's severed tail when they were examining it on the table, that was a practical effect. That was actually there on the set. For all of the sequels however, they don't have the money to build set pieces like that so everything is entirely CGI.

You're totally right about that as well. However...

...No one ever said the movie would take place on Cybertron. That's a dead planet in this universe so no one would have any reason to ever go there. We could however end up on Quintessa.

We don't actually know what the Quintessons look like in this universe. It would be impossible to create them the way we've seen them in other sources without CGI. But what if they had a more humanoid shape. They could be played by human actors in make up. (With masks to represent the other four faces) CGI would only be needed for the effect of swapping faces and possibly also swapping out actors of similar build to pull off the idea that this is one alien with five faces. That's probably not the best way of doing it but it is a possibility.

The other idea is that Quintessa could be visited by aliens from other worlds. They are sort of like intergalactic salesmen producing products for consumer purchase. This could open the door for other alien species to appear in the movie including some more humanoid aliens which as you said would cut down on their budget.

Also since the planet itself doesn't have to be entirely metal like Cybetron would, we could use locations found on Earth and green screens to create the alien world of Quintessa. They do seem more organic as a race with just a few cybernetic upgrades rather than being entirely mechanical beings.

Yet another reason these movies need to get a reboot with someone who isn't Micheal Bay.

You know what's funny... I actually live fairly close by Endor yet have never actually been there. I do know some people who have camped out in that forest though. I just never been a huge fan of pretending to be homeless and there isn't really anything to see out there. It's just a bunch of trees.

Again, Cybertron is a dead planet. Why does everyone assume off world automatically means Cybertron? There's no reason anyone would ever want to go back there and there are other planets in the Transformers universe besides Cybertron.

As for the larger sets... You're assuming that the human actors would have to scale exactly the same as if they were actually playing human characters. What if the alien race is just as large as the Transformers? Then the sets don't have to be scaled to accommodate characters larger than any human. Optimus would appear smaller next to one of these aliens however Optimus would still be the same size, just the alien would be huge. Of course then if they ever came to Earth they'd have to always be filmed in front of a blue screen and edited into the movie to make a normal human actor seem as big as a Transformer. But that's been done before as well. They've been doing that since before we even had color.

Anyway... the only way we'd be able to do a movie set on Cybertron is with a reboot or a prequel. It might take a few years before technology improves to a point where a fully animated movie can be made that still looks like it's live action. And in order to pull off a movie set entirely on Cybertron it would have to be fully CGI which means animated movie. But no we're not talking about Cybertron right now, we're talking about Quintessa which is far more doable right now.

 

NO animated film that u want like generation 1 not my thing what I like is 30 minutes of cybertron then 30 minutes for the characters background and the battle between whoever

 

Don't forget about the metric ton of product placement we have thrown at us every Transformers film. If they leave Earth then no massive Burger King signs, no Beats Pill, Victoria Secrets, Mountain Dew, Budweiser, or all the Chinese products that receive more screen time than some of the robot characters.

 

This. I am so very very beyond caring about getting a "proper" origin or whatever bullshit fans/nerds tend to want reboots for. Just use what you got and make a good movie with interesting characters.

 

Same, even if they need one. Reboots are honestly not such great things. Just look at spiderman, or robocop, Or even terminator, I guess the new movies could be considered somewhat reboots. And my fear is if we got a Transformers reboot, it would just be someone trying to copy MR.Bay and they would fail even harder then bay does already.

 

While reboots aren't a magical cure all they can be a great tool in the proper hands.

As much as James Bond fans loved the history of the James Bond films it was getting to a point of just too much for new fans and too much of the been there done that to just cast a new Q and crank out new gadgets like it was still the golden age of international spies.

While Godzilla might have been too long on the world's most boring human and his boring family it was still better to just go with a force of nature Godzilla than somehow reform and fix the first American abomination to sully the name of Godzilla.

Nolan was able to do something interesting thing with Batman by not being shackled to the previous Batman films.

As much as I liked the original Planet of the Apes it was too much of mess towards the last films and the Planet of Marky Mark is something best left forgotten when someone said hey what can we do with Planet of the Apes.

If there were never any reboots then no Beast Wars since it was only later on that they decided to connect it to G1.

If the Transformers films had something worth saving it might be different but all we really have is a pile of dead A list Decepticons and a pile of used McGuffins. If they rebooted what would be lost? It's not like they would change Bumblebee's alt mode in a heart beat in this series if another automaker offered a better product placement deal.

 

We would lose new characters. A reboot means bringing back everyone we've already seen.

 

You don't know that. Outside of Prime, 'Bee and Megs a reboot could go with 'bots we haven't even seen yet - Prowl, Sunstreaker, Huffer, Skywarp, Thundercracker, Rumble, etc.

The REAL problem with rebooting, in my honest opinion, is not the risk of losing the existing audience (because I suspect at least 65 percent of them don't give a sh** about anything except Flashing Lights and Pretty Colors) or any kind of absurd pre-determined belief that it'd naturally be more expensive (when really, as cinematic history has proven, a good director would know when and how to work with less)...it's that I don't trust anybody out there presently who Paramount would likely eye to replace Bay in the director's chair to NOT just keep f***ing up, BECAUSE this franchise is deliberately kept at such a low bar for itself.

Even if TF5, 6, or whatever the hell DID crap out at the box office, whoever Paramount slots in to be their New Michael Bay - because that's exactly the type they'd be looking for: one of these flash-&-dash overgrown horny teenagers with no real understanding of WHY something developed a following in the first place (seriously, it's possible to NOT be a fan of something and still "get" why it's still beloved after so many years - and no, name-dropping TFs with little to no dialogue just to kill them off in the movie you introduce them in doesn't count) - would probably just end up dropping the ball again with the second movie.

 

NO no reboot it's stupid leave it the way it is

 

Thank you! I already said this but there's nothing to fix sure there are a lot of complaints but the same holds true for Prime, critically it was a success and even won emmys here it was reviled and considered shit, the movies average four stars on amazon maybe three and half and every film has at least an -A on cinemascore.

each film increases the robot screentime but the fandom refuses to aknowledge it because it's not enough but it will never be enough not until the humans serve no purpose at all, the fandom will always complain the moment we spend any amount of time on the humans.

Every film improves on it's flaws the funny thing is despite the fandom not at all deserving to be listened to they actually do, fans wanted more decepticon time after the first movie we got multiple scenes between megatron starscream and The Fallen but of course it wasn't enough so they failed never mind they bothered to listen it wasn't enough.

The robot screentime wasn't enough in the first movie they listened and gave us the shanghi battle, Sam and Bumblebee in the garage, Optimus and Galloway, Optimus and Sam, Sam and Megatron, Nest disbanding the autobots had lines it still counts, Sam and bumblebee in the junkyard, Mikela and wheelie, and many more all scenes that actually showed the robots as characters but once again it wasn't enough and we got three or four twin scenes that lasted 30 seconds does that really negate everything else they listened.

Dark took it further once again delivering on several robot scenes, A battle on cybertron, Sam and wheelie and brains, Optimus and mearing, Optimus and ratchet on the moon, Megatron in africa, Lazorbeak assassinations, Lazorbeak and Wang, Optimus reviving Sentinel, and Sam and bumblebee on the roof, they were several more and the inappropiate humor was almost entirely removed they listened but fans once again ignore it

Age every single complaint was pretty much acknowledged the movie maintained a serious tone the robots were front and center and even a truly menacing villain. I mean here's just some of the robot scenes, Ratchets death, Optimus awakens, Lockdown and Attinger, Cade repairs Optimus, Autobots reunite, Autobots at the campfire, Brains and Joshua, Bumblebee and stinger, Optimus and Joshua, there are other robot scenes that's not even half of them fans asked for a more complex story age delivered on that having the autobots hunted by the humans who were working with Lockdown a bounty hunter sent by the creators of the transformers, so they could use their raw materials to build their own transformers however they are unknowingly being mainpulated by megatron to build him a body and army we later find out the metal was created when the creators of the transformers caused the dinosaur extinction when they cyberformed the prehistoric earth an event Megatron now reborn as galvatron seeks to repeat, it all goes together every element weaves together you wanted more story they delivered you wanted more on the transformer mythology with each sequel they are delivering but once again it's not enough so everything else they did doesn't matter nope all that matters is the elevator and romeo juliet scene.

They have been listening to you each film they listen and give the fans what they ask for and each time the fandom bitches regardless because it's not exactly how they wanted or it's not enough talk about spoiled if this is how the fandom reacts when they listen maybe they should stop listening (note this is not directed at you AshleyCuadra)

you think they don't care about the fandom then i challenge this think of all the things the fandom asked for with each movie and see just how many they at least tried to give not if they completely succeeded but if they gave it to you or at least tried to and you will see they have been listening and they've gotten jack for it, no doubt they will continue to listen and no doubt they'll still get shit for it start to show some graditude that they listen at all or they might just stop and i wouldn't blame them if they did because a lot of us would really deserve it

I'm sorry if this sounds rude but some things need to be stated and this was something this forum really needed to hear.

 

I'm with you,mates.

 

Well said!      

 

Thank you for the reply like i said i'm not saying the fandom are spoiled in general they're just acting it.

they have done so much for us, and keep delivering yes they make mistakes but you can tell they're giving it their all execution aside name three action movies in the last two years with stories as large as age, with just as many plot points that perfectly weave together,

autobots being hunted, humans building their own transformers, Megatron's return, Lockdown hunting prime, and the creators and the extinction of the dinosaurs, while some are more prominent than others namely the first two everything still ties together and in the end everything can traced back to the creators and the dinosaur extinction

Lockdown works for them, the metal being used to build the human made transformers was left behind by them, the reason the humans are hunting them is because of the metal left behind by them, the alliance between the humans and lockdown is for the seed created by them, the dinosaur extinction was the sole reason the metal was discovered in the first place, Megatron seeks the seed to recreate the same extinction event

everything ties back to the creators all those separate plots all weave together in one whole even the character arcs tie back to the humans hunting them everything ties together six or seven arcs effortlessly weave into one i can't name another movie that did that so easily

Compare that to god any action movie but for comparison sake age of ultron, where basically they rehashed the plot and even structure of the first yes the action was great but the storyline had minimum effort put into it

of course such a statement is hollow without facts, in age of ultron we got, Ultrons attempt to destroy the world, Banner black widow romance, the twins conflicted loyalties, the teams conflict with stark, and the infinity war set up.

there is no denying that is way more basic straightforward and simplistic than age of extinction it's not an ambitious story i mean yeah the action is huge but not the story, and really do any of the character arcs match optimus in my opinion no age of ultron played it safe cap and iron man bicker just like the first movie, widows arc is a romance arc that's easy to pull off, the twins arc is they are loyal to Ultron than they realize he's nuts every arc story and character is basic and simplistic age of extinction is not like that

So Marvel can deliver pretty much the exact same film but bigger and they clearly put their heart into it, transformers can give you a massively ambitious film where optimus loses his faith in humanity (seriously that has never happened before) with multiple plot points that effortlessly connect and it was half assed come on Age of ultron was way more half assed still a good movie but undeniably half assed.

No franchise has the level of ambition to their stories that transformers does they don't always succeed and yes there are some plot holes but when your doing as much as they are you might overlook a few things if guardians had even a plot hole or two in it that would be very shitty writing because there's nothing to keep track of just get the orb and the character interactions yes james gunn did awesome but he didn't have anything to actually keep track of same with the first two avengers anyone and their dog could've wrote those scripts there wasn't a single surprise in any of them for me my predictions were pretty much spot on

I'm sorry i know i'm ranting but i don't like a story with zero effort being rewarded because the characters were quirky and funny because that doesn't excuse the forgettable story and i hate when something tries something ambitious like having five story arcs in one film actually pull it off do something new with a beloved character and then have people say there was no story just because of a half hour battle especially when Marvel did the exact same thing with a final battle where the enemies are no threat the good guys wipe them out and the battle goes on for 30 minutes seriously how is this any different.

I've read fan ideas for sequels and there not anything special just a bunch of fight scenes with a paper thin plot, newsflash just because the robots are the focus doesn't automatically make your plot good but fans seem to really think this and it's simply not true.

the writers are putting effort into it more than most of you would actually because they know or rather have learned that throwing a bunch of robots in doesn't make the story good emotion character development and intriguing reveals do all the scripts fans loved didn't have these, and not all the actual films did either but they're getting there

 

I just don't understand why you guys want elita-1 or rodimus there no elita-1 is dead so choose a different female autobot

 

Thank you Lord Tron, it's funny, newbies on the sight are always the ones who usually let us take a step back and take our heads out of our ass (except for a few)...

 

Reboot or continue with the current mess I think a big problem is going to be that Paramount doesn't seem to make good films any more. Transformers fans, GI Joe fans, Trekkies, it seems like Paramount doesn't know how to make fans happy like other studios can. Even the Jem first trailer seemed to leave more disappointment than excitement for fans.

 

I think Paramount lost its concern for whether or not its movies were good about the time they decided to turn "Friday the 13th" into a franchise. Thank the heavens for Spielberg, Lucas and "Indiana Jones", and Harve Bennett's stewardship over "Star Trek" at the time (and I'm not entirely sure they shouldn't have polished up and made his "Starfleet Academy" movie in place of Abrams'), otherwise they'd have gone all crap 30 years ahead of schedule.