the name reuse is what bugs me; If i see someone named Inferno, I expect the personality that was set by the first Inferno, not something different

 

Comic-specific characters getting toys is an EXTREMELY new phenomenon. Up until the generations line, the only chance a comic character had of getting a toy would be if they were based on a pre-existing toy (but with a new or novel characterization), if they were introduced/reincarnated as a character in a new show, or if they were to be used as a repaint of another character. Straxus had to wait... what, over 20 years for a toy, and it's still not comic-accurate!


As for beast wars, I imagine it was highly profitable, or at least profitable enough to warrant sustaining itself until Beast Machines. Was the concept of "transforming toys" enough to be profitable? Frankly, no. There've been plenty of transforming toylines that have competed against Transformers and been unsuccessful. Was the Transformers brand itself enough to guarantee profitability? Maybe, but even then, Beast Wars was originally developed as a way of moving away from where the Transformers brand was, effectively deemed stagnant after G2. Ties to the original brand were minimized on the original packaging, and the first figures were released through Kenner, not Hasbro (though kenner was owned by Hasbro), supposedly so that if the line failed, Hasbro could more easily distance itself and Transformers from it. Interesting though, that the use of the Megatron and Optimus Prime/Primal names were still used in it.

 

Aw, now I have lots of love for G1 fans, and even I have G1 characters I'd take a bullet for. It's the ones that get out-of-control and demand that everything be a clone of G1 that I file under the label of "geewunners." There are G1 fans, and geewunners. A certain Chris Rock bit comes to mind. Sorry if offend, I may not know enough about that term to use it so flagrantly. Glad you're on board with the rest, though.

 

But for the sake of this particular argument, it's not the character's contributions to the overall series that's being brought into question, it's basically the mere inclusion of new "characters" (be they actual characters, cannon fodder or little-more-than props).

And by extension, there are "movie fans" and there are "Bay-bies/movie fanboys".

 

Uh, actually

This thread wasn't about background characters or originality in the margins, with regurgitated, familiar drivel for the story's backbone. I want to see the bits of originality which SHINES among the waste expounded upon. Imagine if these prop characters, like Barricade and the dreads, were made to be more. I mean, in design alone, the concept of villains that turn into police vehicles is compelling, but to breathe character into these concepts could elevate them to a level that deserves much more praise than old elements only re-imagined in visual terms like the main movie cast, or Prime or Animated casts, for that matter.

 

Pfft. You assume that I actually read things? Why do that when I can skim through and make rash assumptions?  

 

JDK:

Well I'm a geewunner, baby! Oh yeah.  

Seriously, though, I agreed with your observation until I got into that wonderful MTMTE ongoing comic. It's more than a breath of fresh air, it's a hurricane of it. Mr. Roberts is treating his characters as characters, not just as "Transformers characters", and it's incredible!

Read it read it read it read it!

 

Yeah; actually, a lot of the RiD characters were.

Cybershark - Transformers Wiki

 

I wouldn't mind the OP's idea.

NOTE: I'm an open-minded G1er, not a hardcore G1 purist.

Here's another crazy idea for Hasbro to try: give a modern take of G1 characters that never had much screen time...

Examples...
-instead of Bumblebee, stick in Gears of Huffer
-instead of a Ironhide or Bulkhead, stick in Grapple
-instead of a Ratchet or Red Alert, stick in First Aid


Or an even crazier idea...give/make G1 characters that never had a US cartoon role. Like Pretenders without the shell gimmick, Micromasters (so many to choose from), etc.

So many names that can be used, that Ratchet, BUMBLEBEE, Arcee, maybe even Bulkhead can be given a break for a couple of years.

I don't mind the Megatron, Starscream and Soundwave dynamic. Maybe thrown in a Marvel Shockwave personality into the mix.

But I would prefer a new mix of name and alt modes for the Autobots. A "Lugnut" type of large plane, a tank, a submarine, a train, and bulldozer. Throw in a few quirky personalities like a racecar who likes to drive slow, or the submarine who'd rather be a jet, etc.

As for Optimus...I can't see Hasbro changing the piller of the franchise of "Optimus", but give him a something new to work with, we've already had:
-a "leadership decendant" in BW/BM
-a fire truck with a pissed off brother in RiD
-a different kind of truck that combines with anything/anybody with a port in ARM/ENER/CYB
-a rookie Optimus who rose from "bottom of the barrel" to a respected leader in Animated
-currently a G1-ish Optimus due to a different backstory in Prime

It doesn't have to be a drastic change right away, small changes throughout the seasons to make the first ep of season 1 a completely different cast architype to last ep of final season.
(said character changes does not have to mean they died)

 

And characters with beast modes that aren't the Dinobots or G1 Predacons.

 

I definitely want some new characters. Not because of the fiction neccessarily but just to get some toys that isn't an Optimus, Bumblebee, Megatron, Starscream, Ironhide, Ratchet, [insert G1 character here]. The Unicron Trilogy may not have been the best fiction or toys but damn, at least it wasn't a constant rehash. That's one of the mian reasons I hate Animated so much. There were a couple new characters but for the most part it was just rehash after rehash of tired old characters with terrible designs (IMO of course).

Now don't get me wrong, I love G1 characters. They're what I grew up with and I do appreciate Hasbro throwing fans a bone with a great side line like Classics. And of course I understand Hasbro has to use the names or lose them. But honestly I liked the homages a LOT better when there were less of them, not entire cartoons or fiction revolving around retreads of the same damn characters over and over and over again. I may not like the movies or the movie aethetic but at least it was some thing different.

 

I thought RB was being fairly original for Transformers...it doesn't focus on the war and doesn't feature Optimus or BB as main characters. I quite enjoyed BW, partly cause it was something a bit different.

 

Agreed. And to strengthen your argument, not only does RB not focus on the war, Optimus or Bumblebee, and include mostly original robot characters, but there's the COMPLETE ABSENCE OF DECEPTICONS*.  

*Unless that's what you were getting at with "doesn't focus on the war".

 

I've pondered over this qute a bit. What does one do with standby characters in the fandom? If they're repeated too much, the stories run together and nothing's original. But of you completely rid yourself of the recognizable, you don't have anything that connects it to previous iterations other than name.

This is why I like Prime. It's got old characters, but they're totally reimagined. New characters spice up the mix as well. I feel like I'm watching something truly original.

 

I agree Knockout and to some degree Breakdown had an effect on people because they were a bit different - even Arcee I suppose is a little unusual in her own way even though she's a name reuse - she is a trope but no one we see much in Transformers shows on the good guys side.
So though she can be a bit exasperating at times I do like her overall for that reason.

I think this is sort of a two part problem for me one which affects the TV shows and one which affects the Toys.

It's hard to remember sometimes that Bulkhead is for the most part as he exist in his current from (and TF Energon aside) a new Character since TF Animated. so it's not like they are not unprepared to go in a new direction and Bumblebee has pretty much replaced Hotshot now. and Animated did provide Lockdown and Lugnut too as well as Drawing in Blackout from the Movie Universe.

A lot of how a TV show works is down to the inter-team relationships so making a good team seems more important perhaps than pure originality for a TV show.


However from the toy perspective (and toys are my main interest) I do feel a lack of originality can become wearing (along with the to many Bumblebees factor).

We have seen some interesting new Transformation designs in the last few years I just wish that there were more new Characters and perhaps more small teams and sub-groups - I really liked that way of organising the lines and I would like to see that again in some respects.

Considering from 1984 to the early 1990s most Transformers never got more than one or two version of themselves it's quite shocking that we are into several Hundred Bumblebees now.

And I still think there's something just "Wrong" about Weaponizer Bumblebee existing at all. If they wanted to make a giant bumblebee aimed as a christmas toy at very little kids why not make another Powerizer.

I really don't like how Transformers takes such a big dip in none Movie years - are Hasbro going to let the line crash in flames if they have more than a 2 or 3 year gap between movies ? and is every Movie line only going to market Optimus and Bumblebee to the exclusion of all overs.

I still think it's crazy that no effort was put into selling Sideswipe as an Event Character to market the ROTF Movie and Ratchet may as well not even be in DOTM - he does so little.

I remember thinking how exciting it may have seemed waiting to see the new Subgroups and what they'd be like being excited by the Targetmaster Adverts or comic appearances.

But now we have a comic with minimal exposure - nothing at all to do with the current or past toylines or some might say not even that much to establish or perpetuate the franchise except to a tiny minority. so the Comic is no longer a factor to all intents. The TV show is Fine but many of the characters in it don't even have any or many Hasbro toys ; Vehicon Miners, Unicron, Jet Vehicons, Breakdown, Makeshift, Tailgate, Zombie-Decepticons etc...

Where as 99% of who was in Beast Wars got a toy/was a toy. at the moment it feels like Transformers is stumbling a little as it did during Beast Machines - there's a slight feeling of directionlessness.

 

--> This, Japan did it nicely with series like Masterforce and Victory. How cool would it be to see Hasbro do an American/UK series with this formula?
If Hasbro needs to keep the names active, OPs/Megs cameos at best.

 

Shouldn't have cried when Optimus died......and booed Rodimus......

 

Optimus is a blue and red truck with sword and gun hands.
Bumblebee practically shares a transformation with   Bumblebee
Bulkhead is big, green and has a heart
Fembots are still bad characters
Ratchet is an ambulance doctor guy
Megatron has a [bucket head] and is an alien jet (Insert fire effect here)
Wheeljack is Drift with Wheeljack's head
Nobody cares about Seaspray
Sure, Starscream, Soundwave, Knockout, Dreadwing and Breakdown are different, but everyone else is a rehash of old characters.

 

Edited: Reason: More visual aides.

hah

 

They have to keep their trademarks, and since Optimus is essentially the face of transformers, why would they take the risk of doing something new, when he's just so popular?

Not to say I don't wish they would.