To all those who plan to hate the movie:

Discussion in 'Transformers Movie Discussion' started by mblase, Aug 30, 2006.

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  1. mblase

    mblase Well-Known Member

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    Here, let me get this out of my system once and for all. I dearly hope it won't turn into a rant, but I make no promises.

    Who here saw the "Lord of the Rings" movies? Show of hands...

    ...all right, let's ask "Who didn't?" All right, you in the back can head off to Blockbuster's, we'll send you the URL for when you get done.

    All right, some of you may recall all the hubbub that went on after the first movie, "The Fellowship of the Ring", was released and viewed en masse by the fans and non-fans alike. And you may also recall how infuriated many were at the removal of Tom Bombadil, the rewrite of how Merry and Pippin joined the fun, the changes in what happened when with Gollum, and even the ongoing debate over (of all things) whether or not a Balrog has wings.

    Peter Jackson took all of these in stride, partially because he's a professional who hears much more severe and binding complaints from people he actually answers to, and partially because he knew he'd get even worse complaints at the changes he'd made in "The Two Towers". And it's not as if those were frivolous changes, because he'd spent ten years shopping that movie around before anyone let him make it. In fact, he was lucky at all to get to make three movies instead of two.

    But do any of you remember what his answer to his critics was, in the documentary interviews?

    It went something like this (I'm paraphrasing, but the essense is there): "This is my movie. It is my interpretation of the books. That's all it is. If you disagree with it, or dislike it, you're welcome to make your own movie based on your interpretation."

    Based on the ticket and DVD sales for any one of those three films, I think it's safe to say the majority agreed with Peter Jackson.

    He made a darn good movie trilogy based on those three books -- books which, by the way, were voted "Most influential work of literature of the 20th century" by people who know what they're talking about, and which therefore have a strong following the likes of which we TransFans can only dream -- and it was, by any definition of the words, a complete success.



    Now, Michael Bay has been as tactful as he can be to those fans who voice their opinions in his direction. I shall now attempt to be the same:

    Friends, TransFans, Countrymen... if you don't like the designs he's using, or the script he's working from, or the alt modes he's licensed, or the way he's rewritten the Transformers' origin (as opposed to, say, the way "RiD" or "Beast Wars" or the comic book or "Armada/Energon" rewrote it), then consider your complaints noted and, with all due respect, ignored, in favor of the professionals he's working with every single day. They may not be TransFans, they may not post on this board (at least not openly), but they know a heck of a lot more about writing, designing and marketing a successful mass-market film than you do.

    Remember that Michael Bay's financial responsibility to your individual vision is ten, perhaps twenty bucks. Forty if you add in the DVD.

    Even if you counted all the vocal haters on these boards, you might end up with one-half of one percent of the audience he's expecting to reach. A good take from this movie's opening weekend would be over $100 million. Total domestic profits? Over $200 million. And then they're the entire international audience, including Japan....

    $200 million versus twenty bucks. That's what you and your complaints are competing with. And without judging, I'm willing to bet he's got more experience in making a $200 million movie than you do. (In fact, he's made at least two of them.)

    He's not "raping your childhood". If your entire childhood revolved around Transformers cartoons and toys, you have bigger problems than either he or I can deal with via the Internet. Besides, you still have the G1 DVD boxed sets and the animated movie in their original, unaltered forms to treasure and watch over and over again. You could probably spend the entire opening weekend watching them one after the other and still not be finished by the time you have to go back to work.

    If you still don't like his approach at all, to the point where you actively boycott the film, then you're welcome to write your own film and get it made. It's hard work, it takes a long time, and you've got a lot of people in front of you with better résumés... but you wouldn't be the first to break into Hollywood that way. Your odds are better than you might think.

    Go for it, really. We'll all be behind you one thousand percent. A few of us might even help fund your dream, although we'd probably have to spend a little time selling our collections on eBay to come up with the cash. Come back here when you're done and scream "I TOLD YOU SO!!" at the top of your caps lock key as much as you like. You'll have earned the right.
     
  2. smkspy

    smkspy is one nice fucking kitty

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    um, okay...and now back to the complaining!

    Seriously, I'm gonna spend MY money on this movie so I can say whatever the fuck I want to say about.

    I've never flamed any person on here that likes the movie, but I'm fucking sick and tired of getting flamed because I like talking about how far gone away from Transformers this movie heading.

    Edit:::and the majority of the movies translates pretty damn well into the books. Because no book is presented in exactly the same fashion in the movie as it was written. Look at Jurassic Park...the 3 movies combined were the plot of the original book. However, like JP and LOTR, most movies based off of reference material resemble the reference!
     
  3. Kittie Rose

    Kittie Rose Banned

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    ... you do realise this movie is being directed my Michael Bay, who hasn't had a hit since the 90s right?

    ... you do realise that this movie is being produced by the producer of League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, a man who has made sticky topics attacking particular people he in the fandom who disagree with him, to the cheers of several brainwashed "fans"?

    ... you do realise several people from Catwoman are working on this?

    ... you do realise Hollywood cashins that stray from the source(any source) tend to be a BAD thing rather than a "breath of fresh air", right?

    ... you do realise that this movie is sounding more and more like the Masters of the Universe movie?

    ... you do realise how prominent and no doubt propogandic a role the US military have in this?

    ... you do realise how most of the designs thus far don't really look like anything, except perhaps Bionicle?

    I could go on. But whatever, people do have good reasons to "hate" this movie at this stage. Anyone who insists otherwise is just being an ass. You can like the movie without making others feel immature for not doing so.
     
  4. Dark_Convoy

    Dark_Convoy Old Bastard Veteran

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    Here's the thing, I have seen the designs, and I am mostly OK with them, I have read the script and it seems like a pretty decent action flick. - but it is entirely possible that when I actually see it on screen that it will completely suck out loud, on the other hand it could turn out amazing.

    All I can do is comment on what I see now, as are all the other folks on the net, some people don't like the designs, others don't like the script, and are well within their rights to voice their opinion on it, but in the grand scheme of things we can't make a complete formative opinion until July 4th.

    Until then, it's only about the direction things are going and rather or not we like the designs/story.
     
  5. Silver Bullit

    Silver Bullit Banned

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    I don't think anyone is actually "planning" on hating the movie.

    SB
     
  6. smkspy

    smkspy is one nice fucking kitty

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    oh, I've planned it all out. i have a map and everything. :rock 
     
  7. Omnibus Prime

    Omnibus Prime I'm too old for this shit TFW2005 Supporter

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    :peoples: 

    And we're comparing this to a live-action movie based on a cartoon whose sole intent, in every incarnation since its inception, is to advertise toys to children, why?
     
  8. Fairy Princess

    Fairy Princess Banned

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    You'll get over it.
     
  9. Soundwarp

    Soundwarp Next victim please TFW2005 Supporter

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    I am a huge LOTR fan having read it 5 times, so i can say it was a good thing that they did in changing that movie. Otherwise people would have been shocked at a huge GAY Lumberjack looking person dancing around the hill side (Tom). In my opinion what they are doing to Transformers is MURDER. But i will wait and see the movie.
     
  10. Random Autobot

    Random Autobot Soviet Kanukistani

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    Erm, no one is complaining about certain characters not being included. No one is complaining about how certain characters come to arrive on earth. No one is complaining about changes that were made in service of the story and the film.

    LOTR made changes, yes. All adaptations do. However, those changes made senase in the overall flow of the films, just like all good changes do. You didn't see Gollum on screen as some 20 foot tall thing with random bits of bone sticking out of it and a 5 foot long tongue. Aragorn wasn't suddenly a woman for no apparent reason.

    The characters in the film version still looked like their descriptions in the book, more or less. They also looked like they belonged in the same universe, that they inhabited the same world. Not so with "Transformers".

    So far, Prime and Bumblebee look like they come from a completely different film than Megatron, Blackout and Starscream do. They have so drastically changed two of the most recognizable decepticons in the franchise for no apparent reason, other than because they can. They have tossed out elements of the TF aesthetic randomly. Yes, I understand that they cannot be blocky, and I do not want them to be. But they also don't need to look like skeletons with random shards of metal strewn across their bodies.

    These are legitimate concerns, and this is only from the visual aspect of the film. The script itself needs a lot of work to not be horrible. The dialogue is atrocious. The lack of characterization for every Robot that's NOT Prime and Bumblebee is glaring. The basic plot is not bad at all, even I do keep waiting for Gwildor to show up looking for the cosmic key. Still, the thing needs a lot of work.
     
  11. Laser_Optimus

    Laser_Optimus Your opinion was noted. Now get lost. TFW2005 Supporter

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    You know, I've got to agree with Dark Convoy on this. From what I've seen, I like most of the designs. The only ones I don't really like are Starscream (not because he doesn't look "G1", but because he's got AT-ST legs) and Megatron (because he simply doesn't look like a TF IMPO). Still, I do enjoy most of the other designs... even Bumblebee's face looks cool to me. Sure, it doesn't make him look cutesy, but this is an action flick.

    As far as the script, I've read it. It's also interesting to note that the film is at least six months old. I'm sure some of it's changed a bit and even if it hasn't it reads like a good sci-fi/action flick. Aside from the pointless death of one character, the lack of characterization for any TF outside of Bumblebee and Optimus Prime (sorry guys, I don't think Megs really even gets an characterization) and the weird Megs & Prime = brothers, I think it's got potential and I'm not willing to hate it just yet.

    That being said, I do reserve the right to openly hate this movie WHEN I've seen it and IF everything that I see that I like right now doesn't come together well. I'm going to wait to see if they pull this off or not. Don Murphy and his kiddie rants are inconsequential to the point of me not giving a damn what the man says. Either way, I'll still see the film and than I'll decide wether I love it or hate it.

    Yes, this movie has alot of potential to be like LotR or Batman Begins, but I also see what alot of people are complaining about. Some of the takes are very much off base with the mythos in general (and I'm not just talking G1, I'm talking everything from G1 to Cybertron) and could easily push this into the Catwoman, MotU realm. Hopefully, it won't be that bad. Funny thing though... with both of those, if you ignore what they're supposed to be... they're at least a fun way to pass an hour or so.

    Actually, as a child I really loved the MotU movie... sure I watch it now and cringe, but as a seven year old who was super into the MotU franchise I loved it. I wonder how many children whom love TFs will love this movie even if the oldschool fans don't?
     
  12. Optimus Mettle

    Optimus Mettle Member

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    Rock on Princess...if you really hate it so much, here's a crazy idea...DON'T SEE IT. Mblase was a lil condesending but seriously in the end he's right. We all have are opinions and we all have the right to voice them but people if you really want to see TF G1 the movie go buy the DVD. If you want to see a summer blockbuster with lots of explosions and real world interpretations of our beloved TFs then I'll see you at the theater. This movie has no original material to be based on other than the idea of large trnasforming robots whose war spreads to our planet. Change is good. I mean there are so many people that hated on Marvel's Ultimate line of comics and they're selling great. Awesome stories and fresh takes on old ideas and stories. X-men: Evolution was a new take on the X-men story and you know what it was amazing. The Batman a frsh revised take on Batman's earlier years is killing saturday morning TV. I love them all. This to me is a very similar thing. CHANGE is good. to quote someone on here "Think outside the Energon CUbe"
     
  13. Foster

    Foster Super Mod

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    In LOTR, did the Hobbits at least look like Hobbits?
     
  14. ZeroMayhem

    ZeroMayhem Henshin a Go-Go Baby!

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    Ah, if only Peter Jackson was a hardcore TF fan.
     
  15. Soundwarp

    Soundwarp Next victim please TFW2005 Supporter

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  16. Valkysas

    Valkysas Attack Buffalo

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    I've been a TF fan since 84. I've never dropped out of transformers, every single year of my life, I've been with them. I am a hardcore, lifelong fan.

    I have read the earliest draft of the script. I liked it a lot. the TFs were mostly in character, there's a ton of TF/Human interaction, and lots of transformers pounding the crap out of each others. Reading the script, I also FULLY understand and accept Megatron's new look.

    I cant wait for the movie.
     
  17. Shaun_C

    Shaun_C The REAL One True fan Veteran TFW2005 Supporter

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    Really,you never dropped out?

    I guess a SMALL part of me never stopped liking it.I never saw ROOP untill I went to Blockbuster one day (I believe I was 13-15).I remember in High School I used to read the UK comic scans and the comics on BotCon.com
     
  18. Codimus Prime

    Codimus Prime Missouri Toy Hunter

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    I'm just happy that someone has taken on the daunting task. I wouldn't want that weight on my shoulders. Hopefully Mr. Bay will be happy with his product while keeping true at heart to the fans of the series.

    This film will hopefully help usher in a new series of fans that will keep the toy line and the story line alive.
     
  19. cliffjumperx

    cliffjumperx Well-Known Member

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    nah, i'm pretty sure that the hobbits were about 3 feet taller than the elves, they shaved their feet, and had their mouths removed.. but no one minded because at least peter cullen got to voice gandalf.
     
  20. Kittie Rose

    Kittie Rose Banned

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    I don't like these "I've been a super big TF fan since 1984 and I don't have a problem with the changes!"

    Well other people do. So please just accept that. I'll admit I've only been a fan since 89 since I was only born the year the movie came out, and until a few months ago I was a very casual fan, mainly making jokes and references rather than collecting the toys. But that doesn't make me any less attatched to the characters(possibly moreso - people who have followed all the different spin-offs since have probably got more and more accumstomed to thinking of them as toys and little more; I collect characters, not toys).

    I don't think people realise how odd it is that a large portion of the fanbase flings themselves in defense of some pretty shoddy changes. I mean, how are these changes any different to "Loonatics"? Or any other XTREEEM!!!1 updates. And why is it that almost everyone that likes the designs not only fails to see why it's a bad idea for that design to be promoted as that character in a mainstream movie, but also seems to hold some level of resentment towards those who do not like the design?
    I think it is evidence that people are being subtly manipulated by Nelson, Murphy and co. I mean, look at Don Murphy's posts, trying to appeal to people's sense of being a "fan". How ridiculous. But much like "grow the hell up" works on anyone who dares have their hair a different colour to one people can be born with, this attack on the fan's maturity has worked marvellously.

    Please don't be a dumbass. The fans have every right to be upset. The more you call them whiny babies the more it's blatant you're not even thinking for yourself, but acting as a vector for viral marketting.
     
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