War and Autobots

Discussion in 'Transformers General Discussion' started by Ironhide29, Jun 22, 2010.

  1. Ironhide29

    Ironhide29 Banned

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    In the episode War Dawn when the Aerialbots brought Orion Pax to Alpha Trion the Robots who were inside being reconstructed inside the lab were they the Autobots of G1?? and what confuses me is that in the movie Ultra Magnus, Kup, Hot Rod, Arcee, Blurr, Springer, Wheelie all apear out of nowhere where in season 1 and 2 they never mentioned them, were they on Cybetron when the Original Autobots arrived on Earth?? or they were reconstructed later on?? In War Dawn they only talk about Optimus Prime and Megatron's origin but they dont talk about the rest of the Autobots.

    Thanks.
     
  2. FuryStrike

    FuryStrike Autobot

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    War Dawn Is the episode where the Aerialbots bring Orion Pax to Alpha Trion. I don't remember other robots being reconscructed. In the cartoon, UM, Kup, et al. DO appear out of nowhere in the movie, and they never explain in the cartoon when they come to earth or anything. which is why for my fic, for example, I pull from multiple sources because ONE will have an answer somehwere

    one can assume that not all the autobots were built after that ep, obviously, I mean UM was old. Kup was CERTAINLY old so he was built before then. and Ironhide is old-ish too. so they were around and started fighting.
     
  3. Aernaroth

    Aernaroth <b><font color=blue>I voted for Super_Megatron and Veteran

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    The idea is that the war covers an entire species, and has been raging for literally millions of years. There was plenty of time for new Autobots to be created other than in "War Dawn", and plenty of opportunities for origins that haven't been explicitly spelled out.

    Optimus Prime calls Magnus "old friend", so conceivably Magnus was built during some period between War Dawn and the first episode of Season 1, but not seen because he wasn't part of Prime's forces at the time. We first see him continuity-wise in Scramble City, so it shows that he's trusted and experienced enough to be allowed independent command. Likewise, Kup is described as old, which by Cybertronian standards means he's DAMN old, and could possibly have been built during or before the same era as Prime and Magnus. As for the rest of the guys mentioned in your post, its likely they were built while the earth Autobots were dormant, or after they awakened.

    It's a 25 year old children's cartoon, further complicated by international continuities, time travel, and millions of years of characters in suspended animation. Try not to think about it too hard, or you'll go crazy.
     
  4. Tigertrack

    Tigertrack Back In The Game!

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    What ^he^ said.
     
  5. Skyquake87

    Skyquake87 Well-Known Member

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    Seconded. Just enjoy the cartoon for what it is. It wasn't written with an ongoing narrative like today's cartoons, and its primary function was to sell toys. There are gaps of logic, continuity and common sense all over the place. Not to mention sizing and scale issues, animation errors and a general air of "meh, its just a goofy cartoon about fighting robots" about it.

    Further anaylsis is illogical!
     
  6. RedWolf

    RedWolf Well-Known Member

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    Ariel is implied by Alpha Trion to be Elita-1.

    Dion is either dead or also rebuilt.

    Apparently this way early in the war that Orion Pax and some doesn't even know there is a war going on.

    But as shown in this episode and Omega Supreme's origin episode the Autobots were too reliant on the Guardians for protection.
     
  7. Ironhide29

    Ironhide29 Banned

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    they said Dion could be Ironhide or Ultra Magnus. But what i really want to know is When Prowl, Ratchet, Brawn, Jazz, Sideswipe, Sunstreaker and the rest of the G1 season 1 and 2 Autobots were created except for Prime cause we know he was Orion Pax
     
  8. FuryStrike

    FuryStrike Autobot

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    FANS say that Dion is either Ironhire or UM, as it makes sense in that respect... but the writer of the episode has said (I'm sure we've all read this too) that Dion, and Ariel, were meant to die. Even Orion Pax wasn't supposed to be Prime, if I recall, they were all meant as 1 episode "emotional hooks" to get the Aerialbots to see what schmucks the Decepticons really were.

    I personally think maybe UM myself... but I also played with the idea of Dion being dead and his chassis found and rebuilt as Dion 4 million years later
     
  9. Wheeljack_Prime

    Wheeljack_Prime Don't eat me

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    No one nows. At all. Let's leave it at that.
     
  10. Aernaroth

    Aernaroth <b><font color=blue>I voted for Super_Megatron and Veteran

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    Like people have said in the thread, their origins have not been explicitly stated. We don't know precisely who build them, or when, the same way we know about Optimus Prime (except for the Dinobots, who Wheeljack and Ratchet built on earth).

    Some characters, we know a little bit about their backgrounds from their tech specs or the comics or other continuities (although always remember, what is true in one continuity is not necessarily true in another), like that Mirage was a Cybertronian aristocrat before the war, Bluestreak is still dealing with seeing his entire city destroyed by the Decepticons, etc. etc. But we don't know who rolled off what assembly line and when and what they ate for breakfast that day, if that's what you mean. We can presume that most Autobots are more or less as they were constructed, were retrofitted after the war broke out, or were built during the war for the purpose of being Autobot soldiers. Most Autobots, however, are scientists, explorers, artists or workers as opposed to the more military-based Decepticons, however.

    Is it really that important? Optimus Prime is a special character in the Transformers mythos, that's why we know his story. Why is it important to know every little thing about the other characters?
     
  11. Skyquake87

    Skyquake87 Well-Known Member

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    I never liked the whole Orion Pax/ Optimus Prime thing. He goes from being this wet behind the ears kid to a wise and powerful warrior. Alpha Trion must have given him a hell of an upgrade! At least with Hot Rod there's hints in the movie that he already has what it takes to become such a thing.
     
  12. FuryStrike

    FuryStrike Autobot

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    well thats the thing. Trion DID give him a hell of an upgrade. BUT who's the say he was the wise, experienced leader we know him as Right Away? We don't. Truth be told he probably WASN'T. All in all I think the IDW and even the War With In comics that show his early ears on cybertron as the new Prime would be a good template for any fics set during his first years. Even War For Cybertron might have some good hints.

    I can see him also having to temper his hate and anger agaisnt Megatron, because as Orion, he looked up to Megs because Megs was shiny, new and could fly in robot mode. "Hero" worship, that went horribly wrong. so, depending on how you play it... Orion could have had a worse start as Optimus than Hot Rod did as Rodimus o.o

    of course being a writer, I think about things like that when I'm bored and half asleep... and it IS almost three a.m. *passes around grains of salt* ^^ g'night all
     
  13. Ironhide29

    Ironhide29 Banned

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    Optimus Prime had 9 million years and to me thats plenty of time to finish of Megatron.
     
  14. Aernaroth

    Aernaroth <b><font color=blue>I voted for Super_Megatron and Veteran

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    He spent a lot of it unconscious, to be fair. But what does this have to do with the rest of the thread?
     
  15. FuryStrike

    FuryStrike Autobot

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    nothing, actually. his question about where all the season 3/Movie autobots come from has been answered as: We, as fans, don't know. they just appeared. we can only guess
     
  16. herugrim

    herugrim Defiler of Energon

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    Most of the cast of characters introduced in and after the movie have a more cybertronian look to their vehicle modes so it seems likely that they came along much later and didn't need to scan local vehicles for a mode to hide as.

    I prefer Optimus' toon origins to his comic versions for the most part. The comic books tend to make him into a passive and even apathetic character, wereas in the cartoon he was a strong character even in his youth, though a bit tempermental at times. In the comics he just sounds too much like Rodimus Prime sometimes to me.
     
  17. RedWolf

    RedWolf Well-Known Member

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    In the Files of Teletran-One those introduced Autobots (Ultra Magnus, Springer, Hot Rod, Kup, Arcee,Sky Lynx, Wreckgar) reunited with the main Autobot force (under Optimus Prime) from all over the galaxy.

    According to the Movie's narrator the Autobots have been totally driven off Cybertron by the Decepticons. Meaning whatever hinted Autobot presence in The Ultimate Doom on Cybertron that made Optimus hesitate has to totally evacuate or be destroyed. That also mean likely that Elita-1's crew was finally destroyed by the Decepticons.

    Also note the Decepticon numbers have increased. Perhaps indicating Megatron during those 20 years has been consolidating his forces that likely is scattered around the galaxy during the 3rd Great War. Optimus has been too but it was too late.
     
  18. Ironhide29

    Ironhide29 Banned

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    the female Autobots were destroyed that way?? we only see them once.
     
  19. Aernaroth

    Aernaroth <b><font color=blue>I voted for Super_Megatron and Veteran

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    Yes, and never again, though we hear Cybertron is lost to the Autobots. That means its likely something happened to them between S2 and the movie. Maybe not destroyed, but driven off-world to somewhere else. We don't know for sure.
     
  20. Ironhide29

    Ironhide29 Banned

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    is Ironhide as old as Prime?? cause i remember in the episode the Immobilzer Prime goes we shall miss Ironhide old friend, just wondering
     

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