Would the movieverse toys have been better off under another brand?

Discussion in 'Transformers Toy Discussion' started by Grandum, Feb 22, 2011.

  1. Grandum

    Grandum Well-Known Member

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    I know there are loads and loads of movie fanboys on here and I mean no disrespect or anything, but to some extent I think that the movieverse toys should have been called something other than Transformers.

    The toys and the designs themselves are so different from previous incarnations of transformers that if the movies had been released under a new name and been a new toyline, renaming all the figures and repainted Optimus Prime and gave him another "helmet" then I think it could have been successful as a new brand.

    I think that the transformers name and the characters names should be used better, I mean the reason for using it to begin with is to spark some form of recognition. I for one think of a red, blocky robot who's an old friend of Optimus Prime and a war veteran when I hear the name Ironhide, so to me it just doesn't serve any purpose giving that name to a black robot with parts pertruding from everywhere who wants to shoot everything that moves, preferably while doing cartwheels.

    Not saying thats not cool and all, but it's nothing like the original Ironhide, and therefor there is no need for him to be named Ironhide.

    If they did all that then I'd actually be able to enjoy the movies instead of getting pissed off at the heroic Optimus Prime executing "bad" bots who can't defend themselves or traditionally clumsy feel good bumblebee ripping out the spine of ravage, peeing on humans, etc.

    Also had that been the case then they could have kept on evolving the movieverse toys in that direction instead of making toys that "looks like they were meant for preschoolers" as someone said the other day on this forum, paraphrasing, but you get the idea.

    I think we could have seen way more intricate designs in the movieverse and I think that the TF fanbase would have been better off, not having been split up in different camps.


    *****************************

    BECAUSE THERE HAVE BEEN ALOT OF OFFTOPIC REMARKS ABOUT CHANGE, HOW THE MOVIE ISN'T G1 OR WETHER OR NOT THE MOVIE DESERVES TO BE CALLED TRANSFORMERS I FEEL THE NEED TO MAKE THIS ABSOLUTELY CLEAR:

    The movie:
    This is not a "I hate movieverse post"
    I am fully aware that the movie is not g1
    I don't think that the movieverse toys aren't transformers

    Transformers in general:
    I am perfectly aware that there are changes from toyline to toyline
    I am not against change

    Ironhide:
    I don't think he's g1 Ironhide
    I don't mind the new character
    I don't want the movieverse character to be red
    I don't associate that character with the g1 character in any way shape or form


    I hope that with this we can go on to discuss wether or not the movieverse toys were good enough to be able to make it as a new brand, and that if we discuss Ironhide we do it from the perspective of "Are movieverse Ironhides design and character changes enough for the general public to not associate him with the g1 Ironhide seeing as transformers was synonymous with g1 to the general public (ie outside of the fanbase) before the 2007 movie, thereby allowing for him to be renamed to something else under another brand."
     
  2. PikaManiac

    PikaManiac Well-Known Member

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    Fans been waiting for years for a live - action Transformers movie. Do you think they will be please to get a not - Transformers movie and toys?

    Besides, the general public won't be able to relate to it.

    How is it even slightly better?
     
  3. wildfly

    wildfly Lasers, 8 O'Clock, Day 1.

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    No disrespect to you either, but words like pot, kettle and black come to mind.
     
  4. Karhukjnsi

    Karhukjnsi Universal Wrestler

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    Movie, not G1, etc...
     
  5. Grandum

    Grandum Well-Known Member

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    I sugest you carry on reading then and maybe come to the conclusion that thinking that the movieverse toyline is good enough to stand on its own 2 feet is not disrespectful ;-)

    You, trolling, etc...

    I'm sorry, I don't quite get what you were trying to say there, your grammar is kind of messed up, but I'll try and reply as best as I can:

    Yes, fans have been waiting for years for a live action movie, and as a result of reinventing the brand so drasticly we got fans everywhere saying "michael bay raped my childhood", I don't think that counts as pleasing the fans. Fans were waiting for a Transformers movie with the bots they grew up with, or strong similarities to it.

    Had the Bay movies not been marketed as Transformers they'd still be waiting instead of quitting the fandom or using the above statement, splitting the fanbase into different camps.

    And generally speaking it takes 8 years for people to get used to a new concept. Transforming robots have been around since the late 70s and IS allready something people can relate to, the word transform is a household name that even Obama uses in his speaches, people know the concept, trust me.
     
  6. UKBrawn

    UKBrawn No arms just CLAWS!!

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    I agree, they should have been called Gobots! :D 
     
  7. Thenames9

    Thenames9 D-d-d-d-duel!

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    The Movie toys are a new incarnation and design taken of Transformers. They don't have to be exactly the same in EVERY single series, look at Beast Wars. Movie is a new take on Transformers, not everything has to be G1.
     
  8. TheDemonDzko

    TheDemonDzko °-{[●□●]}-° {Beep. Boop.)

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    The dead horse, is in fact dead. He has no plans of returning to the world of the living, threw zombification or other means. I would appreciate it however, if you would go ahead and re-bury the body of Sir Reggie, so we can all sleep in peace without having to see the dug up body of a bone dry skeleton? What are we Cobra Commander and kicking puppies? You bury that horse, YOU BURY HIM RIGHT NOW!!!!




    (Yes, yes I did think this was funny..._)
     
  9. alexcollier

    alexcollier Well-Known Member

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    Are you saying that "Transformers" originated the word "transform" AND that people make the connection between that word and Transformers every time it's used?

    Coz............
     
  10. Grandum

    Grandum Well-Known Member

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    Not at all, I'm just trying to explain to Pika that the concept of transforming isn't new as of the 2007 movie

    Please refrain from meaningless comments, if you don't have anything to say that will contribute to the discussion then just stay out of the thread.


    I couldn't agree more, yes every incarnation has had a new design, but it has never been so drastic, both design wise and characterwise. With the exception of Beast wars who went in a completely new direction with animals instead of vehicles you've allways had that blocky robot design, and the heads allways looked like armoured robot heads. What I'm saying is that maybe they took it too far, a little different is fine, but just like evolution if the changes are too drastic it becomes a new species.

    I guess I'm not expressing myself well enough, but yeah you can read my Ironhide example, when you have absolutely nothing left that is reminiscant about Ironhide why would you call him Ironhide? See what I'm saying?
     
  11. wolfe

    wolfe Well-Known Member

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    Wahhhh... Someone doesn't like the movie-verse so it should have been called something else.

    The good thing about all these different lines is that a fan should be able to find a series they like. The fandom was already split up into different camps before the movie.
     
  12. Slip►Stream

    Slip►Stream Seeker Clone

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    This.

    Look at Animated as well, I personally don't like its cartoony looks but that doesn't automatically make it bad or not deserving of the Transformers brand-name for me. Just a different take.
     
  13. alexcollier

    alexcollier Well-Known Member

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    I gotcha. Though there had never been a movie quite like the 2007 TF. I think there was enough peripheral knowledge of the Transformers brand to cushion the public's reception of the movie. if it had been a totally new transforming alien movie..... might have worked. Might have been another Transmorphers (shudder)
     
  14. Draven

    Draven Banned

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    Not a good start. Using the term "no disrespect" is utterly negated by the use of terms like "fanboys".
    Transforming robots from Cybertron, who come to Earth and continue their war here? Sounds like Transformers to me.
    Beast Wars was completely different from previous incarnations of Transformers as well. Are you saying that Beast Wars should also have been released under a different name?
    So in other words: you wanted G1, you didn't get it, and you don't like that you didn't.
    He's not G1 Ironhide. He's Movieverse Ironhide.
    Again: NOT G1. The rule of "shoot at the bad guys but don't kill them in case the kids get upset" does not apply. It'd also make for a very dull movie. And as for bad bots who can't defend themselves, I'd like to know who you're referring to.
    Are you sure they weren't comparing the DOTM toys with the ROTF toys? I'd like to see the post you're referring to.
    Are you saying the movieverse designs aren't intricate? And I thought you said a few lines ago that you wanted Ironhide to be a blocky red robot? That's hardly intricate by any possible definition of the word.
     
  15. Magnus' Mate

    Magnus' Mate Well-Known Member

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    Has the OP no understanding of Transformers history??? Just look at each (successful!) iteration of the franchise - Beast Wars, Armada etc- they ALWAYS bring something new to the table, something different, something unique. Like the Movieverse did - it completely and utterly deserves to be called "Transformers".

    Now, personal preference - that's your domain, pal. I have my personal preference (G1) too. But when you try and construct a structured argument with a completely irrational premise, then people call you out on it.

    It is a supreme irony around these parts where the fanbase of a franchise built on the concept of things CHANGING are so resistant to new & different things...
     
  16. Grandum

    Grandum Well-Known Member

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    The fandom was spread out in regards to what people prefered before the movie, but I never saw people behaving like 12 year olds and replying like you just did with "Wahhhh..." in the beging of replies because someone didn't share your views. There was mutual respect because at the end of the day we were all transformers fans.

    Don't blame you for missing it, but yeah I agree like I said:

    So yeah, I agree, only question is if the changes were too much. But thank you for your input, I apreciate your view on the subject.
     
  17. Grandum

    Grandum Well-Known Member

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    Draven, I've told you before and I'll say it again - I'm not going to reply to you if all you do is to take bits and pieces out of context and then "missunderstand", provoke, try to put words in peoples mouths, "enterpit" or assume things that I had no intention of saying in the first place. Nor will I ever educate you in things that should be common knowledge to you as a transformers fan. The only questions of yours that I will ever answer are the ones where you post your opinion or carry a conversation like a normal adult, the rest will be ignored.

    It's so simple, read the whole thread and then give your opinions on the subject...

    To illustrate this I'll only be answering the parts of your post follows that pattern:

    Incase I wasn't clear enough I'll try my best to make you understand what I said:
    With a character like movieverse Ironhide that has NOTHING in common with his namesake I can't help but ask myself why you would call him Ironhide. As far as I can see there is nothing that merits it.

    Yes, they were comparing dotm toys with the rotf toys. What I was saying was that the dotm designs aren't as intricate as the rotf ones. I'd have loved to see them expanding on the rotf design concepts making toys that are way more intricate in the dotm lineup.

    I'm also saying that I don't think that that figure Should be named Ironhide.

    I'll try to simply it even more for you:

    Ironhide = Red blocky bot
    dotm Ironhide = renamed, and the figure more intricate.

    I really hope you get it this time around, because I'm getting tired of repeating myself.

    I think you missed my point even though I repeted myself time and time again in this thread - I don't mind change, I like change. We can discuss if the movieverse design went too far or if they didn't go far enough with the changes though if you want, but rest assured I like change.

    Unfortunatly you and several others call me out on stuff I never said, based on conversations they've had with people who don't like the movies, and just assume I'll have the same opinions. Now, please feel free to contribute to the conversation, but please refrain from the whole "Has the OP no understanding of Transformers history???" schtick, it's insulting, and makes you come off as someone who doesn't read threads, but just seeks confrontations instead.
     
  18. Auto Morph

    Auto Morph Gimmick Bot

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    They can call him whatever they want. It's a different continuity.

    If (and I stress the "IF" part) the DotM toys turn out to be less complex than their RotF predecessors then it will probably be for a good reason. I know a lot of kids (who, let's not forget are the main TF buying customer base) who couldn't transform the previous movie toys because they were too complex. It looks like Hasbro might be scaling the intricacy of the new figures back to make them more 'kid-friendly' and therefore sell more toys.

    in G1.

    in the live action movies.

    But you DON'T seem to have an understanding of Transformers history. Characters get names from other characters all the time. Are you saying that BW Silverbolt shouldn't be named as such because he's not a white Concorde and leader of a combiner team? Are you saying that Animated Bulkhead should be renamed because he's not a helicopter?

    You may not class the movieverse as 'Transformers', but IT IS TRANSFORMERS.

    It really is that simple. Deal with it and move on I say. This dead horse ain't getting any deader.
     
  19. MegaHavok

    MegaHavok Well-Known Member

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    This was Ironhide in 2003:
    [​IMG]
    in 2004:
    [​IMG]
    in 1997 he was an elephant:
    [​IMG]
    in 1995:
    Ironhide (1995) - Autobot Military Strategist - www.tfu.info
    Ironhide and everysingle transformer since the 1980's has been continually reinvented or just had their name passed on to another character.

    The TF movie line is the most successful Transformer line since 1985. If Hasbro had branded the movie lines under anything else TF's like we know them would be out of business.

    This constant whining every time a classics line ends and the movie lines restart is getting so old. Do you guys realize that after the movie were going strait in to Prime toys? G1 is dead lets move on and let the designs and characters continue to change and evolve
     
  20. Auto Morph

    Auto Morph Gimmick Bot

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    ^ Pretty much my point exactly.
     

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