Who do we "blame" for Beast Machines?

Discussion in 'Transformers General Discussion' started by Bathawk, Jan 5, 2011.

  1. Bathawk

    Bathawk Well-Known Member

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    ugh

    Ok first of all I've been showing my girlfirend all the G1 episodes, only 12 episodes left to go, and then on to Beast Wars

    I myself am ashamed to admit I hadn't watched Beast Wars until around this time last year. yes I was a "Trukk not Munkey" kind of guy. And now I have to admit that it is the best Transformers series...even beating G1 (after all Beast Wars is a sequel to G1)

    But of course I could never finish "Beast Machines" the poor characterizations for one thing, and all this "organic organic organic"

    I mean all this "we need more plants and such" resonates with me on the same wavelength as cramming a dozen or so humans in a Transformers franchise...it/they don't belong and should only be there for perspective

    ...and of course the hole turning Cybertron into a "green planet" was the ultimate slap in the face

    so three questions

    1.) who's bright idea was this? seriously, whoever masterminded Best Machines, makes Uwe Boll seem like a creative genius

    2.) Wikipiedia says "Transformers:Universe" retconned the end of Beast Machines, can anyone give me details?

    3.) and finally, should I show my girlfriend Beast Machines after Beast Wars? or let her memory of Rattrap and company end with the final episode of Beast Wars?
     
  2. sto_vo_kor_2000

    sto_vo_kor_2000 Banned

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    I wont argue with you for not likeing the show.

    But this.....
    nothing could be further from the truth.

    Granted,some of [if not all] the characterizations were "changed" from how they were portrayed in BeastWars.

    But Beast Machines had great characterization and development.
     
  3. Hobbes-timus Prime

    Hobbes-timus Prime Well-Known Member

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    I don't really care for Beast Machines, personally, but your critiques of the show are way off.
     
  4. Lacimehc

    Lacimehc Tastes like medicine

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    I thought Beast Machines was a pretty good show once I got over the whole organic planet thing... The writing was pretty solid and the characters were well developed. Beast Wars is still superior though.
     
  5. bellpeppers

    bellpeppers A Meat Popsicle

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    Bob Skir and Hasbro... not exactly their brightest hour.
     
  6. Bathawk

    Bathawk Well-Known Member

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    sorry just a quick clarification, I admit there iwas charctaer development, but I'm prety confident that tehwriters skimmed over one pargraph descriptions of the beast wars characters...how else do you explain rattrap going from a badass to the wimpy comic relief, or Primal becoming some new age hippy, I would make a similar comment on Blackarachnia, but seeing how she only "turned" at the end of beast wars, I can't really say how much becoming a Maximal made her so.....emotionally weak....I pretty much see nothing of the Beast Wars characters in their Beast Machine selves....but then again that is my opinion
     
  7. guard convoy

    guard convoy The Big Daddy

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    beast machines is pretty damn good, great characterization and a pretty good dark story
     
  8. Maximo Prime

    Maximo Prime Bassist of Ill Repute

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    while i won't apologize for EVERY aspect of the show, i would say Primal's abrupt change in character came from (possiblY) the guilt of losing his world to Megatron's genocide (and really because he chose to take Megs home instead of killing him on Earth like he should have), and his buddies to boot.
     
  9. Sentinel

    Sentinel TF Museum Curator Moderator News Staff

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    There were some missteps (Rattrap was absolutely ruined, WTF?). But still rather liked most of that show. It took the franchise in a new direction and it was a bold move, it was unfortunate that it didnt work out well. To answer your question, I would say show it to her and see what she thinks. I've been in the exact same situation with girlfriends and shown it to them. They usually think it looks pretty and it is interesting, but none of them were exceptionally impressed. I personally don't think there is anything to lose by showing it to her. Just make sure you show her Animated when you are done. That is another excellent series.
     
  10. Pravus Prime

    Pravus Prime Sorcerer

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    Dan Didio. Believe it or not, if everything he wanted had gone his way, the show would've been much worse. He thought the Beast Wars franchise was too continuity heavy and wanted the show to completely ignore BW entirely. He pushed the animators to do their own thing and ignore any of the Hasbro designs. He's also real big on being uber-messagey with the show being one big morality lesson.

    Personally I don't think much of BM. In a nutshell it was overly repetitive and the writing was so heavy handed it was absurd. Then there was the whole ending that essentially ruined the entire concept of Transformers.

    As for being retconned out of existence, I believe it's a fan club comic that had the entire events be a VR simulation that the Quintessons were running on the captured Autobot shuttle. There was a comment that they couldn't believe the Maximals accepted the simulation despite the obvious differences.
     
  11. G1_Cindersaur

    G1_Cindersaur Banned

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    alot of what ruined beast machines was the lack of decent transformer TOYS

    the motorcycle drone and tank drone did not come out until the end of the toy /cartoon cycle and were not produced at the very beginning like they should have been for sales to propagate ....ARMY BUILDERS HASBRO! WTF!

    anyway....alot of the deluxe and scout sided toys were crap in my book...the off screen characters anyway...the vehicons were decent...the maximals not so decent...i dug the cartoon until the very green ending...but the toys out at the time just blew...we got a tankor that did not look like tankor and a huge nightscream that was like a frakenbot in size aspects to the other maximals.
     
  12. Explosion_Rex

    Explosion_Rex Well-Known Member

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    On top of these things I also found the pacing to be incredibly slow and boring. I'm not someone that needs action and explosions every 30 seconds but SOMETHING has to happen over the course of 5 episodes.

    Don't even get me started on how ridiculous Rhinox/Tankorr was characterized in the show. A bot that risked his life to go into the Matrix to save Primal is now the #2 Decepticon and is vying for the #1 spot.... Really? REALLY?!?!?!


    It's a huge shame that Beast Wars was cut short and the last half of the last season was so half-assed so they could vomit up Beast Machines.
     
  13. Thenames9

    Thenames9 D-d-d-d-duel!

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    I think I'm the only one who dislikes Beast Wars. :eek: 

    But I agree, though I watch a handful of episodes, they are far superior to handful of Beast Machines I watched :lol 
     
  14. Explosion_Rex

    Explosion_Rex Well-Known Member

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    Honestly, I remember watching a few episodes of BW when season 1 came out and I was totally unimpressed. It really wasn't until the last few episodes of season 1 that the story gets good and consistant. It was obvious when the show first started that the writers had never even seen an episode or read a comic from G1.
     
  15. TheDemonDzko

    TheDemonDzko °-{[●□●]}-° {Beep. Boop.)

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    I think I am one of the oddballs on this site, I actually enjoy Beast Wars and Beast Machines equally, and I view them as the same show in the long run, yes BM was a whole diffrent feel, but personally I don't think it took away from the BW story arc, I will say the whole "EL OH EL GUYS CYBERTRON NEEDS FLOWERS!!!" was a bad choice, but. -shrug- it could be worse...
     
  16. Auto Morph

    Auto Morph Gimmick Bot

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    I also really like Beast Machines. Sometimes the thumping techno music can get a little repetitive along with scene after scene after scene of the Maximals just being chased all over Cybertron by the Vehicons.
    But IMO you cannot argue with the characterisation. The characters from Beast Wars had been put into basically what was their ultimate hell - no wonder they would behave differently and darker aspects of their personalities would emerge. Most of them were just about on the verge of a processor breakdown!

    I'm still a bit 'meh' on the whole organic Cybertron thing, and Botanica doesn't really float my boat, but for fast paced plot, action, darkness (both literally and figuratively) and originality, you can't really fault Beast Machines.
    It's like BW and BM are both 2 sides of the same coin. One is brighter, 'popcorn' action and comedy, and one is 'let's take these characters and dump them in a living nightmare'.

    I can appreciate that this might not be to some people's tatses, but don't knock the show for how they 'changed' the characters' personalities. They were justified given the extreme circumstances.
     
  17. llamatron

    llamatron Shut up, Nigel. TFW2005 Supporter

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    The show has problems, yes, but characterisation is not one of them. If you think about what they have been through it works really well. Rattrap really got to shine in that early season one ep with Megatron (the name escapes me). Primal's decent into madness and fanaticism is wonderful. Silverbolt and Megatron are fantastic.

    And it has some very nice visual elements too. Shame the toy line was mostly balls though.
     
  18. G1Prowl

    G1Prowl Autobot Strategist

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    No, you're not the only one. I can't speak on Beast Machines as the only episode I saw was the last one.
     
  19. Decay_is_awesome

    Decay_is_awesome Well-Known Member

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    i actually dont mind beast machines, its well written and tells a long and interesting story, and it has some cool g1 throwbacks like the plasma energy chamber and the key to vector sigma. i dont like it as a sequel to beast wars though.

    beast wars megatron is the best megatron weve seen in my opinion, and primal was kind of defined by being down to earth, in beast machines megatrons whole agenda seemed kind of like a spur of the moment thing, and primal just sucked. if it was a stand alone with new characters filling the roles of the old bw characters i think it would have been much better received, and i know id apperciate it a lot more.

    some aspects of the characters i like, like cheetors continued maturity and blackarachnia and silverbolts reversal of good guy/bad girl, but over all i think it would have been much much better as an unrelated sequel. maybe showing what was going on on cybertron towards the end of the beast wars, or far into the future.
     
  20. UKBrawn

    UKBrawn No arms just CLAWS!!

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    I think BM had some good and reall really bad parts. I enjoyed the series when I watched it, but I admit I have never rewatched it and that was 8 years ago.

    It had some damn awful new characters; Nightscream and Botanica offend my senses and I have to say I never grew fond of the character designs.

    I agree though, Rattrap arggh I mean that characterization was miles off.
     

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