Who were the Throttlebots originally?

Discussion in 'Transformers General Discussion' started by antapp, May 21, 2010.

  1. sto_vo_kor_2000

    sto_vo_kor_2000 Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2004
    Posts:
    6,785
    Trophy Points:
    211
    Likes:
    +13
    Its to late.

    [/quote]

    I asked you if you could confirm his death with evidence from within the story and this is what you provided???

    The visual evidence is "interpretive".

    It was never confirmed in dialog in the film or later episodes.

    Neither character turned grey.

    1 of the characters in question was later seen in the Japanese series, the other character was seen running around in season 3.

    I repeat, it was never confirmed from within the story that either character died.

    I rest my case.
     
  2. BScorpinok75

    BScorpinok75 Squadron X #1 Consultant

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2008
    Posts:
    21,925
    Trophy Points:
    337
    Location:
    In the darkness...
    Likes:
    +1,259
    Ebay:
    Facebook:
    Twitter:
    They were probably minibots who stayed behind on Cybertron and eventually received upgrades to be apart of Goldbug's new unit!
     
  3. Zherbus

    Zherbus In Shogo Hasui, we trust.

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2008
    Posts:
    2,362
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    151
    Likes:
    +12
    LMAO, no you don't. You never will.
     
  4. Lock Cade

    Lock Cade Tarn Fangirl

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2006
    Posts:
    27,199
    Trophy Points:
    392
    Location:
    Michigan
    Likes:
    +415

    Look, all I'm saying is that there was no need to confirm that Wheeljack did in fact die in the 1986 movie, because we ALL saw his dead body.

    As stated in the TF Wiki, the Japanese did not see the 1986 movie until 1989 and they had no prior knowledge of what transpired in the movie, so there are discrepancies in showing characters who had died in the movie in the Japanese series that were made after the U.S. G1 cartoon was canceled.

    Besides that, the Japanese took off with their own TF stories after the G1 series was canceled in the United States. The fact that the Headmasters series contradicts the events that occurred in the "Rebirth" episodes aired in the U.S. testifies that things just don't add up to what's already been established in the U.S. G1 cartoon.

    I don't know where exactly you get your information regarding who died and who didn't in the 1986 movie, so until you reveal the source of the information that is the basis of your claim that Wheeljack did not die in the 1986 movie, I'm sticking with my guns and say that Wheeljack did in fact die in the 1986 movie. So no, you did not fully rest your case.
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2010
  5. sto_vo_kor_2000

    sto_vo_kor_2000 Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2004
    Posts:
    6,785
    Trophy Points:
    211
    Likes:
    +13
    It seems your right.
    And as I said....that was your perception of events.

    Nothing in the film or season 3 ever stated for a fact that the character died.

    All the evidence from within the story swings both ways.

    So yes, we do need a in story confirmation.
    And that also doent prove or disprove anything.

    I'll admit that no conclusion can be made by Wheeljack presence in the Victory series.....but it certainly rasises the sector of sepculation as to wether he really died or not.
    Stick to your guns all you want.

    But I asked you to provide proove positive that he died....and so far you have failed to do so.

    As to where my evidence come from...it comes from the series.

    Every character we know for a "FACT" dies, either turned grey or it was confirmed in dialog in a season 3 episode.

    Optimus...turned grey and confirmed in dialog
    Starscream...turned grey and confirmed in dialog
    Ratchet....turned grey and confirmed in dialog
    Prowl...turned grey and confirmed in dialog
    Ironhide... confirmed in dialog
    Huffer....confirmed in dialog

    Wheeljack....did not turn grey nor was it confirmed in dialog.
    Windcharger..did not turn grey nor was it confirmed in dialog

    And the same can be said for Brawn.

    So NO, there is no "FACT" from within the narrative that Wheeljack died.

    And if there is, please provide it.Because everyting you have cited is only your interpretation of the event.
     
  6. RedWolf

    RedWolf Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2004
    Posts:
    2,824
    Trophy Points:
    292
    Likes:
    +190
    sto_vo_kor_2000 you're starting to sound like a Robotech neophyte that can't distinguish between Robotech and Macross.

    1. Different producers.

    2. The sequels being Takara's own productions are their own continuity.
     
  7. sto_vo_kor_2000

    sto_vo_kor_2000 Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2004
    Posts:
    6,785
    Trophy Points:
    211
    Likes:
    +13
    I dont get how.

    Plain and simple.....can you provide prove positive evidence,from within the G1 Hasbro series narrative, that proves Wheeljack died beyond and doubt or possibility?????

    I have asked this question for years....and so far no one can.

    Is it possible Wheeljack died....yes, I would even say its most likely.

    But can it be proven he died with evidence from within the story................No it cant.
     
  8. Lock Cade

    Lock Cade Tarn Fangirl

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2006
    Posts:
    27,199
    Trophy Points:
    392
    Location:
    Michigan
    Likes:
    +415
    Just because there was no in-story confirmation that he died in season 3 and he appeared in the Japanese G1 Victory series DOES NOT mean that Wheeljack did not die in the 1986 movie.

    I fail to see how your "evidence" does in fact prove as such. If anything, it's from your perspective, your perception, your assumption that Wheeljack did not die.

    Face it... you did not rest your case, and as Zherbus pointed out, you never will.

    With that, I'm done arguing with you.
     
  9. sto_vo_kor_2000

    sto_vo_kor_2000 Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2004
    Posts:
    6,785
    Trophy Points:
    211
    Likes:
    +13
    Not to sound rude but please dont twist my argument.

    You may want to re-read evey one of my post more closely.

    I never once claimed my evidence proves he "DID NOT DIE".

    I said there was no in story evidence that he "DID" die.

    And I've proved my claim.

    So yes indeed I did rest my CASE.

    And I'm sorry to say this but you never had an argument.You have been arguing a false case.....citing facts that are not in evidence and also arguing from the false assumption of what my claims were.
     
  10. destrongerlupus

    destrongerlupus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2006
    Posts:
    7,377
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    367
    Likes:
    +985
    For the record:

    I think Wheeljack and and Windcharger are dead.
    I LOVE Victory, but don't count WJ's presence there as proof of anything.

    BUT-

    To play Devil's advocate....

    I see Sto Vo Kor's point. In a cartoon RIDDLED with animation errors, it's hard to TRUST the "on screen death" without comment of ANYONE, let alone two more or less prominent guys. It's very possible the script said "two random robots" and the artists just picked those designs at random.

    That coulda' been Marlboor (with a incorrect head model) and an Argentinean Windcharger variant for all we know*

    (*not really)

    Without someone SAYING "Hey Wheeljack and Windcharger are dead" or at least seeing their grave-markers at some point, it's really not a 100% water tight assumption to make.

    But, yeah, they totally bought it in the movie.
     
  11. sto_vo_kor_2000

    sto_vo_kor_2000 Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2004
    Posts:
    6,785
    Trophy Points:
    211
    Likes:
    +13
    Someones finally got it.

    I prefer to think of them a dead as well.

    But my point is that there has never been any direct in story evidence to say, with out a doubt, that they ever died.
     
  12. RedWolf

    RedWolf Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2004
    Posts:
    2,824
    Trophy Points:
    292
    Likes:
    +190
    Transformers season 1 to 4 are Marvel-Sunbow Productions. Toei animated the Movie but Sunbow still had a hand in its production. The cartoon was the official marketing material of Hasbro for their toyline.

    Transformers: The Headmasters, Transformers: Super-God Masterforce, Transformers: Victory and Transformers: Zone are all original productions by Takara.

    When Transformers went to temporary period of dormancy in the West Takara seeing there is a market colaborated with Sunrise and brought about the Brave Series.

    As you can see it wasn't Hasbro's decision to create those series. The Hasbro-Takara deal was that Hasbro has the IP rights while distribution rights in Japan is Takara's.
     
  13. sto_vo_kor_2000

    sto_vo_kor_2000 Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2004
    Posts:
    6,785
    Trophy Points:
    211
    Likes:
    +13
    All of which is irrelevant to my case.

    I said no conclusion could be made by the Victory series.

    But its certainly enough to rasis speculation.Further more, Windcharger being seen in season 3 also throws doubt into the case of their deaths.
     
  14. Computron34

    Computron34 Always Tired

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2002
    Posts:
    3,962
    News Credits:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    312
    Location:
    Waco, TX
    Likes:
    +264
    Ebay:
    Twitter:
    :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: 
     
  15. sto_vo_kor_2000

    sto_vo_kor_2000 Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2004
    Posts:
    6,785
    Trophy Points:
    211
    Likes:
    +13
  16. Computron34

    Computron34 Always Tired

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2002
    Posts:
    3,962
    News Credits:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    312
    Location:
    Waco, TX
    Likes:
    +264
    Ebay:
    Twitter:
    That's about what I did.
     
  17. Rcaswell

    Rcaswell Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2009
    Posts:
    87
    Trophy Points:
    91
    Likes:
    +0
    It is an interesting thought. The throttlebots might have been some proto...... alright....form (yes, all my puns are that bad) of activators for the G1 line before being given their own names and personalities. I can see that.
     
  18. RedWolf

    RedWolf Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2004
    Posts:
    2,824
    Trophy Points:
    292
    Likes:
    +190
    As I said he was on the Cons side! Its an animation error.

    What you did was called highfalutin.
     
  19. Computron34

    Computron34 Always Tired

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2002
    Posts:
    3,962
    News Credits:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    312
    Location:
    Waco, TX
    Likes:
    +264
    Ebay:
    Twitter:
    NNNNOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!! The cartoon is absolute. If he was shown on the 'Cons side, then he obviously switched allegiances!!!!! Everything has to be literal!!!!!!!!!!
     
  20. sto_vo_kor_2000

    sto_vo_kor_2000 Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2004
    Posts:
    6,785
    Trophy Points:
    211
    Likes:
    +13
    When did you say that???Must have missed it.

    Either way....No he wasnt.

    Your thinking of Brawn or Huffer.

    Windcharger was seen on Cybertron with other Autobots.

    And even if it was an animation error, it still happaned so it calls into question his death.
    Looks up "highfalutin".........

    Sorry I dont think so.

    I never claimed his appearance in Victory was conclusive of any fact.