So since Transformers has moved away from Marvel it's developed into its own multiverse which is great.

However unlike Marvel and DC I question whether Transformers capitalizes on the trope of conceptual or abstract beings as well as it could. The Thirteen Primes are now all over the place/a total mess and their roles and roster officially differ per continuity. And from I've seen most people don't care for them. And the same is true of Primus and Unicron. People seem tired of the Primus-Unicron duopoly over cosmic story-telling.

Would you like to see - and not necessarily in religious tone - more fiction dedicated to other cosmic forces or beings? For instance, Unicron and Primus supposedly were created by "The One". And yet we've never had a true appearance of this force outside of dialogue.

The third wheel of the Unicron-Primus conflict is the Chronarchitect aka the Ruler of Time and Space. He's really only had a cameo in a Botcon comic and a shadowy role in a Japanese exclusive anime. He's supposedly just as if not more powerful than his kin yet never gets recognized.

In the original comics there are references, pre-retcon, to Unicron and Primus being the heads of Dark and Light god pantheons. Since the multiversal aspects of Unicron and Primus have themselves been retconned, why not bring back their brothers and flesh out more cosmic forces?

I mean IDW has introduced D-Void who's basically a sentient universe of death, as well as the Guiding Hand as a Primus-headed pantheon. Though all its members are basically analogues for the Thirteen Primes and has been confirmed as much by Ask Vector Prime. On the other hand the little recognized novel by James Roberts, Eugenesis, makes reference to a Dark pantheon of gods recognized by the Quintessons and known as the Pentacore (which I imagine inspired the Guiding Hand in the first place). This pantheon includes Unicron along with Syncorax, Akra, Kryn and Harbinger. Each are apparantly represented by a face on the Quintessons. Which is a neat reference I think to the original bios portraying the Quintessons as Unicron's servants.

I know a lot of people are tired of quasi-religious aspects in Transformers, the concept of the Thirteen Primes and the over-reliance on the Unicron-Primus mythos. Instead of abandoning the longstanding Unicron-Primus mythos for a purely secular Cybertronian tale would it be refreshing to expand it with newer abstract beings?

I see the Marvel cosmics like the Living Tribunal, Eternity, Death, Infinity, Oblivion and Galactus. I see the DC cosmics like the Anti-Monitor, Nekron, Parallax and Ion. While I'm tired of just Unicron and Primus in Transformers I'd like to see a more diverse cosmic club so to speak.

 

I don't think it's necessary in Transformers. I do not enjoy the idea of Unicron and Primus being cosmic gods causing the births and deaths of universes. But what I like even less is Unicron and Primus being created by a "One".

Don't get me wrong; I'm a big fan of Marvel cosmic, particularly the Starlin-era stuff of the 1970s, along with the wild Ditko stuff of the '60s. And I love Kirby's Fourth World at DC. But, imo, that kind of stuff is not a good fit for Transformers.

 

I'd love a comic series or something just based around the mythological aspects of Transformers. One thing I've always wanted to be expanded upon was It. It is an entity residing in the Matrix that looks like the Death face of Quintessons, and is kind of creepy looking. That's all that has been done with the concept, but I see a lot of potential in it. Where did It come from, and why does It reside in the Matrix?

 

I prefer to keep things grounded in the perspective of the Transformers themselves, religion/spirituality or no. Cosmic stuff is okay every once in a while, but not as a regular thing.

--Moony

 

I like the idea of Unicron and Primus having been transdimensional beings whose battle smashed them into planetary masses within our own universe (basically the revised Furman origin), who then exerted their will through the metallic minerals within those planetoids...thus explaining quite neatly the transformative nature of the species.

But I'll admit that's borderline headcanon.

 

I'd prefer they keep the TRANSFORMERS universe more grounded, without all the god/higher power/thirteen stuff.

 

Because the Quintessons created the Transformers. Forget that latter day theological Unicron/Primus revisionist retcon BS. The origin of the Cybertronians is that the Quints built them, and they attained sentience much later.

 

Hell, we barely understand the nature of the Quintessons. They're as much of a mystery as the Vok.

Hey, what about the Vok? We need more of their stories.

 

Agreed.

 

Same here. i'm one of the people tired of the semi-religious influence in Transformers, and i'm certainly tired of how it keeps getting forced into the fiction.
You talk about refreshing things by introducing new cosmic beings, i think it would be more refreshing to have no cosmic beings at all for once.
And while the IDW continuity seems to play it safe and keeps gods as unproven but certainly not unmentioned, it would be nice if we'd get a TF fiction where even Vector Prime would aknowledge that there is no Unicron or Primus in that universe nor can they influence that universe.

 

Honestly, I wouldn't mind seeing Unicron and Primus take a break outside of the odd mention/reference every now and then, but I would be intrigued at seeing grand cosmic beings (not necessarily gods) in the Transformers universe beyond just Primus and Unicron.

 

Nah, Primacron is the source of all robotic life. Built Unicron, built the Quintessons, built the Primatives...

Or the comics which is, well, where Primus and Unicron come from

My go-to love for any sort of mythology veers towards Elder Scrolls at the best of times (Like, y'know, my sig suggests) so I'm fine with it. I would like something that does explore the Transformers place in the universe a bit more, and agree with something more about the Quintessons and the Vok. Or, heck, even Primacron. Controverse was some fun stuff

 

There's nothing in the cartoon that says or even suggests Primacron built the Quintessons. And it's never really substantiated that he built the Primatives. There's only a vague claim that is never backed up. He certainly didn't build Grimlock. His only definite claim to fame is constructing Unicron.

 

Read Controverse and be enlightened. Noticeable as the only fictional appearance of Tigertrack and Stripes. And of course there's nothing in the cartoon that said that, the cartoon could barely keep what characters were alive and dead straight.

 

I'm kind of yes and no when it comes to the whole Unicron and Primus deal. I don't really see them as gods but I can see them as part of Cybertron's origins. As for the Thirteen I do like the idea of them, I like to think of them reigning of Cybertron as equals but when Megatronus becomes corrupt and tries to overthrow the rest of the Primes and conquer the rest of the planet as his own, the rest of the Thirteen step down and go their own ways, fearing that if they continued to reign over the planet, they would end up succumbing to the same lust for power just as Megatronus did.

 

I prefer keeping Primus and Unicron as the good creative deity and evil destructive deity duo, similar to Zoroastrianism, as the only beings at the cosmic level. As I understand it, part of the fatigue that people have with Transformer gods is a combination of oversaturation, poorly handled concepts like multiversal singularities, and lack of focus on regular characters. New cosmic beings would compound the problems.

I think IDW is on the right track for how to handle religious figures in Transformers. I like the Guiding Hand being avatars of different aspects of Primus and the Thirteen Primes being warrior-leaders who had the equivalent of Greek hero cults grow from them. The fact that there is information creep and a number of different versions of the stories as in-universe explanations for why several million year old robots incorrectly remember their gods is a nice way to handle it. Out-of-universe, it is a neat part of world building to read about the different Transformer beliefs that vary in truth and don't overshadow the more down-to-earth parts of a story.

All that being said, I think cosmic beings in Transformer fiction would be best handled through standalone mini-stories seen as legends in most continuities. Like the science fantasy equivalent of mythological and folkloric stories.

 

i would rather see the origins and early history of the Thirteen, before all the conflict and splitting up across the multiverse. they had to originally come from somewhere right?

 

In my fanfic It is Primus. But this Primus was a military "hardware" cybertronian who organised and lead the revolt against the Quintessons. Later generations mythologised him into the Primus-cult.
But your trail of thought seems interesting.

Agreed. I would love some more hardish scy fy TF fiction with a bit more thought put into the worldbuilding.

So there you have it: its just another retcon. Still think it would make a lot more sense to have Primacron be the last survivor of a people from the planet Primacron who built Unicron with technology bought from the Quintessons.
Call of the primitives was beyond silly: why build upon the sillyness when you can take the interesting bits and make them into something more level.

Its not so much fatigue with the tf gods for my part.
Its a combination of disliking this tendency of forcing U/P and the thirteen on us and the forces that be wanting to include them as an element in every "universe" + not liking the good/evil dichtiomy ascribed to them wich i know is part of the nature of the franchise but i wouldnt detest them so much if they where both a bit more morally ambigius + it would be more interesting if some universes actually fell to Unicron but again it is part of the franchise that a planeteating planet can never be considered as having motives other than being evil (imagine it to be simply motivated by a need to eat to survive even if that means its own destruction in the end) and thus it can never be allowed to succeed.

+ i would just like some more down to earth TF fiction, i know its a wild idea but this franchise has a lot more potential fictionwise than we have seen to date and i feel the IDW verse is a step in the right direction. Theres still lots of fanservice and cliche, but the writing is alot more interesting on the whole than ourvusual fare.

 

Yeah, sorry, but no. I don't accept latter day retcons to G1 made 3 decades after G1 ended. And even if I did, that would be a retcon to Japanese G1 -- which is its own, very different thing -- not the original continuity.

Be enlightened, lol.

No.

 

Controverse makes way more and sense and is way more enlightened and insightful about Transformers mythos than IDW's drek is.

I like the idea of Primacron creating all mechanical life. It's a good idea, and a necessary explanation for why almost ALL alien life seen in TFTM is mechanical.