Victory

Discussion in 'Transformers General Discussion' started by power3921, May 14, 2010.

  1. power3921

    power3921 Well-Known Member

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    I decided that I would watch EVERY episode of EVERY seris of transformers, except posibly Japanesse beast wars given the no dup or good translations yet. But Victory, Im just not enjoying it. I watched about 7 episodes and got bored. It didn't seem to have any overall plot. Beforwe i give up on it it, does anything happeen? I dont wantt to know what it will be aboout, just does it get a real overall plot?
     
  2. Sol Fury

    Sol Fury The British Butcher Administrator News Staff

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    It does pick up a bit more once you get to the halfway mark and the rest of the Destron forces get introduced.
     
  3. chrisr291

    chrisr291 Master of the Unknown

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    Damn... and I like Victory the most. Give it time!! you haven't even seen Lio Kaiser, Victory Saber....
     
  4. Chris McFeely

    Chris McFeely Well-Known Member

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    Good MAN! That is, in fact, how you should feel about Victory. It IS immensely dull. :)  It gets better at the halfway point when they start going off-planet, and so the settings for the stories change and things actually start leading into one another. It never really gets a PLOT, per se, beyond the idea that "Deathsaurus must recharge his fortress" - it's all still just "steal energy". But the stories in which they steal energy do start to interlink and some continuing threads do emerge. But the first half is a real slog of the same story over and over, without the benefit of any interesting heroes or credible villains. I absolutely consider it the worst of the three Japanese G1 series.
     
  5. Sangron

    Sangron Well-Known Member

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    Yep I was bored with it too but after 15 episodes I was hooked. Best Japanese G1 series IMO.
     
  6. chrisr291

    chrisr291 Master of the Unknown

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    lol, no really, tell us how you really feel:thumbs2: :dj 


    Victory, like others have said, BEST JAPANESE G1 SERIES!!! :thumbs2:  If you give up on it now, your really going to be missing some great stuff.
     
  7. Valkysas

    Valkysas Attack Buffalo

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    Victory is painfully dull.

    Masterforce is my favorite of the japanese G1 series.
     
  8. destrongerlupus

    destrongerlupus #MoreSawBoss

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    Slow start, addictingly fun by the end
     
  9. Backscatter

    Backscatter Autobot Brainmaster TFW2005 Supporter

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    I was very impressed with Victory's Brainmasters. I guess I'm easy to please when it comes to Transformers. Most of the time.
     
  10. Prime Noble

    Prime Noble Well-Known Member

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    I've started watching it with the subtitles and the sound down. I downloaded all the music from the old G1 series from TFCog.net and flick between tunes where apropriate. Really enjoying it.

    TFCog also have redubbed most of the Victory series. They do a very good job apart from that guy who voices Hellbat. Why they keep using him is beyond me.

    Their Headmasters dubs are great too.

    I like the Victory series. Much better written than any US cartoon. No stupid weapon of the week or Lord Chumley or Kremzeek. The Decepticons stealing energy makes a lot of sense, they did it all the time in Marvel.

    Love Gripper!!! He's like a cross between Prowl and Springer, only cool.

    The animation is good and the fights are nicely choreographed.
     
  11. Chris McFeely

    Chris McFeely Well-Known Member

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    As far as I'm concerned, that's a mark against it. WITHOUT a weapon-of-the-week, the first dozen episodes are all the bloody same. "Decepticons try to steal energy. They attack a power plant or an oil tanker. Autobots stop them. The end." There is never anything quirky or funny or DISTINCTIVE or ENTERTAINING about it until the scenarios for these cut-and-paste battles start changing.
     
  12. Prime Noble

    Prime Noble Well-Known Member

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    I don't want quirky. I want intelligent and realistic.
     
  13. Furious Rodimus

    Furious Rodimus Matrix Bearer

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    I'm re-watching it with my wife, and the first bit has been a slog: Decepticons attack, look like they're winning and then Star Saber then chinchinchin pui!

    I like the designs, and the characters (especially Leozack/Liokaiser) and what the series gets going it does so in fine style. But I really prefer Masterforce for its story.
     
  14. Chris McFeely

    Chris McFeely Well-Known Member

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    Well, you certainly don't get that with Victory either. The Autobots seem to be losing, and then Star Saber appears and beats the Decepticons, and it's over. I want the metal-eating space-bugs and the Leozack-in-a-Star-Saber-shell and the raise-Atlantis plots, not the same "Star Saber wins a fight for an oilfield" plot a dozen times over.
     
  15. chrisr291

    chrisr291 Master of the Unknown

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    But isn't that all Masterforce is (well, all Transformer series till that point)?

    God Ginrai shows up, beats up everyone and the day is saved. They fight for energy, etc etc. I just wasn't a big fan of Masterforce because of all the children. THe kids yell out their Power Ranger calls and become robots.

    I dunno, doesn't seem like Victory is getting a fair chance when you over simplify it like that. They have some great stuff,

    SPOILER
    The death of Ginrai was great! Also, Hellbat taking out deathcobra was complete unexpected. I think Masterforce would of been better if they excluded the children.

    Plus, the Masterforce decepticons never seemed to even have a chance against the Autobots. King Poseidon can't defeat anyone, even on day one. Sure, Dinoking eventually becomes the comic relief but he is never downgraded into a weakling. Up until the ending, he was kicking ass.
     
  16. Chris McFeely

    Chris McFeely Well-Known Member

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    Well, "good guys win" is basically... ALL cartoons. But Masterforce, in it's first... *counts* ...let's say seven episodes alone, has plots about zombies, kidnappings, wild animal stampedes, family members dying, characters meeting and becoming friends and enemies, characters undergoing sudden and amazing transformations and struggling with their own personal limitations. In contrast, every episode from the same portion of Victory is the same thing, with the only change being the target of the Decepticons' raids. It's like "Friends" - "the one with the theme park", "the one with the jungle", "the one with the desert".... The biggest differentiations being what combiner gets introduced in each episode.

    Understand, mind you, that my gripe is specifically directed at the first half of Victory. Once it crosses over the halfway point, it DOES become more entertaining. Where in comparison, Masterforce does stumble a bit, with the Headmaster Juniors and Pretenders getting sidelined so Ginrai can win nearly every fight. But even in the face of THAT, Masterforce is HUGELY rich in character - nearly everyone is fantastically fleshed out. The Autobots in Victory are all completely interchangeable, with the only distinctions between their personalities being that brief time that Blacker and Wingwaver didn't get along very well for two episodes. They're all caught up in the dreadful rigid military formation that the Japanese Transformers series are infuriatingly insistent on imposing upon the Autobots, whereas Masterforce was not. The Decepticons in Victory are the only characters in the show with personalities (and even then, it's only two members out of each of the six-man teams who GET personalities) and they're all jokes except when combined (but I admit, I grew to love the Dinoforce). It's true that the Decepticon Pretenders are reduced to comic relief by the end of Masterforce, but with King Poseidon, he's just defeated because he's fighting outside of his weight class. Even in the show's second-to-last episode, he is still treated as a genuine threat by Metalhawk and damages him badly. And BlackZarak, Overlord, Buster and Hydra are still treated as huge threats by the end.
     
  17. chrisr291

    chrisr291 Master of the Unknown

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    I'm going to watch Masterforce again and i'll be back with a rebuttal.. yessss...

    Zombies? hhmm... I don't remember that one, now I really have to watch it because I love zombies. Honestly, like i've said previously, I would of like Masterforce more if the show didn't have so many kids. Even the adults annoyed me, double dealer and the couple that piloted overlord were terrible. The witch and her boyfriend....


    The show ended with a lot of promise however. To bad the show didn't do that 10 episodes back because that would of completely salvaged the series for me.
     
  18. Chris McFeely

    Chris McFeely Well-Known Member

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    See, I can only assume that's an attitude copped off the simple fact that they're human and not robots. They've all got more personality and infinitely more depth than anyone in Victory. To call Giga and Mega (Overlord) terrible? A couple who died young, only to be reborn through Devil Z's powers, and who warped the Decepticons they gathered around them into the family they could never have? Who sought domination of the world and used robots to do it, but at the same time held dear their humanity and the power of their human spirit, putting them at odds with both their leader AND their troops? Who thought they were the trusted second-in-command only to discover they were expendable? Who rebelled against their leader not because they wanted to usurp him like every other G1 turncoat, but because of true, emotional, irreconcilable ideological differences in their goals? They're GREAT characters. I mean, compare them with Deathsaurus. "RAR STAR SABER YOU HAZ BLOWED UP MY CASTLE I HATEZ YOO." And that's it.
     
  19. chrisr291

    chrisr291 Master of the Unknown

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    Was all that explained in the cartoon?

    [​IMG]

    I'm just not a big fan of Humans piloting Transformers. Sure, you can follow the Wizard of Oz witch but i'll stand behind Deszaras


    [​IMG]


    Also, Deszaras has his own awesome backstory.

     
  20. Chris McFeely

    Chris McFeely Well-Known Member

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    Heck, don't gotta quote me that about Deathy - I wrote it! :)  And I'm afraid I was actively trying to make "sits on his throne and does nothing for fifteen episodes" sound better in the telling than it was in the cartoon. ;) 

    As to Mega and Giga, yes, all of that was covered in the cartoon. But unlike Deathsaurus, it was not merely "explained" through an info-dumping flashback or something, it was a steady evolution of their characters that we watched unfold in front of us as their circumstances changed and their attitudes were altered by them.

    Additionally, I always metaphorically kick people in the shin when they say Masterforce features humans "piloting" Transformers. They don't pilot them - they ARE Transformers. The concept is exactly the same as the Japanese take on the Headmasters series, in which a smaller robot connects to a larger robot body and BECOMES that robot. It's just that in Masterforce, it's humans, not robots. They don't "pilot" them anymore than Chromedome "piloted" his Transtector when he plugged into its neck and merged with it. "Pilot" is not, of course, inherently INCORRECT to describe this process, but when people use it to talk about Masterforce, they always use it out of distaste, to imply that the robots of Masterforce are somehow "lesser", when nearly everything about them, from physical power to character depth, is greater.
     

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