The -NEW- END ALL BE ALL Masterpiece Speculation Thread

Discussion in 'Transformers Toy Discussion' started by GogDog, Dec 1, 2011.

  1. Sam

    Sam 250 days

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    When TT release the same characters again, they tend to avoid doing the same kinds of repaints. It's why MP-10 was never repainted into Magnus, we never got a sleep mode, it's why MP-11 got MP-11S first, and why 11-SW and 11T were exclusives. Even MP-1B was different from MP-10B. So there's actually precedence in the MP line that we'd get a black/gold Autobot MP-28 repaint rather than a black/green/purple Decepticon repaint.
     
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  2. Aussiebot

    Aussiebot Well-Known Member

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    See I don't understand that. If someone really has genuine inside information, why would they not want to share it?

    Hell, if I had a source that was providing genuine & legit info, I'd be telling anybody & everybody :) 
     
  3. Lex79

    Lex79 Well-Known Member

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    What if the legit informations are somewhat confidential?
     
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  4. Lbsammills51

    Lbsammills51 Well-Known Member

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    Not really?

    MP-10B wasn't wholly different from MP-1B though; it was still black/greenish (with red over pink this time) instead of, say, black/gold or even black/gold/blue (which Takara had done before, with things like Black Big Convoy and Amazon JP's RotF Leader Prime, plus Prime's Dark Guard Optimus just a few months before MP-10B; under this logic I would've understood them doing MP-10B in black/gold to "switch it up," yet they didn't). It was different in terms of shades used, but not in terms of the "traditional" Black Convoy black/green colors that we often get. The only major differences here is this version was designated as a Destron/Decepticon and not just a black version of Optimus, and it was a retail release (that they've since re-released again), meaning they had no problem not only repeating themselves, but doing so in a broader fashion than with a store or convention exclusive.

    As for your other examples - Magnus/White Prime was surprising at the time that it didn't show up at all, but Sleep Mode? That's one of the only times they did Corpse Prime, ever. Expecting redos of Black & White Primes from MP-10 made sense, but not Ashy Gray Corpsebot that they did once. Is anyone really assuming they'll jump straight to Corpse Prime as the first redeco of V3 Prime instead of Black Convoy (or something more random, like the BAPE/7-11-type exclusives we've been getting lately)? The Seekers? Sunstorm was odd, but was also still an exclusive, just like every other MP-11 redeco. That seems to speak more towards Takara's habit of not believing many Seekers can support a retail release too close together. I also don't think anyone's expecting Takara to not do Gold Megs or King Grimlock again simply because they need to "switch it up," but more because MP-5G is one of the only non-Lucky Draw Gold Megs we've ever received and same with a Marvel-based Grimlock. They're just not evidence Takara wants to keep doing them in the first place, let alone that they're motivated to move away from them to avoid redundancy.

    So no, sorry, I still don't see how any of those means black/gold Rodimus is the more likely option just because they feel the need to not repeat themselves. I mean, we're looking at a V3 Prime sooner around the bend then we thought, and the + series is still going and attempting subtle variations (Sideswipe/Prowl that are barely different than straight re-releases. Takara has no problem repeating what they've already done or subtly tweaking it. I do agree black/gold's possible, but still not likely. I don't see a firm set of circumstances from this line that says that.

    One possible explanation is the source of such information could be compromised if people just start freely throwing info out there in public, especially if it is directly sourced. This isn't national security; toys aren't worth fucking with people's jobs over.
     
  5. Sam

    Sam 250 days

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    Yes, I 100% believe the first repaint of v3 Optimus will be sleep mode.

    My point was that @HolyCulture's reasoning does have some logic behind it. You can disagree with the reasoning, but it still exists. I mean, who expected an AKOM repaint of Hot Rod before a black one? That's TT, mixing things up.

    Anyway, I can see your logic, and I can see his. Either way, I couldn't give a flying fuck about a black Hot Rod repaint. Maybe we'll get a fully black one with different sets of stickers. It's just as likely they won't bother repainting him anytime soon; they'll be reissuing a regular MP-28 anyway when they release Kup and/or Arcee.
     
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  6. stevej

    stevej Well-Known Member

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    Interesting. I was always under the impression (admittedly weighted not by facts but by some of the more vocal proponents of the more 'toon' direction on these forums) that the latest figures like Sunstreaker and Megatron were selling like hot cakes. This indicates that may not be the case. What's especially worrying is that these aren't b-list characters!

    It's completely anecdotal of course but outside of this thread (I'm talking about the UK discussion thread and the 3rd party forum) there has been a not insignificant backlash against the cartoon direction. For some the change in aesthetics - while gradual since the early MP-20s - has turned them off the line completely. For some it's the transformations themselves that are now a chore rather than a pleasure. A poll I ran a while ago implied at best a 50/50 split over the new direction on these forums.

    Folks always point out (rightly so) that we on TFW are a) Western centric and b) only a very small part of the larger TF collecting fanbase but perhaps that doesn't mean we're completely unique either. A new Optimus in this instance sounds like a desperate attempt to get everyone fully onboard with the new direction (that and the + releases we've been seeing). I guess we'll never know how things would have progressed had the direction not changed.

    Oh, and before everyone chimes in I'm aware there's a thing in Japan at the minute for anime-accuracy which has no doubt been a strong factor in the line's evolution.

    The new MP Optimus may be make or break time. A lack of sales from people 'upgrading' their MP-10s may hit them hard.

    Fwiw, I just don't believe there are thousands of potential collectors out there who have ignored this line up until now, all waiting for a cartoon accurate Optimus Prime to come along. The folks who were in their childhood during G1 are right now passing the point at which they may be looking for some nostalgia from their childhood and quickly getting to the point where kids/responsibilities are at their greatest. If they're not already on board I'm not sure another Prime will necessarily bring them on board.
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2018
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  7. Sam

    Sam 250 days

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    Good points here.

    Still, I didn't collect Transformers at all anymore until MP-1 came out. I wonder if a really toon-accurate Prime would be able to achieve that same effect, 16 years later, except this time it's bringing people into a line with an established scale and a host of characters already released and still to come.

    I think it would be good if everybody on these boards took to Twitter to show their support for the line, at least that's a platform that we know the design team actually uses. Then, you'd probably have a bunch of dicks tweeting 'fail Kobayashi fail', so maybe not :lol 

    For what it's worth, I would most certainly call Sunstreaker a B-list character ;) 
     
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  8. stevej

    stevej Well-Known Member

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    But... but... but... Original Ark Crew!!!

    I suppose the fact is we'll never really know what the sales are like for these figures. Or what Takara take away from the sales data. Maybe the higher prices are the off-putting factor and not the aesthetic choices (again, reading others on these forums implies more the latter).

    I still don't really see that many new people suddenly being brought into the line with a new Prime. We already had MP-01/MP-04/MP-10/Hasbro versions/repaints and reissues. We've been at the point where a new collector had enough to entice them for some time.

    Imho there's only one thing that would bring in a LOT of new collectors and that's new media. A new G1 cartoon or a very G1 inspired movie would bring folks to this line in droves. Another new toy? Not so much. A little perhaps if Takara really push it but like I said, they risk putting some folks off the line further which will dent that new interest.
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2018
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  9. Sam

    Sam 250 days

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    I can see where you're coming from. Maybe you're right, those people who would've been tempted into buying Transformers as adults would already have bought MP-1 or MP-10 by now. New G1 inspired media would be great right about now. Maybe Bumblebee appearing as a Beetle in his new movie will ignite some interest in the original cartoon once again.

    In any case, I think Takara are being smart by introducing this Prime very slowly. A tease of line-art in a magazine to start off, so that people can at least get used to the idea of a new Prime. A slow but sure way of winning them over. Hopefully they'll go to the effort of making an awesome promotional video, like they did for Magnus and Dinobot, and they're doing now for the Diaclone line.


    It's definitely hard for me to come at this objectively, because I've wanted a cartoon accurate Prime since the line began. It's kinda selfish, but if a cartoon Prime ends up being the last hurrah for the line which then goes downhill, I'd at least be incredibly satisfied that we finally got him. Sure, I'd love to have the Ark crew lined up on a shelf, but I can more than content myself with playing around with MP-36 and MP-V3OP, plus the solid bots we've gotten like Ironhide, Shockwave, Soundwave, Prowl, Sunstreaker et al. In this 'worst-case' scenario I'd be pretty happy if they redid the A-listers like Grimlock and Starscream too (which I think will happen eventually, anyway).


    But I don't think it'll get to that point. Nostalgia sells. More and more collectors will come around to the new direction.
     
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  10. Aussiebot

    Aussiebot Well-Known Member

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    Exactly right. This isn't national security so I doubt anybody would lose their job if a little bit of a hint gets dropped...
     
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  11. Deruji

    Deruji 小説家と翻訳者

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    I can see the current release of the translated original G1 comics in Japan also sparking interest in newer and older fans. Which could lead to renewed interest in the cartoon and more demand.
     
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  12. jackisking

    jackisking Well-Known Member

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    If thats true, it would mean sells are still not where they want them in Japan. I dont know about the recent new MPs.Go to any of the japanese etailers the only MPs not Sunstreaker are all repaints/reissues in stock. Go to the Yodabashi site and Sunstreaker is sold out. Bringing out a new Prime does make sense, since hes such a big draw, Maybe they expected more gangbuster- like numbers and feel a new Prime would be big enough to bring Japanese collectors back.
    On the other side movie stuff has an advantage because there has always been movies going on with a new line of movie toys. G1 hasn't had that in Japan or anywhere and the LG line must not have been doing a good enough job. Chances are they try to get a anniversary showing or something for TFTM for the anniversary in Japan to coincide with new Prime.
     
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  13. Trailbreaker77

    Trailbreaker77 Veteran TFW2005 Supporter

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    Expect a lot more + (anime) repaints getting released after Prime. Easier money plus the demand will rise for those new collectors and those that have not yet jumped on the + bandwagon.

    I wonder the reaction around here for a version 3 of Starscream after the recently wrapped coneheads? Hmmmmmm
     
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  14. stevej

    stevej Well-Known Member

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    As much as it's needed it's one hell of a big ask to get someone to want to replace 6+ figures at these prices, especially if you assume a slow drip of releases over a matter of years (with some being exclusives again). KOs have also killed the resale value of most of them (exceptions being the original MP-03/06/07 versions of the mould).
     
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  15. wildfly

    wildfly Formerly the next big thing.

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    I've already bought 4 Masterpiece Starscreams,
    3 Skywarps, 3 thundercrakers, and had to put up with MP Thrust with its wobbly torso and suspect colours.

    It would have me reconsidering my decision not to buy MT's Meteor and any repaints / retools.
     
  16. Kranix_OZ

    Kranix_OZ Well-Known Member

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    Considering my age and the number of MP I've bought (more than most but not as many as some!), I would think im among the target audience for MP. They can release as many + repaints as they want and as many V3 as they want, I'm not biting on any of them. Especially not replacing all my jets! Funnily enough they have released 3 of the figures I would be prepared to bite on in + form and they haven't won me over at all. Quite the opposite.

    I thought I was in the minority on this but now I wonder. V3 Prime may be the figure to turn this around but I have my doubts. What I desire is new releases that fit in with what I have now. Anything else is a pass for me. I suspect I'm not alone there. Time will tell I guess.
     
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  17. Dean ML

    Dean ML Well-Known Member

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    Like @Sam , I'm having a hard time believing MP Megatron and Sunstreaker sales were lackluster for TT. Repaints like anime Primal and AKOM Hot Rod are another matter, but then again maybe TT expects those kinds of releases to be really minor by now.
     
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  18. Seth Sunthay

    Seth Sunthay ElusoryMonk

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    I think megatron sold excellent, that's why i'm not having faith in those "rumours". But then again, could be true.

    They could just refer the new ones in general, because there are always exceptions.

    But let's hope for the best.
     
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  19. BeastConvoy

    BeastConvoy Well-Known Member

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    IDK I still feel optimistic about Jazz coming, probly because I really want it to happen. But in the last year or so I remember a couple of people on here reporting several retailers insisting jazz wasn't too far out. Don't ask me who because I don't remember now. Then I recall Tcrackers source whom I choose to believe pretty consistently reporting streaker, jazz, and hound, lastly saying jazz may be delayed for some reason if I'm not mistaken. And then was maketoys whom I feel rushed their downbeat out in attempt to beat Takara same as they did their Despotron.
     
  20. XXLMagnus

    XXLMagnus King of Kings

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    We got leaks!!!! I’m like one of the pioneers from the Old West stumbling on an abandoned well in the heart of the Mojave .... :) 
     
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