Hide shadow is a KO. Hellion is not. Not really a fair comparison given one toy gets to be made without having to worry about a lot of its dev cost while mmc has to pay for everything regarding their own products.

 

so hellion isnt inspired by other models? 100% R&D you say?

 

Huh? that's not at all what I said in the slightest?

Our designer made him from nothing, like our designers always do as all 3p designers do in their respective 3d program of choice and the usual development process then ensues.

But yes all toy design is built on the achievements of past toy design. But that doesn't magically make toy development cost go way down and I'm not sure what idea of toy development you have that would make you think this was the case? For every old challenge that is solved their are new challenges to tackle. And not every mold develops the same or works out the same. Problems arise, changes have to be made, and new parts always have to be molded, none of this comes free. Tolerances being as good as they can be is something people also now value tremendously and so quality control has to be iterated on more than ever if a company wants to be competitive.

KO makers literally avoid an immense chunk of the cost of the process by taking someone elses work for free and doing whatever they want with it.

 

I figured the cost of over sizing and upgrading Blackout would make development/cost similar to Hellion.

The tooling alone would make costs similar, no?

I know little about manufacturing.

 

"KO makers literally avoid an immense chunk of the cost of the process by taking someone elses work for free and doing whatever they want with it."

Did MMC really just say that?

OUR DESIGNER? So MMC, why knock the KO companies though? Dont be mad KO companies take something they didnt design and profit from it. Its kind of like IP theft huh MMC? i love how hellions tires fold in like mp 21. way to create that from scratch. also the not cliffjumpers leg can become loose fairly easy. you should of had a pop in lock at the top of the track/rail for that sliding pin screw.

Rather, do the do, start a shadow subsidiary of mmc and KO yourself to maximize profits. I know a good KO name, SMC... courtesy of a real SMC.. For example, the Black hextron KO, while crappy, was a few tolerances and loose parts away from being a decent 20-30 dollar KO. instead its bargain bin fodder @ 5-10 dollars. Now imagine if you would have KO'ed it instead, cutting the right corners etc.. quality KO?

Also, have a MMC factory direct page on taobao and cut out the middle man for those willing to order direct. Id order a terraegis, sphinx and malum malitia

PS.

AS SMC, KO the following... i mean innovate and modify the following......... FT-10, FT 04, FT 05, FT 06 and FT 07.. thanks. make them an even 70 - ben franklin ($100 USD) and ill take one of each

 

Eh tough to say. A toy like Hellion can end up with a development cost of 15 to 25 grand depending on various circumstance. He's one of the most complex tf's of his size to ever exist with a fully realized interior and unconventional design in several respects so mmc had to spend a bit more than usual making something of his size than they might otherwise do normally, hence the 70 dollar price tag.

If he were a normal design, no interior, no accessories, etc you'd probably have seen his price potentially be as low as 50 but he wasn't handled that way so he is what he is.

Hide Shadow certainly seems to be on the more premium end of ko's being so immense with many additional improvements to the old hasbro sculpt which I believe was a voyager originally? so yeah he's a perfect example of ko makers doing some super cool above and beyond stuff and he's certainly very impressive and ludicrously rich in value for the end customer given his size n stunning paint work n all. I would gladly pick him up myself if I could get him from one of my usual sellers but this hobby's so damn expensive as is I can rarely afford anything that isn't a major priority.

 

Seems like Final Victory has the right idea with their latest three pack, except I already have Huff and Brawny, and their Warpath is slightly off for me.

Hopefully that trio is popular so we have some decent mini-bot competition to keep the prices somewhat lower.

Meanwhile, Hellion looks great with the others.

 

I'm happy with this guy. I just needed Cliffy to complete my G1 Minibots like the picture above. Was a little torn between this guy and Toro, but in the end,I'm glad I chose this guy.

 

Anyone want my copy? Trying to rid myself of him, MP smokescreen, and Xtransbots hatch

 

Finally picked this one up, and I am definitely a fan. My instructions were printed with the back-half on both sides... is that standard on this guy? Luckily, videos abound, so I was able to have someone walk me through the first few steps. The transformation on the doors is a little scary the first few times, but despite all the fold-y panels and etc, the actual process is pretty quick and easy once you know the way of it. He looks good in both modes, and can even hold a passenger, which is an attention to detail even Takara struggled with! I'm very impressed.

 

Wonder how he'll look with the new TT Bee. I recall in Paik's video that Hellion was designed in a Hasui style (toy and cartoon fusion) so maybe he will look better with Hasui's Bee.

 

Holy sh!t! @wraith2021 is absolutely right. It is possible positioning the hip slightly backwards and move the upper legs forward. It makes Hellion look much more natural. Great discovery!


No comments about the dust on Windcharger, please! He likes it this way!  

 

Well helion folds up all nice and neat, so will totally not match the new bee  

 

That new bee has a watermelon head :/
It’s hard to ponder why they didn’t create the simplest of flaps to cover that inner mess of a foot structure.

 

Yeah, Bee2 is flubbed.

 

I find it uncanny just how centralised his legs and crotch become, it almost looks like it was meant to be like that.

Also, for those looking at the pics, it looks a lot better in person.

 

Helion is one of my favorite minibots. Nice alt and bot mode. Paint finish and transformation are well done.

 

Seeing mp45 really makes me wish mmc would tackle Bee. Heck any third party taking a shot at it at this point would be great to see.

And I'm worried takara is going to retool 45 in to their Cliffjumper now and he's going to have all the same hideously gappy ugly kibble problems as a result of it. Huge shame as I could still go for a nicer Cliff but seems Hellion is likely to remain the best option for a while.

I don't own any version of the old mp bee toy. People have told me it still holds up as a really fun nice toy today so might grab a version of it finally this year.

 

Is there any word that MMC could make a hubcap from this?

I doubt they will. He’s gonna be a bumblebee retool as much hoist will be from trailbreaker, or tigatron from Cheetor, or even tarantulus from blackarachnia. Cliffjumper is very different to bumblebee. And I doubt if MMC did a bee they could be able to make one from Helion.

 

I assume you mean would since Hubcap is literally just yellow and black Cliff with a different head but I've no idea if mmc intends to return to this mold at all.