Star Wars Plot Holes

Discussion in 'Movies and Television' started by Rodimus, Jan 10, 2009.

  1. Rodimus

    Rodimus The Prime Producer

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    I just saw Star Wars on TV again and it got me to thinking about the whole saga. How many Plot Holes are there really in Star Wars? Because to me the whole thing about Luke and Leia being twins makes about as much sense in the timeline as me cutting off my left wrist. In the first 2 movies (episode IV and V) we see Luke and Leia kiss and get all fresh with each other. Then in Episode VI it is revealed that they are brother and sister? Can you say: "WTF!?" Not to mention that Leia speaks about her mother in episode VI from memories she is recalling. But in episode III it is shown that Leia's mother died directly after giving birth.

    But what really sparked my thought process was questions that I had about how in the world Luke and Leia grew up. Okay so it's known that Queen/Senator Padme Amidalla and Anikan Skywalker got it on and wound up having kids, and the supposed offical canon is that Padme died right after giving birth to them. But what happened that Leia grew up as a Princess and never knew about Luke? How could she grow up as a Princess and know nothing about her father or parents, or her twin? (This is all making my head spin.) Same with Luke. How could he grow up on the exact same planet where his father was born and his grandmother, aunt, and Uncle lived, and his mother be a great Queen/Senator and know absolutely nothing about any of it?? How could he come from royalty and grow up as a peasent with no one telling him of his families history or even that he had a twin sister who was a Princess?

    I don't know, but the whole Luke and Leia being siblings makes absolutely no sense to me. Maybe you guys can help shine some light on the plot of Luke and Leia's upbringing (what happens between Episode III and Episode IV) for me. ...And the fact that they were incestfully smooching in the ANH and TESB makes me wonder what in the world George Lucas was thinking.

    A little light on this, please? I'm not the biggest Star Wars fan or follower in the world. I enjoy the saga, but compared to the rest of the world know only the basics about it.

    What other plot holes are in the Star Wars saga that I might be missing?
     
  2. Omegatron

    Omegatron Mandatory Fun. Buy it now TFW2005 Supporter

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    1. There's a movies and television forum.
    2. Leia and Luke were both raised by foster parents who never told them anything of their true origins, and kept it a secret from everyone else, too. Otherwise, word would've gotten out to Darth Vader that he had two kids running around, and nobody wants a Sith Lord crashing the family reunion. And Leia can remember her mother (her real mother) due to...I dunno, midichlorians is my guess.
     
  3. Sokar

    Sokar Well-Known Member

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    To answer question 2 about them growing up not knowing about their family:
    That was likely done in order to keep them from having much chance of discovering who their father was and either following his path or trying to avenge their mother and getting killed. As for splitting them up it's probably eisier to try and hide 1 kid at a time under false pretences than 2

    As for the 'relationship' they had in the first 2 movies.... George Lucas likes incest stories?
     
  4. GW_Freak

    GW_Freak Banned

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    This is about 32 years too late... and the wrong forum...
     
  5. Pravus Prime

    Pravus Prime Sorcerer

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    Yeah, because raising a kid on his fathers home planet with the same surname would never raise suspicion.
     
  6. Lord Of Tetris

    Lord Of Tetris Well-Known Member

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    For one thing, you have to accept that Lucas probably didn't plan out his series beforehand. Despite Lucas' assurances to the contrary, you can't make sense of Star Wars without this basic assumption.

    You just have to take this series' continuity as "seriously" as you would consider G1 Transformers continuity. One episode Megatron turned the Constructicons evil. In another episode, the Constructicons built Megatron. Just let go of trying to make sense of it. Accept that some plot holes can't be reconciled. And the story will be much more enjoyable. Hardcore Star Wars fans will insist upon Star Wars' continuity as seriously as a lawyer defends his client. I suppose this is their choice. I used to be one of these hardcore Star Wars fans, honest. I had every movie memorized, used to read the EU novels, etc etc etc. Then, I had to grow up. Heh.

    Trust me, you didn't even get half the plot holes. :) 

    But since your main concern seemed to be about Luke and Leia's upbringing...

    Obi-Wan Kenobi gives a tidy retcon speech in Return of the Jedi that deals with what happens between Episodes 3-4. I'm paraphrasing here, but it goes something like:

    "The Emperor knew, as I did, that if Anakin were to have any offspring, they would be a threat to him." Thanks to Lucas' vague pronoun reference, we can't be certain who "him" refers to. I think it's accepted that Obi-Wan means: "Anakin's kids are going to kill the Emperor if they ever find out what happened to their parents." It could also mean, "If Darth ever found out he has kids, he's going to kill the Emperor and make his kid an apprentice."

    I think the idea is that Anakin and Padme's lives were so full of suffering, the kids deserved to have a clean slate with loving parents who would keep them out of the war and the Empire. For example, Uncle Owen was really unwilling to let Luke get anywhere near the Imperial Academy. Luke got the short end of the deal being raised as a peasant whereas his sister was raised as royalty, though.

    I also think it's an accepted retcon that Leia never knew that her "mother" (Bail Organa's wife) was actually her foster mother. When Leia was telling Luke about her "mother," she was under the assumption that Bail Organa's wife was her biological mother. Only after Luke's speech did she learn that she, too, never knew her birth mother. Yes, that's a big cheat. But I think that's the accepted retcon.
     
  7. sto_vo_kor_2000

    sto_vo_kor_2000 Banned

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    Distasteful....maybe but hardly plot holes.

    And they only kissed...I would harld call that "getting freah".

    There are people that claim to have memories from the womb as well as from birth.

    No to mention that maybe she was remembering with the help of the force.Those that are connected to the force can see the dead.

    Again Hardly plot holes.

    See here's your first mistake.


    Yes it was Known to us that Padme and Anikan got it on....yes it was known to a few other characters.....but it was "NOT KNOWN" to the general public of the Star Wars universe.

    Even Obewan didnt find it out till the very end that they were a couple.

    There would have been no reason to assume that the general public knew they were a couple or that he fathered her children.

    Canon yes.....but we do not know what was told to the general public of the Star Wars universe.

    They may have been told that the children died with her.

    Think about it.

    On earth alone there are plenty of twins born that are separated and never learn of each other.

    No imaging that same thing happening in a universe where they are on different planets in different sectors living under different rullers.

    Leia may not have been told she was adopted till she was an adult and Luke was never told much about his parents.

    Only his Uncle and Aunt would have known who and what he was and they kept it from him.

    Tatuwine was a non-allied planet [not part of the empire] and was sort of the garbage dump of the universe.

    Its where people went to buy stolen goods, gamble,buy slaves, it wouldnt have really been public knowledge who and what Luke was nor would it have been in anyone interest to tell him if they knew.

    What do you want to know????
     
  8. Lord Of Tetris

    Lord Of Tetris Well-Known Member

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    For all its deep mythology, we actually don't know a lot of the Star Wars universe. The movies themselves do not show how much the general public knows about the Skywalkers. For example, does the general public know Darth Vader's secret identity? Do the Imperial officers even know? Obi-Wan and the Lars probably know, but who else? The movies simply don't tell us. An Imperial officer seems to know that Darth used to be a Jedi (calling him a sorcerer, and the Force as an "ancient religion"), but does he know which Jedi became Darth? Again, the movies simply don't explain this to us.

    If Obi-Wan, the Lars, and Palpatine are the only living people who know Darth's secret identity, then it's not hard to imagine Luke living in ignorance of his family history. He can Google "Luke Skywalker's Father" all he wants, and he won't get any hits for Darth.
     
  9. sto_vo_kor_2000

    sto_vo_kor_2000 Banned

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    I doubt it.

    If it were public knowlidge then Luke wouldnt have been so shocked he was related to Darth Vader.

    I'm sure there might be one or 2 that knew early on.

    Yoda,Aunt Peru,Seneter [later King] Organa.

    My guess thats it.

    Even that comment does not imply knowing he was a Jedi.

    It could only be that the guy who said it knows he is a Sith and that they had powers like the Jedi.

    True
     
  10. Rodimus Major

    Rodimus Major Custom User Title

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    That's why adoption on this planet never works, and everyone can easily find theri parents.
     
  11. jorod74

    jorod74 Psycholagnist (Ret.)

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    Dude, there are soooooooo many plotholes, mistakes, bloopers, errors and stuff in just the Original Trilogy to choke a Rancor.
    drop this madness before it consumes you and you are mocked by Conan O'Brien or Triumph on late night tv....
    when you are safer at BotCon with respectable nerds...
    LOL
     
  12. Rodimus

    Rodimus The Prime Producer

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    Great discussion guys. One thing that came to mind here... If Anakin/Darth Vador didn't know he had any kids and everybody was hiding there were kids from him (or simply didn't know)... then how did he know to tell Luke, "I am your father!" ???

    Edit:
    LOL
     
  13. sto_vo_kor_2000

    sto_vo_kor_2000 Banned

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    At that point he had already learned his name was "LUKE SKYWALKER" and put the rest together......which was some time after their first meating in episode 4.
     
  14. Josh

    Josh Comic Color-guy

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    well Vader knew she was pregnant with at least one child. yeah they did keep her stomach all pumped up probably to make vader assume [assuming he would check in on her corpse or something] the baby died with her but i dunno.


    maybe he just knew his kid was out there somewhere. i mean. he IS a sith after all. the force and all that.


    *edit*
    yeah..the whole "I'm Luke Skywalker" thing probably let him know too lol







    he used the force to find out that luke had a twin sister [pretty big news to him]


    so i dunno


    could be explained in a book somewhere but thats just my guess :p 
     
  15. misternoodle

    misternoodle Banned

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    just clicking the thread made me broke out in cold sweat...oh god, theforce.net forums flashbacks THE HORROR THE HORROR
     
  16. Omnius

    Omnius Well-Known Member

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    And don't forget the Emperor referring to Luke as 'The son of Skywalker' during the holo-conversation with Vader in TESB.
     
  17. Deadpool.

    Deadpool. I want my bird.

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    Blowing up the Death Star = Rebels winning in RotJ?

    The Empire was still in control of most planets and star systems, and outnumbered the Rebels.... So how could blowing up the Death Star II and killing Palpatine make them the winners?


    *not referring to the EU*
     
  18. ILoveDinobot

    ILoveDinobot Arise Rodimus Prime

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    A select few knew that Anakin Skywalker = Darth Vader. Luke knew his father's name was Anakin Skywalker, he didn't know his father was Darth Vader.


    Also to answer another one of your questions, Padme's belly was stuffed in her coffin to make her look like she died pregnant so that Anakin and Palpatine would not find out about the births.

    Yes he felt it after meeting him through the force and being behind his X-wing while he was in the tie-fighter he felt it. Also in the novel Anakin and Padme decide on names for their baby. Once again he did not know they were twins.
     
  19. RabidYak

    RabidYak Go Ninja Go Ninja Go

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    I always assumed that shit got allot worse after that in the SWU even before the topic was actually covered in print, a sudden power vacuum at the top of a military dictatorship that has enougth force to control a substantial part of a galaxy isn't going to end well in any situation.
     
  20. tikgnat

    tikgnat Baweepgranaweepninnybong. TFW2005 Supporter

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    Hey Yak, is that a genuine newspaper front page? Took me a few seconds to clock what was wrong.

    George Lucas could have avoided all the plot holes in his prequel trilogy if he did 2 things.

    i) Hire a continuity guy.
    ii) Hire some people that can actually say 'no' to him.

    Still, the comics, Dark Horse and Marvel do deal with the post ROTJ years (in their own continuities). Its generally accepted that Empire Remnents float around doing all sorts of dastardly deeds.

    But that doesn't explain what the FLEET of Star Destroyers thought they were doing when thr DS2 blew up.

    'Admiral! The Death Star has been destroyed! The Emperor is dead! What should we do!?'
    'I have my orders directly from the Emperor. He has something special in mind for the rebels.'
    'Admiral! The Rebels are breaking formation and landing on Endor!'
    'I have my orders directly from the Emperor. He has something special in mind for the rebels.'
    'Admiral! Those rebels are partying on the Surface of the moon, playing with cute teddy bears!'
    'I have my orders directly from the Emperor. He has something special in mind for the rebels.'
     

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