TF:TM, 1986 or 2007?

Discussion in 'Transformers General Discussion' started by Insane Galvatron, Oct 16, 2007.

  1. Insane Galvatron

    Insane Galvatron is not insane. Really!

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    I'm too torn to decide. I love the old movie, but the new one kicked way more @$$ than I expected. What about you guys? Which is better? Feel free to put on your nostalgic rose colored glasses for this comparison. :) 
     
  2. smkspy

    smkspy is one nice fucking kitty

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    Honestly both really aren't that great, but I'll choose the 86 for the death factor alone. Seriously, that movie made most of us here lifelong fans for the sheer dramatic atmosphere that was presented for a children's movie.

    The new movie may have a made a shitload of money, but it'll forgotten by 80% of those who watched it, and it'll never have the impact on today's children like the 86 movie had on us.
     
  3. swarlock

    swarlock Autobot Supporter

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    For me it'll always be the '86 movie. I have nothing further to say.
     
  4. Valkysas

    Valkysas Attack Buffalo

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    just my opinion here, not stating this stuff as fact, don't yell at me for it:

    86, everything fell apart after prime died, up until unicron transforms. I ALWAYS skip the chapters between those events. they put me to sleep.

    07, everything falls apart whenever maggie and glenn are on-screen.

    86, prime and megatron's battle is shown in it's entirety, but the end of it is ruined by a young idiot. had hot rod not interfered, prime would have finished megatron and he wouldnt have died. maybe got shot once or twice before he could fire back, but he would actually have the option of firing back.

    07, prime and megatron's battle is about 30% off-screen, and the end of it is ruined by a young idiot. had sam left the area where prime and megatron were fighting, the military and autobots would have finished megatron off. he was crippled when he finally got to crawling towards sam. if sam had stayed away, megatron would have been finished off, and the autobots would have the allspark. sam however, did not become the new autobot leader at the end of the movie, which is nice

    86, OPTIMUS DIES.

    07, OPTIMUS LIVES.

    86 (and all of G1), the transformers are just "there" and arent treated with any sense of wonder.

    07, the transformers are mysterious and awe-inspiring. every time they're on screen is an event. the 07 movie gave transformers something they've never, ever had before.

    86, killed dozens of childhood heroes. but they went down fighting.

    07, killed decepticons that were never developed enough for us to actually care about, along with a barely-developed jazz who went down yelling "you want a piece of me".

    86, human death toll is zero

    07, thanks to the battle in the military base and city, the human death toll is in the high hundreds.

    86, storyline is a rip-off of star wars.

    07, storyline is influenced only by transformers.

    86, marked the beginning of the end thanks to the death of optimus prime and the movie era toys being worse than the ones from the previous two years.

    07, a rebirth for the franchise, the toys are superior to every mainline that has come before when it comes to sculpting detail and engineering. the start of something really, really big.

    86, box office failure, bashed by critics.

    07, seven hundred million dollars, praised by critics including roger ebert (!)

    and where they're both equal: they both used top of the line animation (for their time) in their respective fields.

    honestly, I can't pick one over the other. guess I'll try again when Transformers 2 comes out.
     
  5. Rend

    Rend Decepticreep Killer

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    I knew it was only going to be a matter of time before this thread popped up. I'm torn, and I like them both because both signify changing points in the TFs series. I think they're both too monumental to choose one or the other. Both have great qualities, and will remain in our hearts. So I choose both!
     
  6. Foster

    Foster Super Mod

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    I choose the new movie as long as I'm allowed to chapter skip past Sam's happy time and other shitty, overlong non-robot scenes.
     
  7. Senor_Escobar

    Senor_Escobar Well-Known Member

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    the 86 movie beats the 07 one by a longshot.....the live action film just didnt have enough transformers interaction or story for me to thoroughly enjoy it
     
  8. Rumble02

    Rumble02 Radicon of Obliticons

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    07 for me. mostly cuz ( and dont yell at me) the music in the old one sucked and the story was way to goobleygoopy
     
  9. Warrior_Medic

    Warrior_Medic 70s and 80s Kid Forever!

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  10. Valkysas

    Valkysas Attack Buffalo

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    apparently
     
  11. Noisemaze2006

    Noisemaze2006 Banned

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    I don't really see how you can compare the two.
     
  12. Robimus

    Robimus Wanna'be Cassettebot

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    I love the new live action film, but for me 1986 will always be better. It has an epic story, no plot holes and the Transformers are the main characters, not the humans. I think there is huge potential for a live action sequel, but I don't ever see hollywood making a film where the humans aren't central characters. Thus it will always be the human saving the day in Hollywood, while the Autobots save the day in the cartoons.
     
  13. Yigal

    Yigal Dutch Meeting camera man

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    1986 That's THE MOVIE.

    2007 was nice, but nothing more
     
  14. Valkysas

    Valkysas Attack Buffalo

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    unicron comes out of nowhere, as does the matrix, new characters are added without explanation, no one knows which decepticons were turned into who by unicron, snarl vanishes between camera angle changes, most of the season 2 cast is missing (we know the technical reason for this, but it's still a hole), and of course -, ten years were skipped (85-05) that are still a complete mystery.
     
  15. Golden Age

    Golden Age BATTLE BEAST

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    new one sucks imo. 86 rules.
     
  16. iron maniac

    iron maniac Help Uncle Sixshot, Help!

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    Although I enjoyed the new TF movie, its always going to be the '86 movie for me by far. That was a HUGE event in my childhood for a number of reasons.

    I took my little nephew to the theater to see it for his birthday in '86 and he passed away last year so he didn't quite make it to see the new movie unfortunately. :(  I know he would have liked it.
     
  17. Robimus

    Robimus Wanna'be Cassettebot

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    Unicron was introduced, as was the Matrix, as were Hotrod, Ultra Magnus etc.......much the way characters are introduced in any film. We don't see too many characters life stories played out on film unless their name is Skywalker. Use your imagination on which Decepticon became Cyclonus(they were all reprogrammed completely creating new characters-just my opinion), Yeah I'll give you Snarl but really in a film where maybe 50+ Transfromers get screen time complaining about who didn't make the cut seems out of place. (Characters who don't appear in the movie can't be a plot hole in a movie). All the main characters got screen time and lines. For twenty years the war continued, Daniel was born, the Autobots captured the Moon bases etc. When you take History in school you skip over the parts/decades when not much happens. I always assumed that was the case there. Most the stuff mentioned is not really plot holes, the movie starts when the movie starts and deals with the characters introduced in the film. Loose ends for characters who appear are tied up( all the way down to Bumblebee, Jazz, and Cliffjumper being rescued from Unicron). Its not perfect, but is still great. I dont think 1986 gets nearly the credit it should. For me its one of the best Sci-Fi/Fantasy films ever, cartoon or not.

    Now in comparison, TFTM has Barricade leading the Decepticon charge into the freeway battle-he vanishes to not be seen again till TFTM2 maybe. Bay had 12 Transformers to keep track of and completely lost one! I Still think he did a great job!, but thats a plot/character hole.
     
  18. Greenspan

    Greenspan Monetary Maestro

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    1986 all the way and you know why ? Because without the 1986 movie there wouldn't be a 2007 movie.

    TF:TM 1986 is filthy rich of new TFs lore and myth. It created :

    -Unicron. Then Primus was added.
    -The Matrix.
    -The Quintessons. Then many different types of quintessons and their robotic experients.
    -Galvatron. First time we get to see a TFs get upgraded.
    -Cyclonus and Scourge. Fan favorites from the get go. Uber cool vilains.
    -Hot Rod, Magnus, Springer, Kup, Blurr, METROPLEX.
    -Junkions and Lithonians. Now we know there are many different TFs/robotic races that are not cybertron bound.
    -Arcee. Now we know there are females TFs. Then Chromia, Elita One, etc were added to the lore.

    The animation was gorgeous (albeit some acceptable mistakes), the score was awesome (I listen to it almost daily), the story was very strong, as kids we got to learn that even heroes can die, it ended with the promise of much more to come, we left the theatre wondering if Prime, Megs and Starscream were truly dead ? Was Unicron finished for good ? How about all those hidden and secret places on Cybertron left to discover ?

    The 2007 movie was great for one thing : Visual excitement. It delivered that in spades. The SFX were uber cool...but aside SFX it didn't bring anything new to the lore, the myth, we caught a glimpse of a very apocalyptic Cybertron that looked like the Matrix on steroids instead of the much more interesting cartoon version.

    In short the 2007 didn't bring anything new or compelling. Some will remind me of the allspark cube. Fine, but to me the concept of allspark comes from Beast Wars, which draws from G1. So it's not really anything new per se. Same goes for protoforms. Plus instead of chasing the allspark cube they might as well have called it by its proper name : vector sigma.

    The 2007 movie is a blockbuster that is great for the crash-boom-bang factor. And I look forward the sequel.

    The 1986 movie is a space opera that still has many open questions left to be answered one day.

    Godspeed
    -Greenspan
     
  19. Rodimus Rage

    Rodimus Rage Autobot Leader

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    '86 all da way baby.

    Hot Rod, the imperfect leader to Optimus Primes perfection. I absolutely loved the epic feel. Loved Unicron, and arcee. introduced so many new cool tf's. while i missed those who died, i fell fast in love with the next generation as i felt they had more in depth characterization. I mean, Hot Rod could have been so many of us, while living up to Optimus Perfection... that's pretty difficult to relate to. i left that theatre in a daze. yeah, optimus died, as did others... but leaving that movie theatre was the beginning of the reaign of my favorite transformer ever.

    oh, and as far as the songs go?

    " YOU GOT DA TOUCH !!! " ( Played endlessly on my cd player while i warmed up for my wrestling matches, YEAH BOI !!! )
     
  20. Nevermore

    Nevermore It's self-perpetuating a parahumanoidarianised!

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    And the similarities with ID4 are purely concidential?

    *cough* twenty *cough*

    Unicron and the Matrix are both plot devices. Basically, it's like "Hey, here's this giant planet eater. You don't need to know where he comes from, just that he's really menacing. Oh, and here's this glowing thing that has always been inside Optimus Prime's chest, we just never saw it. Oh, and conveniently, it happens to be the only thing that can stop Unicron. Funny eh?" That's cheap writing. A plot device as a menace, and another plot device to stop it.

    Erm, no. That's not what "introduction" means. "Introduction" means "showing how the new characters get involved with the old characters", not "explaining their entire family history".

    For example, in The Empire Strikes Back, the established cast lands on Bespin, Han introduces them to Lando Calrissian, and then the shit hits the fan. Lando doesn't suddenly pop up on the Millennium Falcon and everyone treats him as if they already knew him. And that's what TF:TM 1986 does. A lot of new characters who are already familiar with the old cast, and we as a viewer are supposed to accept them as "established" characters we just never saw before.

    That's the same way the 1985 cast got "introduced" in season 2. Hell, ALPHA TRION AND THE FEMALE AUTOBOTS ON CYBERTRON WHO WERE NOT BASED ON TOYS had a better introduction than the majority of the 1985 cast and the new movie Autobots combined!

    Use your imagination on where Barricade went in the 2007 movie! Yeah, that's a lame excuse.

    So if, say, a new TMNT movie that's explicitly set in an established continuity is missing Leonardo and nobody ever addresses his whereabouts, nobody even mentions his name, that's not a plot error?

    I'd say more stuff actually HAPPENED in those twenty years than in the first two seasons of the cartoon...

    This reminds me of something...

    ARGH. Bay didn't "forget" Barricade. BARRICADE'S DEATH WAS IN THE SCRIPT. It was cut SO HE COULD RETURN IN PART 2. It's not a plot error when it's left deliberately vague (especially not when it gets picked up in part 2 just like it was supposed to).

    Erm. How? The 1986 movie was not successful. The cartoon and toyline were. So if anything, there would be no 2007 movie if it wasn't for the CARTOON. The 1986 movie's commercial failure would be a reason NOT to make another one.

    Besides, "it came first so it MUST AUTOMATICALLY BE BETTER" isn't really a logical argument. It might have more importance, but old age or a direct lineage does not necessarily have any implications on quality. In the same way the original Star Trek show is cheesy, has a lot of stiff acting and cheap sets, props and special effects (I don't say it's not fun to watch. Just that it's not really that GOOD.). The movies, on the other hand, had a lot more budget and in many cases were more entertaining and more commercially successful.

    Now, according to your logic, Star Trek TOS was better than the movies, TNG, DS9 and whatever else because "without TOS, there would be no movies, no TNG and no DS9". I don't think that really makes sense.
     

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