Zelda Discussion. Just kidding, let's talk Oblivion instead.

Discussion in 'Video Games and Technology' started by Cal, Jun 12, 2011.

  1. Cal

    Cal Well-Known Member

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    I just got through watching the new E3 trailer for Skyward Sword and I can tell you, the more I see of this game, the more I hate it. And this is coming from a hardcore Zelda fan whose all-time favourite game is Majora's Mask!

    The whole problem hinges of the visual style of the game. It's the same controversy as Wind Waker all over again. When WW was first displayed, audiences were taken aback. They felt that the shift from OoT and MM's styles to this cartoonish cel-shaded look was inappropriate. Link himself lacked in detail and seemed poorly designed compared to his forebears. But when the game was released, everyone applauded Wind Waker for being a gorgeous and expressive entry in the series..... except me. I STILL think the game looks like sh*t! The problem is not so much the style itself as the system it's displayed on. The Gamecube is capable of so much more than flat textures and minimal details. (Just look at Resident Evil 4.) I feel the cel-shaded look is more suited to a handheld, and I certainly enjoyed it being used in the Minish Cap, Phantom Hourglass and Spirit Tracks. It's what the style was meant for.

    Now Nintendo's creative blunder has reared its ugly head again. Dissatisfied with the beauty of Twilight Princess, they decided to revamp the look of Skyward Sword with a pseudo-cel-shaded look apparently inspired by impressionist paintings. The result is a game with plasticky textures and garish colours that make it look more like a 3DS game. In fact, when I first saw this game I thought it WAS on the Nintendo 3DS. When I learned that it was to be released on Wii, I was absolutely horrified. Is this the same console that gave us visual treats like Super Mario Galaxy 2 and Metroid Prime 3? If you're going to design graphics that look like the new Kid Icarus game on 3DS, at least have the common sense to release it on the same system. I anticipate Skyward Sword will still receive the same warm welcome as Wind Waker, but you can be sure my opinion of the game won't change. It. Looks. Like. SHI*T! :mad 
     
  2. Brainchild

    Brainchild Dark Flame Master

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    I personally think it looks gorgeous. Opinions, opinions.
    Also, if you're going to judge whether or not a game is any good based on the art style, you're probably going to miss out on some good stuff.
     
  3. Noizemaze

    Noizemaze Ken

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    Your loss.
     
  4. Liege Prime

    Liege Prime Well-Known Member

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    Haha, sorry OP but I don't agree with you either. I think it looks fantastic- it has a nice style without being as cartoony as Wind Waker (nothing against that) but also not being as serious and drab as Twilight Princess. It reminds me of some of the olders SNES titles like Secret of Mana, being colorful but not necessarily clown vomit.

    Also, don't underplay an art style just because it doesn't fill the screen with textures. Wind Waker was better animated then some high budget animated movies. It might not be your preference, but don't try to say it didn't utilize the Gamecube's abilities. Also, the 3DS is practically as powerfull as the Wii, so when you say you thought Skyward Sword looked like a 3DS game, that's not really saying anything.
     
  5. Easterling Capt

    Easterling Capt I am Vern Schillinger

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    well your loss.

    if you dont like it nobody can force you but dont call yourself a hardcore Zelda fan if you diss a game just because you think the graphic is not what you want it to be. A true Zelda fan will play every zelda there is.

    WW is a excellent game and the story is just amazing. Granted I like the adult link the most as he looks in OoT and TP. But I still love and enjoy WW, Phantom Hourglass and so on.

    just lay the graphic aside and play WW. IF you are a true hardocre zleda fan then you will forgett the hatred for the graphic and just be sweept away by the story.

    Same will probbaly happenf or the skyward sword.
     
  6. Gigatron_2005

    Gigatron_2005 President of Calendars

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    No. Skyward Sword looks very pretty. Like a very elaborate world made out of a watercolor painting. And if you still dont like Wind Waker, it just means that you have not played Wind Waker. Game was fantastic yo. I kicked myself pretty hard for not giving it a chance for years.


    Might be kicking myself for Skyward Sword, I am just too unconvinced to buy a Wii Motion Plus :( 
     
  7. OmegaScourge

    OmegaScourge Custom Made TFW2005 Supporter

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    I liked WW and TP's style...and I like SS's style too. So long the game play is there, that's what matters the most to me. To each their own I guess.
     
  8. Atomsplitter

    Atomsplitter Needs a new title.

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    Why so negative about the 3DS too? It has games on it much more realistic looking than the games mentioned.
     
  9. Cal

    Cal Well-Known Member

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    I wasn't negative about the 3DS, I just said that Skyward Sword's graphics look like they belong on that system. Speaking of the 3DS, I saw the Kid Icarus trailer and noticed it had full voice acting. It really boggles the mind how a Zelda game on the Wii still resorts to mute characters and dialogue boxes with today's technology. Nintendo's insistence on keeping Link as the silent protagonist is really hurting the progression of the series. For a franchise that focuses so much on songs and musical cues, it's nothing short of appalling that Nintendo haven't given the slightest bit of consideration to the games' vocal track. (I was also incensed at SSBB, which is mostly just grunts and cries, compared to the wide array of memorable taunts and catchphrases in MVC3.) It's even more odious and hypocritical due to the fact that the visual styles of Wind Waker and Skyward Sword were designed to make the games more expressive, but I see nothing expressive about choosing scrolling text over a vocal performance. Until Nintendo wises up and realizes that dialogue boxes are an outdated tool, their games' audio will remain in the dark ages.
     
  10. Liege Prime

    Liege Prime Well-Known Member

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    Eh, sounds like you want to play games with the best technology and highest budgets. Maybe you should look elsewhere besides Nintendo for that. Nintendo will always choose substance over the latest tech for their main franchise games.
     
  11. Cal

    Cal Well-Known Member

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    I don't see what you're getting at. Are you saying that Zelda games don't have high production values? It's neither the budget nor the technology that's limiting Nintendo, just some of their frustrating creative decisions. Besides, who's to say that you can't have style and substance? There's nothing preventing Skyward Sword from being a success with full voice acting and graphics comparable to the Zelda HD demo on the badly-named Wii U.
     
  12. Atomsplitter

    Atomsplitter Needs a new title.

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    You can't just expect them to make a character who has been silent for a quarter century just magically start talking though, that would be even more offputting than keeping him silent. How would you explain it? "Oh, he got better" doesn't really work.
     
  13. SAF7

    SAF7 LOVE this game!

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    Seeing as how the last time full voice acting was introduced to a Nintendo franchise was in Metroid: Other M, I'd rather LoZ stay the way it has always been than take that risk :lol .

    Get Wii Sports Resort. A really fun game/"tech demo" + a free Wii Motion Plus = win.



    In any case, I'm basically in the same mindset as most everyone in this thread. I personally find the graphics in WW to be really nice (now if I can only get around to getting the game), and the LoZ formula has worked incredibly well for years now. Messing with it too much will more than likely do more harm than good.
     
  14. Cal

    Cal Well-Known Member

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    That is the lamest excuse I've ever heard. Pit from Kid Icarus has been silent a lot longer than Link, but no one seems put off by him talking in his upcoming game. It's simply a natural improvement in the audio for the series.
     
  15. OmegaScourge

    OmegaScourge Custom Made TFW2005 Supporter

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    but last time we saw him minus his latest game was SSBM. Before that was im sure was his NES game.

    Link on the other hand had way more games...
     
  16. Cal

    Cal Well-Known Member

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    I still don't see your point. You don't think that Link's visual appearance radically changing throughout the series is distracting, but you have a problem with him talking? Boy, that's hypocritical.



    I haven't played Other M, so I can't really state an opinion, but I take it that you don't think very highly of the voice acting. Even if that's the case, I wouldn't want Nintendo to go back to dialogue boxes based on a poor reception. The success of voice acting - like all aspects of the game - depends on the quality of the execution. If you have a talented cast and a strong script, the game's voice acting can be one of the highest points. If not, people end up calling voice acting in general as a bad move for the series, and that simply isn't true.

    Here's a good example. I'm also a Mega Man fan, and I can safely say that the early voice acting in Mega Man 8 and Mega Man X4 was ear-splitting. The actors were badly miscast and the script was laughable. But if Capcom had decided that voice acting was a bad idea, we wouldn't have more memorable ones like Mega Man X8 and the Mega Man Legends series. They invested more time into voicing those games and the effort goes to show.

    I'm shocked that people still think that dialogue boxes are an adequate alternative to voice acting, but they don't seem to realize its just as important to the game's presentation as its graphics. Let me put it into perspective for you: imagine playing a Zelda game with no graphics whatsoever. All you have are dialogue boxes that pop up on the screen to describe what's there. You're fighting Ganondorf, but you can't see him. But hey, you've got a scrolling text that tells you what he looks like! Surely that's a perfectly acceptable substitute for actual graphics, eh? You see my point. If Nintendo wants to make their games as expressive as they claim, they need to focus on the voice acting as much as the visual style.
     
  17. a person

    a person Is not amused.

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    I agree that future Zelda games should have voice acting.
     
  18. SAF7

    SAF7 LOVE this game!

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    It's not so much that the voice acting was bad, but that there was too much of it. There were so many cut scenes and so much exposition in the game that it really dragged it down. The game play and controls were solid, but the developers got too carried away with the fact that this was the first time Samus talked at length, to the point where she would never shut up.

    I've never played X8 or the Legends series, so I'll take your word on that (though I will agree that 8's dubbing was horrendous).

    Okay first off, if a game had no graphics whatsoever, it wouldn't be a video game, it would be a book. Second, the fact that Link doesn't talk doesn't detract from how expressive he is. In fact, I think it does the exact opposite. We are able to tell what Link is thinking and how he feels about a situation without him saying a word.


    Now, am I completely against the possibility of voice acting in LoZ? Not necessarily. However, I do feel that Link needs to remain the silent protagonist, as it's a big part of his (and the series's) charm.
     
  19. magmatron

    magmatron Hyper Sentinel Force!

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    I think Zelda WW is one of the prettiest games of all time, and was choke full of so much to do. The story was excellent, the music fitted so well, and the dungeons were fun fun fun. Frankly, you really can't call yourself a Zelda fan unless you played that game.
    I'm glad Nintendo returned to that style, it will never look old. TP looks bad nowadays, and frankly it has a most horrible pace and some pretty unimaginative dungeon designs. Without a doubt worst 3D zelda game, not to say it's a bad game.
     
  20. Liege Prime

    Liege Prime Well-Known Member

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    All I was getting at was that after your comments regarding the visuals and sound that you wanted them to push the system as much as possible instead of going for a more stylized choice. Nintendo is also a very econimic company, so generally their games have a nice visual art style but rarely do they push technical boundaries.

    That being said I don't think Link should get a voice, but I wouldn't be opposed to having other characters be voiced.
     

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