Discussion in 'Transformers Movie Discussion' started by TheWarPathGuy, Oct 10, 2018 at 4:27 PM.
That's also fine, I love Armada Optimus. Only his super Mode looks silly.
I never said they were awful, horrendous or any other synonym. I think when you translate a character onto screen based on where they are from, you need to consider the repurcussions of the design and if we get it on screen easily.
I'm not saying the past movie designs are all good either. They had the right intention in reimagning things but also they can take a couple steps further with design cues and such.
E.g. It's a different property but.... If you're gonna bring Electro as an example to life on screen, maybe do something with his iconic mask. Look at how Spider-Man PS4 approached the mask. They made it into facial scars and adjusted the green to be more of his electrical harness. Plus no spoilers, they also kept his fun livewire personality intact and not the one where he's channeling Riddler from Batman Forever.
Because even if you see an Animated Soundwave you can say "yep, it's Soundwave".
Same thing you can say for a movie Aquaman, or a black suit movie Wolverine.
Then you see movie Soundwave.
I can finally say Aquaman looks like Aquaman after thinking of Thor and Lobo for so long.
Also movie Soundwave has the red visor, he just needs color like Wolverine.
Why did they want Iron Man's suit to look like Iron Man in the first MCU film? Why do they want Batman to look like Batman in any DC film? Why did the artists who work on the current Hollywood Godzilla films work hard to ensure their versions of these iconic characters looked faithful while still looking different?
I have to say G1 look cause to me that is Transformers but it's cool if others like it a different way. I have liked other directions so I'm not closed to other thinking. It's just the G1 look is what alot of us have grown up to remember and love from the very beginning.
But yes, the color could be an improvement
Absolutely. Maybe with some kind of control helmet addition to bring it closer to the original design a bit more - he went to all that trouble to make an electric suit, just stick a modified bike helmet with thunderbolt designs on top of that.
They do when you have to go and consider what side they're on. Every example you just named is exclusive to only the Autobots or Decepticons - sure there are technical exceptions like Botcon Bugbite but for the most part, shared designs in traditional G1 canon are rare to nonexistent.
Here we're dealing with Falcon and Vulture, a good guy and a bad guy. Falcon looks pretty streamlined with his face fully visible, he's heroic looking. In contrast, Vulture is a hulking VTOL beast with claws on the feet, a gigantic wingspan with large VTOL fans, and the pilot's helmet reducing his face to nothing but two bright green eyes works to 'dehumanize' his appearance, make it more evil and monstrous.
Yeah I can buy that.
If that's the case then why the changes to Shocker and Scorpion also?
Now hold on, we've gone from live action to just the video game - not that it really makes a difference given how powerful and good the graphics are, I get that - but as was pointed out, you're talking designs from comics over 70 years ago. Transformers is less than 40 and unlike humans who would need to be updated to be more realistic, the transformers are alien robots who even if they were straight translations, with the right lighting would look like they existed in the real world. Hell, actual straight translations of the G1 designs into 3D models with lighting rigged and everything would look even more alien than the current bayformers because where the latter simply look generic organic-mechanical, the blocky designs outright would defy understanding of the laws of physics itself.
Someone else made that suit for him
You know what? That's a good explanation though he's not really the evilest villain in the MCU.
The thing is Shocker is one of the villains who I think has a pretty consistent and translatable design to live action throughout the years. He isn't too jarring to bring to life. Why the MCU decided to not give him the proper suit is up in the air of speculation for me and it bugs me with what they did with Herman Schultz in that universe.
As for Scorpion, we'll see what happens in Far From Home if he does get the suit. I can only judge his character in terms of story in which it deviates from the traditional story of how he came to be. And it's a pretty fascinating villain origin.
For Transformers, I want the quality of the metal to look nice. Bumblebee and the other robots on Earth look good because the level of detail that go into them make them shine all the better. That's something I think got lost with some of the robots in the later Transformer movies. If we're going to bring someone like cassette tape Soundwave, then I need to see something more.
In this golden age of superhero movies where we are used to seeing costumed heroes and costumed villains fight it out on both the big screen and the small screen there really isn't a good excuse for not hitting on some nostalgia in your movie designs.
As other people have pointed out keeping what people expect is hardly something slavish. Look at all the different design variations we have gotten with Batman. It's not the same design but people instantly know both Batman from the '66 series and the Christopher Nolan film series. Heck Spider Man picked up that cool black costume in the comic book series but because Todd McFarlane kept enough classic elements in the design people still knew it was Spider Man even if he wasn't rocking his traditional blue and red pajamas.
When characters lack the costume it has been rather dull. Baron Zemo was all yawn boring sporting nothing but civilian clothes in Civil War but Black Manta is cool as hell already just from wearing his costume in the Aquaman trailers. What's more exciting the Smallville TV series where Clark runs around the whole series in boring civilian clothes or The Flash where Barry can put on a costume and fight a super intelligent gorilla?
Somewhere in the middle is a nice area they could have exploited that would have hit both the nostalgia factor and have been something eye popping for the level of detail you can make out in films now. Take Spider Man they didn't have to put him in the old costume from the Electric Company, they put in all sorts of extra details into his various movie costumes to stand out in a good way in a big budget action film.
Fingers crossed that Bumblebee and going forward is where Paramount decides they need that best of both worlds that every other studio is doing right now.
I think people want them to look like their G1 counterparts for several reasons.
#1. A lot of people grew up with those characters and have nostalgia for them. That's reason enough for a lot of people.
#2. I'd argue most of the G1 designs are solid, and have stood the test of time. Obviously some modernization will have to happen if they bring them to live-action, but the G1 designs are still pretty cool-looking. I've been rewatching the G1 cartoon, and I think Optimus, Megatron, and Soundwave (among many others) are some of the coolest robot designs ever put to screen. And I say that as a fan who is also an art major. They have great proportions (when they're drawn correctly), distinct features, and unique color schemes. They're just so much fun. I honestly don't think they look nearly as dated as some people make them out to be.
I think Bumblebee: The Movie is a good compromise between the G1 designs and the live-action complexity. I wouldn't mind at all if these became the template for future movies.
I grew up in the 80ties and love g1. But i don't understand the obsession with everything have to look like g1.
Bayformers have a lot of problems, and none of them were the designs.
Something bayformers actually have in common with G1
I remember the outrage over the batman suit had nipples in one movie
I do not expect characters to look like their G1 selves. And I say that as someone who grew up watching G1, which, along with the Japanese Masterforce and Victory, are the only versions of Transformers cartoons I watch.
From my view, Transformers are a different thing from most other cartoon or science fiction characters. Unlike Superman, Batman or the Incredible Hulk who portray certain iconic personas, these are robots supposedly able to reconfigure themselves into anything.
That should imply that they would periodically change their looks into different things, to suit whatever scenario they find themselves in. Hence, robots in disguise. If Bumblebee were to infiltrate an army base, it would make sense for him to turn into a jeep or tank, rather than remain a bright yellow VW Beetle or Camaro.
Plus, G1 came in the 1980s. For robots that could turn into anything, it just doesn't make sense if they still retained the same looks 30+ years later.
I find that a lot of people are held back by nostalgia, or the need to identify and relate. And I hate it when that hinders realism, creativity or evolution. By wanting Starscream to forever be white, red and blue, it kind of limits what other possible forms he can take. What if he scans an Eurofighter Typhoon with temperate camouflage? Being green and brown would send some into meltdown. (I loved his Bayverse robot design by the way)
My absolute favourite Transformers ever are the Constructicons. Despite my profile picture showing Rampage in his G1 colours, I was fine with their portrayal in RoTF. Loved it, as a matter of fact. Because a team of bright green and purple construction vehicles in a desert setting would stand out like a sore thumb. It was nice to see Scavenger 'updated' into the bicycle that is Demolishor, or Rampage becoming a pogo stick.
Having seen their G1 versions all my life, these new versions were highly refreshing, creative and out of the box. It does not detract from what they were in the cartoons, or offend my memories in any way.
I also loved some of the Constructicon concepts that never made it into the movie. Like Overload with 6 legs, or Hightower that rolled on treads. Because there are surely other practical forms of locomotion that a robot can adopt, besides being bipedal humanoids. It disappoints me that I'll likely not see more creative designs like that, because most clamor for the human-in-metal-suits look.
I'm all about realism and believability. I don't care about nostalgia or adhering to source material.
If it makes sense within the movie's plot for Optimus to transform into a pistol, and Megatron into a red and blue semi truck, I won't have any issue. Because that is what Transformers are supposed to be. They transform, which by definition means changing into something different. To remain the same in perpetuity would be a waste of that ability, wouldn't it?
The Transformers equivalent would be Devastator's balls, I guess.
The cartoons were fun and enetertaining in their days, but time goes on. Michael Bay was able to successfully re-imagine transformers as actual life forms in our planet. The first teaser that aired on you tube was the moment I completely left behind Armada, g1 and any other transformers style.
It was the most epic thing ever to play on the YouTube and the big screen . That was Transformers for me. Permanently.
The new Bumblebee movie gave Bumblebee a whole new look that's taken some time to get use to. After a while I can see this was the Bumblebee Hasbro dreames of.
This is as close as we can get to a live action Bumblebee. Just look at him. He's small, friendly looking for the kids and transforms into a Volkswagen beetle. Very close to how many remember him.
No wonder so many people want to see Knights take on Transformers.
I'm a big fan of Bumblebee from all of Bay's movies, especially from the 4th film. But I can also understand the need the needed to re-design Bee in a last attempt to save the franchise.
Thr G1 cybertron scene is the only problem I have with the new movie. Personally it's out of place and belongs in a seperate anniversary short movie or something. Not with the current designs. If they also re-designed fan favorites like Starcream or Soundwave, i would jump on board. It's not too bad I suppose, at least we've got Blitzscream
and these two.
I just wish they could habe been more creative with their heads. They're just round and plain.
That had more to do with the sorta off-putting behavior between Batman and Robin in Batman and Robin coming off less like an almost-falling out and more like a lover's spat. And while the nipples thing was supposed to actually be greek inspired, something about the perfect profile of a man's abs, given the context it came off more sexualized in the wrong way.
Suffice to say that actually happens to be one of the lesser problems in that godawful film.
You can modernize the characters on the big screen while still making them recognizable, and that I feel is one of the biggest problem with the designs, you can rarely tell who’s who. And I feel the High Moon games does the best job at this. I’m not opposed to seeing some liberties, but people still want to recognize their favorite characters, no one wants to see the testicles of some abomination pretending to be Devastator clicking and clacking
But most of the time the G1 characters look "goofy"... In the new movie, Shockwave or Soundwave wouldn't scare anyone, they almost look cute... Unlike their Bayverse counterparts who actually look intimidating and fearsome! The transformers on Earth looks nice, "Blitzwing" looks pretty cool to be honest.
I understand your analogy with the comics, but just to some extent...
Bayverse Optimus looks like Optimus without looking silly or campy.
Bale's Batman looks cool, on the other hand West's Batman doesn't...
G1 designs?! Yeah they look cool in a game or a cartoon, but in a serious tone movie?! Not so much really...
I really don't understand the almost pathological fixation that some people have with the G1 cartoon and their aesthetics.
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