The "3rd Party" vs. Hasbro discussion

Discussion in 'Transformers 3rd Party Discussion' started by transtrekkie, Jun 1, 2012.

  1. transtrekkie

    transtrekkie On the level.

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    Had this discussion going on another forum and figured I'd get the TFW take on this. I guess the basic question would be is Hasbro taking things too seriously with the actions they've taken against the unlicensed companies (I really hate the term "3rd party") or have the unlicensed companies gone to far with their infringement on Hasbro's IP.

    Personally, I was behind the unlicensed product back when it was just stuff that augmented existing figures. Things like the City Commander armor or the trailers for all the Primes that were released without them. I don't think Hasbro really cared about it at the time because you still had to buy a Hasbro product to use these upgrades. I think the reason companies like Fans Project have gathered the attention of Hasbro now is because they've entered into the territory of directly ripping off Hasbro's IP by producing toys of TF characters like "Warbot" (Springer) and the various "not Devastators". Things that would directly compete with what Hasbro has on the shelves.

    So TL:D R: Has Hasbro gone too far by taking action against these companies or have the companies gone too far by producing actual TFs rather than just add-ons?
     
  2. graymer

    graymer Well-Known Member

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    Interesting topic.

    To me, it boils down to this:

    Hasbro is smart for going after 3rd Party companies. The rights to the characters we all know and love is absolutely their property and there is a legal precedent here, which I feel is justified in enforcing.

    However, Hasbro is intentionally not producing modern versions of characters that collectors want. This is because if they do, eventually collectors can "finish" their collections. Thus ending the need to buy toys and causing the demand to shrink.

    Third party toy manufacturers have stepped in here to fill the demand. Honestly, I applaud companies like FP who have clearly thought this out and are going to be producing their "own" characters and still giving the fans what they want. Good for them! It's the sloppy companies that don't cover their butts that give these emerging companies a bad name. These I wouldn't mind seeing being taken through the ringer.
     
  3. Zeitgeist

    Zeitgeist Well-Known Member

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    let freedom ring. i heart 3p companies.

    really, im not happy with the way hasbro has handled the transformers brand and im glad that there are companies willing and able to step in and help out the fans of the brand.

    to me the transformers brand belongs to the fans as much as any multinational corporation.
     
  4. flamepanther

    flamepanther Interested, but not really

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    Do we have evidence that Hasbro is actually taking any meaningful action against these groups in the first place? All I know about is the "no unlicensed toys" rule at Botcon this year, which many suspect came from Fun Publications, not Hasbro.
     
  5. Zeitgeist

    Zeitgeist Well-Known Member

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    true.

    its obvious we really can not say that hasbro has the fans best interest at heart.
     
  6. transtrekkie

    transtrekkie On the level.

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    I'll agree that Hasbro has made some pretty huge screw ups in recent years, and I will also agree that I'm glad that there are people and companies willing to cater to some of us more hardcore fans buuuuuuuut from a strictly legal standpoint, Transformers doesn't belong to us, it belongs to Hasbro and unfortunately that means that they have the right to screw it up if they want to.
     
  7. flamepanther

    flamepanther Interested, but not really

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    There's that and the little issue that liking a thing does not confer any other kind of ownership either.

    Anyway, again, where is the "versus" in this thread topic coming from? What is Hasbro doing against the third party groups, exactly?
     
  8. MasterpieceMP33

    MasterpieceMP33 Well-Known Member

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    All of FPs products seemingly infringe on hasbro's ip.
    Im relatively certain that if a FP was based in the US they would be shut down.
     
  9. Wyvern

    Wyvern Velvet Sanchez

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    I love 3rd party stuff. Some of the best stuff i have is 3rd party. I buy what I like. But if I were Hasbro I'd totally go Hulk on 3rd party companies and smash them. There would be nobody making money off of my stuff without me saying is ok and getting a percentage of sales.
     
  10. Starscream NZ

    Starscream NZ Well-Known Member

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    No, they have their companies best interest at heart. And you know what? So does FansProject, Maketoys, iGear and all the other third-party producers.

    No company solely exists to please it's fan. Every single company makes products to make a profit. It may be that given the size of the company, the product may be there to fill a niche market (such as Warbot) - they're still there to make a profit.

    Hasbro sells it's products to millions of parents and children across the globe. FP & iGear sell their products to around 3-4 thousand people, worldwide. There's a massive difference in what the differing companies can, and will, produce and sell and still make a profit.
     
  11. flamepanther

    flamepanther Interested, but not really

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    SteelCore and the Glacialbots don't seem to.
    FP is based in Japan, where copyright is treated more or less the same as it is in the US. It's not like with iGear where they can hide behind China's peculiar copyright loopholes.

    Which is precisely why Hasbro has not and will likely never do anything at all about FP.
     
  12. transtrekkie

    transtrekkie On the level.

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    Well there is the Botcon rule instituted this year and then there was the thing with the Laptop company being forced to rename their "Transformer Prime" tablet (I forget which company that was) and there have also been very strong responses from Hasbro on the subject at Botcon and other venue panels when it's come up.

    I wouldn't go so far as to say they don't have our interests at heart, we've gotten a lot of toys over even just the last couple years that were of fan favorite characters that I really thought we'd never see. Especially from the Universe and Generations lines and even RTS produced some good stuff that was unexpected. Granted, I think they could do more, but I don't think it's all bad either.
     
  13. MasterpieceMP33

    MasterpieceMP33 Well-Known Member

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    Was about to edit my post with these exceptions:eek: 
     
  14. AnAutobot1985

    AnAutobot1985 Well-Known Member

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    I believe we are spoiled to have so many companies catering to our need for more when it comes to Transformers. I love 3rd party companies and some of the designs they put so much effort into making and getting in our hands. I do not consider myself a Hasbro fan, I am a Transformer fan. If you got something I like and are willing to slap a price tag on it, I am willing to buy it up.

    From a legal standpoint however I do not blame Hasbro for being upset with how far 3rd party companies and Knock Off toys have gone. However its a matter of supply and demand. They don't feed our demand, someone else will. In part it's their fault too really for underestimating the markets.
     
  15. transtrekkie

    transtrekkie On the level.

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    The "versus" is more in regards to the attitude that's been put forth from Hasbro regarding these companies. And it's also (to a much lesser degree since I certainly am not out to incite any flame wars) to ask which side people's opinions rest with.

    It could also be that maybe Hasbro is pursuing legal action but is prevented from discussing it publicly for legal reasons. In that case, there could be action being taken and we might never know about it until it's resolved. I will freely admit that I have nothing to back that up, it's just a theory. Of an idea.
     
  16. seali_me

    seali_me Well-Known Member

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    At this point in the game these turd party companies should just go all the way. Very clear cut copyright infringement products. Like Hegemon and Hercticons. That's all I care about.

    I won't pay for anything less...

    As for the thread, I'm expecting the sleeping giants to wake up soon.
     
  17. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP AKA Beve Stuscemi

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    This post sickens me.

    "The fans" is not one entity with one single goal in mind and one need that needs to be filled. They do not have any 'best interests" whatever the hell that means. I'm a fan, and I don't give one single shit about what G1 nobody gets a toy next.

    And look at how much Has/Tak has given you. Masterpiece, Alternators, Classics, Universe, homage after homage in every, single line. All released AT RETAIL. Available for you to just go and buy for regular toy price. Other companies would not give you ANY of this. How can you possibly say Hasbro doesn't care when they've given you eight times as much as Third Party companies?

    I hate this fandom. So. Much. It is a festering pustule of ungrateful, spoiled children.

    Absolutely not.

    Hasbro's primary market is children. If you completely removed the "fans" evermind that just because YOU like one thing doesn't mean all fans do) they would not be hurting at all. Hasbro does not cater to you. They cater to the majority.
     
  18. flamepanther

    flamepanther Interested, but not really

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    Which was in the interests of Fun Publications rather than Hasbro, and was never even enforced despite numerous flagrant violations.
    They went after a major company to protect brand trademarks, over something that had absolutely nothing to do with unlicensed Transformers toys. Years ago, when Hasbro outlined their "rules" for fan-made aftermarket products, they specifically asked people not to use their trademarks, and all of the major third parties are following that rule. That's why we have "City Commander," "Faith Leader," "Delicate Warrior," "Hercules," "Giant," and "Warbot Defender."
    When was this? They usually say nice things (about FP, for instance) or try to avoid comments at all. I'm not aware of any "strong responses." It didn't even come up at all at the Hasbro panel at BotCon this year.

    When?
    They could also be preparing us for an actual invasion of alien robot warriors. It's just a theory. Of an idea. How about let's not take unfounded speculation for granted? The question of whether Hasbro is taking things "too seriously" implies that they're actually doing something. There's no evidence of that.
     
  19. seali_me

    seali_me Well-Known Member

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    I find the fandom quite amusing.

    Well said btw.

    The shrinking retail deluxes look bad on display and turd party is becoming more and more bold...
     
  20. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP AKA Beve Stuscemi

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    I'd be amused if the smug sense of unfounded entitlement didn't make my stomach turn. Yes, Hasbro has completely ignored the fans wants. That's why I don't have Masterpiece Optimus, Megatron, Starscream, a dozen Alternators and updates of 80% of the cartoon cast that I bought at retail.

    I'm still waiting for Third Parties to fulfill my personal demand (a demand I know for a fact is shared by others) for more Animated figures. Way to completely ignore a very real market, guys.
     

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