We need to talk to a Decepticon.

Discussion in 'Transformers Movie Discussion' started by jestermon, Jun 21, 2010.

  1. jestermon

    jestermon Well-Known Member

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    I confess I have been watching ROTF alot lately, my question Why when they go to the museum to find a Decepticon seeker do they all the sudden freak out when they see the logo?

    This made no sense, it was like in Gundam when everyone would be searching for a Gundam instead of just going we got one, they would freak out and go ITTTT's a GUNDAM.
     
  2. Karhukjnsi

    Karhukjnsi Universal Wrestler

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    The Decepticon they talked to was Wheelie, after that, they only knew that they were gonna see one of the "oldest of the old", it was never stated that the Seeker was a 'Con.
     
  3. billcosby

    billcosby Geewin

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    They were expecting him to be an Autobot.

    Oh, and nothing makes sense in Gundam. It's 20 minutes gasping at exposition and then 2 minutes of fighting.
     
  4. SentinelPrime

    SentinelPrime I NEEDED THAT!

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    Wheelie says they are ancient, and are searching for something, and that he knows where to find them.

    My question is why the heck does Wheelie have tactical data on the location of the Seekers? And furthermore....if Jetfire has been on Earth this whole time, how does he know about the Decepticon/Autobot Civil War?

    Those are the real questions. I'll tell ya how; ALL of the Decepticons have been spawned from the Nemesis crash site.
     
  5. RedWolf

    RedWolf Well-Known Member

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    Because Wheelie didn't tell them which faction he is.

    The little traitor was trying to pull a Starscream. Turns out the old rust bucket doesn't like his boss anymore and did something that is unheard of. Switch sides, at least to Wheelie.

    From the dialogue Jetfire was sent on Earth like many of his ancestors, among them his father a "wheel", to find the Matrix.

    I think assumption was the Decepticons are really a splinter group of the Autobots.
    Seekers predating the current factions.
    Megatron making the betrayal that makes the current Decepticons the same age as the Autobots. Thing is the Fallen wasn't destroyed he hid himself with some of his minions, sending them to scour Earth for the Matrix while he seduced Megatron to create a new Decepticon army.

    I think much like the Maximal Elders and Animated Autobot leaders the Autobot's direct ancestors kept details of the earlier war a secret.
     
  6. SentinelPrime

    SentinelPrime I NEEDED THAT!

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    Actually Jetfire says the Fallen left him there on Earth to rust.

    To me, that says that the Seekers that the Fallen left behind were from that original batch of soldiers that he had.

    Or, I suppose you could look at the comment "he left me here" as in he was given orders to stay there.

    But, Jetfire says his ancestors have been there, and that his ancestor was the "first wheel", which incidentally seems to have been created around the same time as the pyramids. So that inference is that the Seekers were left behind by the Fallen, not sent there.

    Either somehow the Seekers were able to somehow reproduce, or, Jetfire was sent there at a later date and knew his ancestry well. Wheelie says the seekers have been around, they are the oldest of the old...I think the movie is saying the seekers have been there the whole time.

    The problem with the sent later theory is how was the Fallen communicating with Jetfire to send him anywhere? The movie suggests that he was in the crashed remains of the Nemesis this whole time, while the comic says he was (I think this idea is horrible) stuck in another dimension and talking to Megatron through a Sarcophagus, which was unearthed in some Cybertronian ruins.

    If anything, the movie suggests that Transformers made by the allspark are much more in nature to the Decepticons. It seems like the Autobots are the splinter group in the films, and the a Prime can motivate and inspire other robots to be good.
     
  7. Karhukjnsi

    Karhukjnsi Universal Wrestler

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    You gotta remember Jetfire was senile as all hell, he could easily be mistaken/making up stuff and not even realize socks.
     
  8. SentinelPrime

    SentinelPrime I NEEDED THAT!

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    Fair enough...although it's his dialogue that is responsible for actually explaining alot of what is going on in the story. It's mainly what you have to pay attention to to understand it.
     
  9. vektsilver

    vektsilver Transorganic member

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    ya this seems like alot of rationalization and plot hole filling.

    Im going to say that you can not account for what was done in the movie because it was poorly written and directed.

    They did say we need to talk to a decepticon and they sought to find one. Having jetfire be a decepticon and then say he is an autobot almost sounds like an idea in the script fizzled out.

    I think it says alot when writers turn down an easy paycheck because the movie was that bad. Keep in mind they weren t fired they turned down doing the third.
     
  10. trex5000

    trex5000 Autobot

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    ya at first i thought the same thing, i just brushed it off cause i figured it wa something i missed, which it was, that WHEELIE was the decepticon...and the reason is cause the decepticons are all in on the plan to get the shard to bring back megatron who could take down OP so that the fallen would be free to come to earth to steal back the matrix from the tomb of the primes which he would then use to turn on the harvestor and destroy earth's sun to cultivate more energon to grow their 'hatchlings' to raise to become new warriors in the war for cybertron! where as the autobots were not...which is why they were 'porked' unless they spoke to a 'con.
     
  11. jametron

    jametron Release the Kraken!!!!!!!

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    I'll agree with that...

    but you have to get your facts straight. Simmons said "We need to talk to a Decepticon" Mikaela said "No problem" (or whatever she said) and promptly brought in Wheelie from outside and they talked with him. The having to talk to a Decepticon bit has nothing to do with Jetfire at all really.
     
  12. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP Dry built

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    No no no, Wheelie was who they wanted to talk to.
     
  13. Prime82

    Prime82 Optimus knows all

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    my question is why did mikaela say oh s*** its a decepticon. cursing in TF movies not needed. she also says f***ing do something when sam is "dead"
     
  14. Janeails22x

    Janeails22x Collector & Customizer

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    ....and yet, through all of this "was Jetfire banished or left behind" banter, we are failing to see that he was "sleeping" as an SR-71 Blackbird, a machine that has only been around since 1966. He was completely oblivious as to which planet he was on, etc. This would surprise me very much considering he HAD to have been awake long enough to scan the blackbird. And we can't scapegoat "memory" loss because he clearly nested right into Old Man Transformers Storytime without a problem.

    AND Wheelie's stupid eye lasers did not even point to the Smithsonian in DC on the stinking map.

    That whole Jetfire/Seeker/Wheelie bit really bugged me, especially considering is was THE plot driver of the whole film. The movie made leaps and bounds during this monologue, and yet it was still absurd.

    Regardless, Jetfire's design was awesome, I liked the character, and the movie was still fun...though the script was severely whored out.
     
  15. Rayzilla Prime

    Rayzilla Prime I RIP ALL MY RAZE!

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    There's quite a few plot holes that Jetfire filled. He pretty much explains what Energon is (life-blood of the Transformers) and why the Primes couldn't kill The Fallen themselves ("The Fallen was stronger than his brothers, so they had to steal and hide [the Matrix] from him"). I can't argue with the scene of him telling the story, though. Loved how well he meshed with the scenery. Looked like there really was a grouchy SR-71 Transformer standing next to the people.

    Not the best writing, but the plot holes aren't that deep as long as someone puts effort into watching the movie instead of pointing out all of its flaws.

    Considering the previous Decepticon encounters they've had, that dialogue is absolutely necessary. ;) 
     
  16. SilverOptimus

    SilverOptimus Movie News Monster Moderator News Staff

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    Jetfire saying about the Autobot-Decepticon civil war, happened after Fallen banished him to earth. Many years later he took the form of a SR-71 Blackbird and kept his silence. Though he was branded the Decepticon Logo (By Fallen himself) he's an "Autobot/Other Primes" supporter ever since he stood against Fallen.
    -Transformers: Tales Of The Fallen Jetfire by IDW comics-

    I guess he must have learned it all somehow, during his "rest" as a Blackbird. :) 
     
  17. RedWolf

    RedWolf Well-Known Member

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    Except Tales of the Fallen is invalidated as it states Jetfire was around 19,000 years ago serving the Fallen. When in the movie he states for generations his ancestors has been serving the Fallen as Seekers of the Matrix. Not only is the Fallen a terrible guy to work for but if Wheelie's fear of being scrapped for not fulfilling his mission is any indication failure means you're dead if you come back with nothing.

    Generations of service and abandonment plus their boss is really evil made Jetfire finally call it quits as a Decepticon.


    "I got issues of my own it started with my mother. My ancestors have been here for centuries. My Father he was the wheel, the first wheel. Do you know what he transformed into? Nothing! But he did so with honor, dignity!"

    "This planet was visited by our race before. By our earliest ancestors millennium ago. They were on an exploratory mission to harvest energon, the life blood of our race. Without it we would all perish oxidize and rust like my wretched self. Do you have any idea how it is to slowly fall apart and die!"


    Also note Jetfire descended likely from the Fallen's original soldiers. The Nemesis has hatchlings yet lack of Energon makes them die. Which makes me think Jetfire besides being old was spawned Energon deficient as well as the Autobots and Decepticons other than him has been running without the Allspark for at least 12,000 years.
     
  18. Valkysas

    Valkysas Attack Buffalo

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    Way to not know anything about what you're talking about.

    actually, why was Gundam even brought up in this topic? the comparison in the first post doesnt even work. Because, yeah, they were looking for a "seeker". it was never said that the "seeker" would be a decepticon.
     
  19. Krueger

    Krueger Well-Known Member

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    Read what you write before you post it next time.
     
  20. jestermon

    jestermon Well-Known Member

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    Why would the seekers be Autobots? Wheelie knows who they are and it is clearly stated he is a Decepticon 5 seconds before.

    And gundam was used because it is the same concept, if you are purposely looking for something it shouldn't be a great shock if you find it.
     

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