Sparks and Cybertonian physiology: how to kill a Transformer?

Discussion in 'Transformers General Discussion' started by process, Jun 13, 2011.

  1. process

    process Hanlon's razor Veteran TFW2005 Supporter

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    For the sake of discussion, assume I know little to nothing about Transformers fiction.

    As the title asks, how do you kill one? Is a Transformer's life ended only by the destruction of its spark, or other bodily systems? Where is the spark located anyway? How it is that some characters are killed by headshots (presumably not where the spark is), and others killed by bodyshots? How do characters like (IDW) Perceptor and Hotrod survive devastating injuries and survive? Where was (IDW) Sunstreaker's spark the whole time he was just a head?

    Also, how exactly do dead universe denizens regenerate; is it like the titular Golden Army in Hellboy 2?

    Discuss!
     
  2. sto_vo_kor_2000

    sto_vo_kor_2000 Banned

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    its magic



    all jokes aside there is no 1 solid answer to any of your questions.

    Things change between the different continuities and in each different case.

    The locations of sparks also are different for different characters.

    There was a time that a TF's persona was embodied in the spark.So if that spark entered a new body, that body had the same persona the spark had before, but Bays RotF changed that.
     
  3. Karhukjnsi

    Karhukjnsi Universal Wrestler

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    It did? I don't remember ANY spark transplants in the films.
     
  4. sto_vo_kor_2000

    sto_vo_kor_2000 Banned

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    Dont you recall how they brought Megatron back?

    Wasnt it with the spark of the small bot and the shard?
     
  5. Karhukjnsi

    Karhukjnsi Universal Wrestler

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    No no, they put Scrapmetal's pieces onto Megatron to patch it up and what not, they used the Allspark shard to re-ignite Megatron's spark.

    EDIT: Whoops! Wrong name. There we go.
     
  6. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP Dry built

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    No, actually. They needed parts from ze little one, and the shard made energon which started Megatron's own spark back up again.

    EDIT: Sniped.

    To answer the thread title, once the spark is destroyed by whatever means, that TF (save divine intervention or advanced delicate scientific/psuedo mystical means) is dead. Usually they heve systems that prevent the sparks destruction (stasis lock, for example) however if they are utterly obliterated or refuse stasis lock, the spark will die.
     
  7. Anodythe

    Anodythe Well-Known Member

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    Sp apparently Megatron was only mostly dead...not completely dead.

    Both his and Optimus' sparks seemed to have only been desperately depleated not completely out.

    Wonder if the All-Spark shaed was coated with chocolate?
     
  8. process

    process Hanlon's razor Veteran TFW2005 Supporter

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    Do sparks require a support system, i.e., the body? Is it fair to liken the destruction of the head but preservation of the spark as something akin to a coma?
     
  9. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP Dry built

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    No, they were dead, but both sparks were intact, and presumably had all their datatracks, systems and whatnot still there. Once their bodies were repaired and re-energized, their sparks would've (I assume) went right back to work.

    That's likewise why Optimus crushed the Fallen's spark. No way he's coming back.

    Well he ate it all, so I guess it tasted good.

    Yes. In BW characters would get pretty much trashed, decapitated, dismembered. However they all survived through stasis lock (which is like a coma) or other sytems, while Dinobot notably refused any sort of shutdown, sustained heavy damaged, and subsequently died.

    However being machines, "dead" and "in a coma" are hard things to peg. Optimus and Megatron were pretty clealy dead in the movies, and weren't able to be revived through anything less than God-like artifacts. Optimsu Primal died, well obliterated really, and he was brought back through science and the mystical Matrix. (the afterlife, not the object)

    In G1, Optimus died, but was rebuilt by the Quints. However G1 was before sparls were imagined.
     
  10. sto_vo_kor_2000

    sto_vo_kor_2000 Banned

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    I stand corrected
     
  11. Overlord Balder

    Overlord Balder Voices Slugslinger!

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    I always had the thought that there were only three ways to kill a TF:

    Destroying the Spark - Movie-verse Optimus, Movie-verse Megatron, Movie-verse Blackout all met their fate this way, it's quite a obvious one as the Spark is the HEART of the Transformer body structure.

    Decaptation - Most of the movie-verse deaths by Optimus go by this way: enemies die through losing the head [Bonecrusher, for one].
    Likely their head have some kind of control system to the body, once it's ripped off, the body shuts down.

    Generalized damage - That's a weird one, I think that because SOME characters died this way, like movie-verse Jazz [neither his spark nor his head got damaged in his gruesome demise, he was ripped off in two by the waist]: Just an absurd amount of damage made to the body of the Transformer [mainly on the chest and waist area], causing his systems to overload and him entering in shut down.
    This "shut down" can mean two things: Stasis Lock, or death.
     
  12. Nachtsider

    Nachtsider Banned

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    My line of reasoning is that while a direct strike to the spark will kill a TF outright, heavy enough generalized damage can do the job, too, albeit not as quickly. Same principle that applies to human beings; a shot to the head or heart is immediately or almost immediately fatal; serious bodily damage, while not as swift to kill, can be sufficient as well.
     
  13. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP Dry built

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    This seems to be a part of the movieverse's slighlty more realistic take on the robots. Obviously the head would contain lots of vital or important systems and cores, so removing it would cause detah. The only exception to this is Frenzy, however he is an infilatration unit and while he was heavily damaged after Mikaela's attack, he actually disengaged his own head himself, then went on the sprout legs from his head and even retain the ability to transform, so this seems like something only Frenzy and possibly other infilatration uints can do. Only once his head was shredded did he die, which supports the above.

    Likewise with the generalized damage, this could be that, as hugely complex and massive robots, they'd need a lot of systems and delicate components to keep them running, so being torn in half or just shot a whole bunch would result in death the same way it would a human. (this is supported by the fact that only damage to the head and torsos result in immediate death, as Bumblebee, Bonecrusher, Megatron (twice) and Starscream all survived dismemberment, Starscream even popped his arm back on)
     
  14. The F.N.G.

    The F.N.G. Well-Known Member

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    Jazz is an interesting case. While being torn in half appears to have killed him in the film, TFWiki notes that early script drafts and the novelization depict Megatron killing Jazz by consuming/eating his spark.

    BW Dinobot would be a better example of death by general damage, IMO.
     
  15. sto_vo_kor_2000

    sto_vo_kor_2000 Banned

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    in the films....yes, but as seen in the toons, decapitation has rarely killed.
     
  16. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP Dry built

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    In BW characters were routinely decapitated for comedic effect. In Aimated it was made very clear tehy can survive decapitation, at least as long as the body is undamaged.
     
  17. KnightHawkke

    KnightHawkke A Man, Who Does Not Exist. TFW2005 Supporter

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    Hasbro or Bay writes list or memo, character dies.
    End of story
     
  18. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP Dry built

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    *Epicfacepalm*

    You reply was pointless and irrelevant. You obviously did not read the first post, since this thread is specifically about in-universe explanations and circumstances.

    Fail.
     
  19. Overlord Balder

    Overlord Balder Voices Slugslinger!

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    Well..it depends.
    TFP seems to be following the "Deceptation will murder you" logic with the Decepticon Drones [And Tailgate died due damaged caused to his head as well].

    I remember that.

    I just thought the first example to come into mind, Dinobot is also a good example.

    Agreed.
     
  20. KnightHawkke

    KnightHawkke A Man, Who Does Not Exist. TFW2005 Supporter

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    Yeap your right, I didn't.
    My bad. I own up to it.
    Well, in that case.

    G1 cartoon, generally seemed to revolve around overwhelming systemic damage.
    Comic, not so sure of exactly, seemed to change alot.
    Beast Wars.. generally seemed to involve very large energy discharges or conventional explosions.
    Unicron trilogy.. death usually just lead to reformatting there..
    Movie.. High heat to the armor.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2011

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