Discussion in 'Transformers Toy Discussion' started by GogDog, Dec 1, 2011.
What do you and oku know that we don’t?!?!?
I wrote about this whole mixup some time ago in my Who Is Tigertrack article and MB Sunswipe article, I even have TF merchandise with a yellow Sideswipe car and a red Sunstreaker car alongside a yellow Sunstreaker robot and Red Sideswipe robot, they are so cool.
But at TFN last year I saw Bob Budiansky's notes about what characters were originally supposed to be called, and sure enough he had 'Sunstreaker = Spinout" which disappointed me as I had done all this digging and writing to link the name Spinout to the SIDESWIPE mould, albeit in yellow...what we now refer to as Tigertrack.
However, at that stage of proceedings when Bob had those notes, around November 1983, there's still every possibility that the "Spinout/Sunstreaker" was still planned as a yellow Sideswipe. After all, the legal Hasbro/Takara documentation that was released some years back shows that originally the red Sunstreaker and yellow Sideswipe were what were intended for TF use.
All the best
Exactly Maz! I know all about your articles haha they are what highlighted this whole scenario to me
But while in your Tigertrack article you say that 12T is how Sideswipe should've looked, I actually think it's totally how Sunstreaker should've looked.
Think about it: if Sideswipe was labelled as a red Countach and Sunstreaker as a yellow one then it's kinda impossible for them to mismatch or forget what colours they're supposed to be. What would be easier to fuck up is which Countach each one is supposed to be. It never made sense to me that they could somehow swap their names around, and their colour.
Isn't it also true that the original Diaclone Countach was never released in yellow before TFs anyway? So naturally Bud working from the original Diaclones would've assumed that red Sideswipe would have a jetpack and pile-driving hands. Then after he had written the bios, attached to their names and colours, someone simply fucked up and assumed that the New Countach should be red and the original Countach should be yellow (because they didn't bother reading the actual bios).
In my original article, it was more a statement about getting a red new Countach instead of the intended yellow New Countach.
I agree with the hows and whys you've written there, yeah.
One thing, though. I think the eventual colours of the cars were not attributable to simply a mix up, while the confusion leading up to the production of the literature I would say is down to the circumstances we outlined.
I think the colours of the cars changing - and Ironhide from black to red, Trailbreaker from blue to black - was to distinguish the Hasbro Transformers range from the Diakron range which was the relatively unsuccessful attempt by Takara to bring the Car Robots over to US market.
All the best
That makes a lot of sense, @Ikkstakk just posited the same theory a couple of pages back too.
I love these stories of how Transformers might have looked. It's one of my favourite things about the hobby besides the actual nostalgia attached to it. I never owned Sideswipe or Sunstreaker, so I never noticed or knew about their mixed up bios. Never owned Bluestreak; the only catalog I had was a UK/European one which showed Bluestreak as silver, so I never knew about that change in colour. And of course it wasn't until much later that I saw the original trailer for TFTM and Magnus's original colours. Still, I'd love to have an MP-31 lined/loaded up with 18B, 12T, 39R and 27B - that would be an awesome collection of what-might-have-been Transformers.
Thanks guys, appreciate that!
Have we already discussed the possibility of what might happen to the MP line should this occur? I haven't been on the forums much in the past few months, due to work and family and all that - when I do, I tend to scan more than read, and skip pages sometimes, lol.
I guess I'm just thinking that should something like this happen, my inclination would be that it probably wouldn't be good for the MP line...
Not a ton that I’ve seen. That being said, I think the possibilities are pretty much one of two collections of what-ifs.
Possibility Group 1, Hasbro acquires Takara and keep them open as their own brand/relatively independent company due to the value of the name recognition in some parts of the world as long as they can start to turn a profit, or at least break even year-over-year.
My guess is that MPs would be relatively unaffected there, because Hasbro would have to finally acknowledge that the toy market is changing and not just for the ol’ 0-13 market anymore, plus any deals done for MP would be done with them, and they’d have access to simultaneous releases here. This is probably the preferable possibility realm for us MP fans.
Possibility Group 2: Hasbro acquires Takara and forces their practices on them, possibly taking them over entirely. If that happens, only the lines that are profitable will be kept. Hasbro also doesn’t love sublines, so unless MP proves to stand on its own, we might be in danger from massive changes to line-ending.
This sucks, but the trouble is that it’s worked for Hasbro for decades, so they feel good about it, and probably don’t see any reason to change it.
I wonder, with brand unification, if Hasbro would get shipments of MP's to the states that coincide with the Takara release.
Maybe Toys R Us will have more MPs on the shelves?
That would be awesome
I think that’d be smart, and hopefully the path they choose. One of the main reasons MPs probably don’t sell that well in TRU is that we all have had them for months or even years before Hasbro has brought them here.
Part of that, apparently, is that they have to obtain the vehicle licensing separately, which might be a really big advantage for unifying. It could massively expand the reach of the MP line.
Nnnn, I think that would depend more on Toys-R-Us's financial stability and their ability to buy more MPs. Simultaneous global releases would seem to be a positive, but they would have to prove a sizable market exists, which would mean starting with inexpensive (maybe ~$75) figures, and MPs are starting to move out of that price range.
A better alternative would be ending the exclusive arrangement with TRU for MP toys, opening them up to other retailers like they were in the beginning, but of course Hasbro is trying to help TRU stay solvent, and no other retailers are interested in high-end, high-dollar Transformers anyway.
Since Hasbro has released their own versions of MP I would be surprised if they ended the line. I would tend to think that between that and the fact that there are multiple 3P companies making a lot of figures and selling them that if they did anything it would be release more.
I understand, man. It’s unfortunate that people are like that. I’ve always appreciated the info you contributed. Wishing you the best and sorry if I put an unwanted spotlight on you with that post.
If that would have been the case Hasbro would have released more MPs a long time ago.
Look at the teamup for mpms.
Im affraid if Hasbro takes over Takara the quality will drop like a bomb. Hasbro has a very different way if doing business. Money always come first.
Takara always check off design boxes. Can they do what they want with a figure, then calculate the costs afterwards.
I hope for the best though.
Totally Agree, but trying to figure out what the ramifications of brand unifications are...
Hey folks, quick PSA about Sunstreaker’s elbow joints: they’re kinda tricky, so be really careful with them. They don’t just bend, they need to be shifted in and out.
The figure is ridiculously gorgeous.
How would a unification affect MP pricing, or would it?
Sunny wouldn't have it any other way. After all, he is the ultimate egoist.
If Hasbro sold them they would be cheaper but...
If Hasbro sold them they may ask for them to be simplified like the MPMs
Hasbro has been telling me (a collector) how I'm not their target demo for like a decade (or more). The last thing I want them to do is start messing with things targeted directly at collectors.
This "brand unification" nonsense feels like a desperate move by Hasbro. They don't like collectors importing, so instead of improving their product they're just going to shut down the competition. A childish "take my ball and go home" move.
It's going to do nothing but drive up third party sales until Hasbro learns how to make things for collectors.
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