Discussion in 'Transformers Movie Discussion' started by Stonecrusher, Jan 6, 2013.
Am I the only one who loves the movies yet still believes the haters have a few valid points?
TC, have you not pondered that perhaps there are far more flaws than virtues to talk about? In fact, the only virtue I`ve seen anyone ever mention about the movies is "it made Transformers appealing to the mainstream audience and that made Hasbro some money for other things".
I mean my biggest issues for this trilogy was the complete lack of respect for the Decepticon's fans out there and there are many! Look at the first movie for instants(which I love) Starscream disabled 3 of the Autobots by himself, Megatron tossed OP around like he was the big brother and in the 2 and 3 movies its basically Optimus and Bumblebee scrapping the floor with the Decepticon's as if there nothing, yet The Decepticons won the war on cybertron and basically forced the autobots in exile! And five maybe six autobots are all that stands in the way of a army of decepticons(2nd and 3rd) and the Fallen(2nd) and they still cant get it done, come on! It doesn't even make since continuity wise in that regard. Plus they got the characterization of Optimus Prime all wrong in the 2nd and 3rd movies. OP was remorseful for having to have Megatron die in the first movie. In the second and 3rd its all out genocide on any transformers not claiming loyalty to him, as if he were the original Megatron. Plus Megatron yields command of the Decepticons to nobody not the Fallen or Sentinel Prime.
Ok I'm done ranting, sorry.
My take on the whole view of the movies.
G1 has set the bar very high on certain things, AND has also showed that that bar is really low on certain things in today's world.
One believes that with the amount of money and research that went into making the movies, there should be a lot more "omph" to them.
-Beast Wars (aimed at kids), took some good elements of G1, and made it better. A lot of the negatives is stemmed from trying something new and it didn't work, or didn't appeal to the audience.
-RiD and Unicron Trilogy (aimed at kids), took some elements of G1, influenced by current anime popularity, and foreign CGI styles. A lot of the negatives is stemmed from trying something new and it didn't work, or didn't appeal to the audience.
-Animated (aimed at kids), took some elements of G1 and Beast Wars, and gave it a twist. A lot of the negatives is stemmed from trying something new and it didn't work, or didn't appeal to the audience.
As for the movies...with 22 years of history (1984-2006), characters, color schemes, storylines, fans' likes and dislikes, modern CGI with Hollywood budget, various internet fan sites, and people who worked on the movie who were here from the begining....we should have gotten something better.
I am NOT saying they failed to make a G1 movie, I'm saying with so many good things from the various series that came before, couldn't they have gelled something that we, the fans could enjoy with the rest of the average movie goer.
One thing I would like to point out:
One of the big criticisms regarding these past 3 movies, was the lack of Transformer interaction. If I was a writer, I would have had multiple scenes where Sam was sitting inside Bumblebee, conversing with the various Autobots that are driving along. I'm not saying that would have been a big fix, but at least have more interesting interaction with character traits and quirks from the Autobot cast.
It's been done in G1, RiD, Unicron Trilogy, and in Animated. The Autobots didn't really have to be in robot mode 100% of the time to talk to each other. A cheap flashing light on the dash board or screen to show "alive-ness" of the car...a la 80s Knight Rider, (without doing a ripoff would have been sufficient for me).
Everyone has an opinion and view on these movies. I see them as epic.......
This thread is similar to one of my own threads " Tired of Bay haters?"......... Ultimately, that thread got some of the most negative responses I ever got.
I wish to address this point specifically; I have made a monkey of myself enough times by criticizing blindly. I wasn't impressed with Revenge of the Fallen at all, but I still went and saw Dark of the Moon. Largely because I followed it's production and thought maybe they'd done a better job here. I was correct and Dark of the Moon was a vast improvement.
One cannot fully critique, or otherwise have a complete opinion on a film (outside an educated guess) without seeing it.
Same with Green Lantern and Amazing Spider-Man. I rented those suckers, and thanked every God in the sky I'd only paid 5 bucks each for the displeasure of putting up with them.
Fuck you buddy, Trubbish and Garbodor are freaking awesome
I don't think that it's a lack of any positives in the movies so much as the negatives are just better topics. For example talking about how the movie managed a scale to the robots that the cartoons couldn't capture as well just isn't as exciting as a topic about how mom gets high or robot balls.
Plus it's just far easier to find things that people agree on as a negative than it is to find something almost everyone agrees is a positive.
I think in one sense they showed a lot of people just how incredible a Transformers movie could be .... while simultaneously not being that incredible movie.
What makes you think people are only "bitching" about the TF films? I think maybe you're noticing it more here because, well, it's a section specifically devoted to discussion of the TF films.
Why are they continually criticized in general, though? Because that's the nature of discussion, in that there are both positive and negative aspects of a film (or anything, for that matter) to discuss. That so many people have found so much to criticize with so much fervor means just that: that there was significant content in the film that provoked negative reactions in a large segment of the population (or at least, the population of the fandom), often a strong negative reaction. Now, how this is SUPPOSED to go in terms of discussion is that these criticism would be analyzed and either expanded upon or rebutted with well-reasoned counterviews, but I'll be the first to admit that this kind of skill and manners at discussion is woefully absent at both ends of the spectrum regarding the TF movies. What doesn't help anything, however, is the somewhat more recent trend of threads complaining ABOUT criticism, many of which are fallacious or inaccurate arguments that essentially boil down to "I don't like it when people say bad things about things I like". A lot of topics are going to be turned over and restated effectively until the end of time, because new people are going to want to discuss them, or older users are going to either have a new revelation or simply want another kick at the can. We're still talking about the death of Optimus in 1986 and the colours of Frenzy and Rumble, after all.
Really, your only options are to ignore the criticisms, to try and further discussion with those well-reasoned and civil rebuttals I mentioned earlier, or to basically leave this forum forever. Anything else is going to have no effect. A lot of the posters around here have a lot of maturing to do, but that's the only way any of the numerous issues that exist in this section (and have since it's inception, really) are going to be addressed or resolved.
that's very healthy man.
Why fix something that ain't broken?
1) ppl that are a fan of a franchise is more prone to find every fault there is in it. This happens to any franchise were it be something from DC, Marvel or other franchise with a large fandom.
2) Haters and complainers always shout more then praisers.
3) Some ppl are still stuck in the "that character should be/look like that" mind. These will never change.
4) Somehate Bay no mather what. Even if he did a Tf movie that was brilliant on all levels and won 10 oscars ppl would still bash it because its bay.
5) Taste is individually. What some of you ppl bash in Tf, others might bash in another movie you really love.
6) Some fans in here really think they talk for everybody when they say stuff like " the genereall opinion in the world fans and generall audience are that the movies suck. I can tell those fans this. The generall audience is more or less the other way around. They like the movies, they dont look at them with "nerd glasses" and go thorugh every little nitpick. They enjoy the movie for what it is.
7) I like the movies, sure some stuff would have been nice to been taken out but overall they are enjoyable. This is my opinion.
thats about it.
This. Freedom is the right of all sentient beings. And freedom of speech is even in some countries constitution
I want nothing less than this. A Transformers movie, done right, could be as good as the old Star Wars films. Not a bad popcorn movie like the ones we got.
Well, I do care. Because I'm a movie fan as well. I could talk the same way, like I talk about the Transformers movies, about movies like Matrix 2+3, Star Wars Episode 1,2,3, Godzilla, etc. And I really hate people who mindlessly listen to music that's played on the radio or watch movies and like them because there was good action and great special fx, without caring that there was really nothing else. I'm not the guy who likes to watch dramas, but I would prefer a good drama over such stupid movies anytime. And the people who like this stuff are really BAD, because their money supports that this shit continues and we don't get better movies. So the reason to hate such people, if you're a fan of movies, is a good reason.
But that's how it is always in life. The majority of the people is just not so intelligent as others and is more careless. They think of themselves as being normal, not realizing, they are the stupid people who are the cause for our culture degenerating.
You're basically invoking Godwin's Law.......
The reality is, people vote with their wallets and Bay's Transformers series is a billionaire. Movie critics despise the masses for not agreeing with them. Old school TF fans are just lost in the idea of "What could have been" but I see absolutely nothing on any forum that would have made the series any more successful.
People love to hate the series. I can agree with a lot of negative comments but I don't find them detracting from the film.
By this metric, Avatar is a better movie than all three Transformers movies combined since it made more money than they all did, indeed the total for all three TF movies only just edges out Avatar.....a single movie.
Indeed. One can acknowledge the negatives and take comfort in the positives is in a better position than an extremity of one or the other.
Screw the critics, I have money
All the box office tells you is how well the marketing department did at selling the film. If the box office said anything about how much people loved a movie then the People's Choice Awards could just dispense with voting and just hand out the awards based on box office, but award shows don't base the awards on box office for a good reason.
The only way to really know how people felt about a film is to see how it's viewed years later when the Hollywood ad machine isn't building hype for a movie. Films that didn't do well on the original box office run like Rocky Horror Picture Show or Big Trouble in Little China become cult classics while big box office hits like Independence Day become mostly forgotten relics.
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