New generation of fans

Discussion in 'Transformers Movie Discussion' started by piherculis, May 24, 2007.

  1. piherculis

    piherculis Look up once in a while

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    just a small note, but I was pumping gas at the station and noticed a guy with an autobot insignia sticker on his car. He told me that he became a fan from just the upcoming Movie Trailers and is really excited to see the movie (they are "bad ass"). He looked to be in his early 20's, certainly he could have known about transformers in his childhood but he said the upcoming movie was the first time he heard about them.

    So I guess my point is that regardless of homages, references and whatnot to G1, he brings me to think that the movie storyline will stand on its own for a lot of people, and probably come to be the "G1" for themselves.
     
  2. Rodimus

    Rodimus The Prime Producer

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    Would've happened just the same if they had kept a more traditional aesthetic design.

    -It's the first time it's every been attempted in live action

    -It's the first Transformers movie in 20 years.

    -Even if old designs and characters were used, for this reason it would still be new.

    -It's the old saying that Potential new fans wouldn't care either way because they never knew either way. While on the other hand new designs run the risk of alienating an already large (and potentially profitable) fan base that DOES care one way or the other.
     
  3. geerave

    geerave Well-Known Member

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    i love hearing about new fans! as for "alienating an already large (and potentially profitable) fan base that DOES care one way or the other", it has taken me a very very long time, but i like the new movie designs
     
  4. Shaun_C

    Shaun_C The REAL One True fan Veteran TFW2005 Supporter

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    Well attracting new fans is important. It keeps things fresh and new. And if this person's liking what he sees, then obviously a good job has been done.

    I find that "alienating the fan base" is at time HIGHLY over reactionary and totally knee jerk. Plus on a message board it's hard to gauge because there are fans who don't post :) 

    Plus new members have been registering here simply to say they're impressed. So if detractive posts should mean something then new members posting stuff like this should count too :) 
     
  5. VAwitch

    VAwitch G1 GeekGirl

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    **Please bear w/me - this ended up a bit longer than planned, due to similar threads)**
    In general, i do agree with you.

    But I keep coming back to the fact that a LOT of these arguments sound identical to the ones for the X-Men franchise - Wolverine's too tall, noone except Mag & Xavier are the right age, WTF were those suits (which I think looked more reasonable than Spandex), nekkid blue girl can't be Mystique...etc etc. While yes, X-3 dropped the ball in story, I know of quite a few people (including my 60-ish parents) who were only periphally aware of Xmen, and became fans due to the movies. Same for Spiderman or F4.

    Just as people poo-poo'ed the thought of making a series of StarGate, which IS a fair bit different than the movie, it's the quality &/or enjoyment factor that will keep ppl coming back (same goes for movie as la Spiderman & XMen2, even PotC). As long as the story isn't TOO corny/lame, the bot-on-bot-blowing-s*** up action will keep people coming back for more TF movies. AND tuning into the cartoon in the fall (IF they're the type that will watch toons in the first place).

    Meaning - you can depart from the "source" material, as long as you still do it w/ quality, as well as flair.

    And it may even grab ppl into checking out what's come before... remote chance of them going - "Wow - that was some good old school stuff - why don't we see something like story <X> or character <Y>". Saw it happen at my local comic store - says TMNT & HellBoy sales went up as result of the movies, TF sales are quite up due to the movie, Xmen had a surge (but the quality of the X comics is sooo uneven, I think newbies left for the same reason I stopped collecting them a while ago). With the news of Gatchaman movie in works, he says there's been some interest in the manga, as well as video sales of Gatchaman & Go-Lion/ Voltron.

    I know my son is part of the new generation of "80's show" (and early 90s) fans - loves TF (G1 & Cybertron), TMNT (more recent), Gargoyles, likes Voltron & Xmen, big into Spiderman due to recent movies. And that's fine w/ me - he knows diff TFs & such - but the *spirit* of the characters, and the *theme* of the series (Good v Evil) is timeless, and translates pretty well. Now if we just stop tossing in Anime-type humor, which doesn't translate so well in American culture, I'd be *really* happy - even my 4 y/o looks puzzled by what was supposed to be funny, other than embarassed bug-eyes.
     
  6. Omnius

    Omnius Well-Known Member

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    VAwitch, that could be one of the most well-thought-out posts I've ever seen here. :D 

    Also among successful 're-imaginings' - Battlestar Galactica.
     
  7. Firestorm

    Firestorm Red Mage in Training

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    I think the statement that non-fans wouldn't care either way is really inaccurate. Sure, SOME non-fans wouldn't care, but some would, too. My dad knows I enjoy TFs. He doesn't really care for TFs, although he does like some of the minor tricks engineered into the figures. But when he saw the movie designs, he was really impressed. He was also really curious as to how well it would translate to the toys.

    I truthfully think that at least some non-fans would be put off by a more "traditional" aesthetic. Not necessarily a lot, but we wouldn't know unless it were tried.
     
  8. Scraggin

    Scraggin Banned

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    Keep in mind these forums are for the more hardcore fans and people who's emphasis is on the toys more than the characters an fiction, and are used to just about anything being wrapped up in insignias and called a transformer. For more "casual" fans, that's a lot more true.
     
  9. Scraggin

    Scraggin Banned

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    But people were impressed just the same with the Citreon Transformer in it's time. I fail to see why those kind of people wouldn't be impressed with more traditional style TFs done in the same level of detailed CG as these are. After all, TFs up until now have only been toys and cartoons.

    Some people will be put off because of the "Super Mario Brothers Movie" effect. It gives off that kind of resonance.
     
  10. Scraggin

    Scraggin Banned

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    X-men didn't really depart from the source material. They just changed costumes, for the most part. And just because they were successful movies doesn't mean all the changes were positive. It was a bit silly that Wolverine is so tall but it's hard to get the right actor for these kind of things, so it's understandable. With the TFs they can make them look any way they want, so there's no excuse. And giant robots don't have the same "OMG THAT'S SO GAY" look Spandex has, so that rules that out too. The X-men also changed their costumes - and THE X-men, not some crappy spin off like the Unicron Trilogy X-men.

    X-men still had most of the main characters and plotlines from the comics, they just jumbled them up since it's no fun for hardcore fans to see the same stories played out again, and EVERYONE was recognisable. Ratchet, Ironhide, Megatron(more resembles Thunderwing), Starscream(because of the fact that he much more resembles Apeface or Jhiaxus despite having a few features from G1 Screamer, none of which are that unique to SS as opposed to other plane TFs) are completely unrecognisable and Bumblebee nearly is too. Only Prime and Jazz "for sure" look like the originals. NONE of them X-men are unrecognisable to their characters.

    That's what counts.

    No successful comic book movie has made the characters so unrecognisable as Transformers has. So why is it that so many of the fans are much much behind the designs? Because the TFs have changed before? Is that really an excuse? Apart from Beast Wars which was a different premise and different cast, were any of those changes that positive? Does the main audience for this movie even know or remember those changes? And when did they change THIS MUCH?

    Hellboy looks exactly like Hellboy! Spider-man looks exactly like Spider-man! The Fantastic Four look like the Fantastic Four! The Silver Surfer, a much more ridiculous looking concept in many ways than G1 TFs, looks like the Silver Surfer!(and is cool for it). The X-men are all instantly recognisable to who they are.

    Again, in this movie, only Prime and Jazz are immediately recognisable, other characters are only recognisable through deduction.

    Since the TFs are all CG anyway, why the hell couldn't they have looked more like the originals?

    The theme of the series is Good Versus Evil? Isn't that kind of EVERY kids show? Come on. The theme of TFs is more two warring alien factions fighting on earth, if you want to pick up the theme of it.

    TF in itself carries a certain soul to it, a personality. You can't strip that from something and expect it to be the same thing. Very few of the rabidly pro-movie fans seem to understand what the "soul" of a franchise is.
     
  11. nuopus

    nuopus Well-Known Member

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    Sooo ... unless we follow your line of thinking, we aren't hardcore fans. We are just "casual" or not fans at all?
     
  12. Shaun_C

    Shaun_C The REAL One True fan Veteran TFW2005 Supporter

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    That's pretty inaccurate to be honest. A LOT of the people on this and other TF fan boards are Eclectic in that they enjoy the various mediums that encompas Transformers. Some may put more emphasis on the toys, while some may put more emphasis on the cartoons/comics. Myself I'm a toys and cartoon person, as I find my interest in the comics fleeting at best.

    And to say that we're used to anything wrapped up in insignias and called Transformers is very disrespectful and antagonistic :redface2: 

    And for the record as cool as the Citroen ads may be.....The animation of the Transformers in the trailer and TV spots blows those ads out of the water honestly.

    And yes the X-Men movies did depart from the source material. Characters and relationships in some ways were different from how they were presented in the comics or the cartoon (FOX Kids toon not Evolution)
     
  13. Rodimus

    Rodimus The Prime Producer

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    Oh gosh, please don't start the "I'm teh betta fan dan you!" junk.

    I think what he means is that the people who don't frequantly visit the message boards or know what all is being made in the world of transformers really don't care what toys are being made. If they're just being introduced they're whole interest will be on story and something they can watch and be entertained with in a short time frame. We on the other hand have been at this for a very long time and some of us here are completionists and are even loyal to the name "Transformers" to a detrimental fault.

    VA that was a nice thought out post.

    As for the X-men movies, I find it revealing that Wolverine, Xavier, and Sabertooth were my favorite characters of the first movie and if you look at it, they were also the most true to the source material. (Wolverine didn't need to suite up to be Wolverine. He was shown alot with the white wife beater, the slicked up hair, and the furry sideburns in earlier material). They got the best actors to look those parts and it made it feel like X-men with those characters.* The rest of the cast (Especially the little nerd that played Cyclops) I really did not enjoy in the movie....

    The first time I ever saw X-men was the night just before it's release. My friends worked at the movie theatre and decided after work they would watch it. I never even knew they were doing an X-men movie. When I started to watch the movie, I instantly recognized Wolverine before they even said who it was. Same with Xavier. But most the others I had to guess at. And the worst part came when I saw them put on those gay looking black tight leather suites. My initial reaction was, "WTF? This don't look much like X-men.... you guys sure this is supposed to be a real X-men movie?" I said to my friends in the theatre. And this was comming from a person who was NOT an X-men fan! My only exposure to X-men was the 90s cartoon in the first season. And even then I was questioning how rediculous it looked. But thanks to Xavier, Wolverine, and for a short time Sabertooth, I got through it and managed to pull some entertainment value out of it. If it wasn't for those characters I probably would have lost my attention to following the plot. I just didn't understand why they made the others look so weird with those suits and with the odd choices of actors to play those characters.

    I don't FEEL Transformers when I look at the movie designs. The only one who is close to giving me that feeling when I look at it is Optimus Prime. And even then I have to try and ignore the flames to get to where I want to be with that transformers 'feeling'. With X-men at least there was more than 1 character to save the others from total debacle. And one of those characters was the main character to the whole story Hugh Jackman was great!

    But if I being a movie watcher with just casual interest in X-men had that kind of reaction, what do you think will happen to all the people who have left Transformers in their childhoods and moved on with their lives if they decide they just want to check out this latest flick? I imagine they will have the same type of shock and disgust at first and have to get over that speed bump to indulge in the rest of the movie.

    This is the big concern with the movie designs. People will have to get over the initial shock of their bug-like look in order to dive into the story, and that just seems like too much effort for something that is supposed to entertain you. It seems like more of a distraction than anything.
     
  14. Shaun_C

    Shaun_C The REAL One True fan Veteran TFW2005 Supporter

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    How you got that out of my post I'll never know...Particularly since I never said anything CLOSE to "I'm teh betta fan dan you"

    If you weren't talking to me however don't bother replying. And I apologize for the misunderstanding :thumb 
     
  15. Autobot_X

    Autobot_X Well-Known Member

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    I think he was referring to scraggin?
     
  16. Shaun_C

    Shaun_C The REAL One True fan Veteran TFW2005 Supporter

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    On further inspection you're probably right :)  Just that his post just after mine gave me the impression he was talking to me

    Sorry Rodimus...I may have jumped the gun
     
  17. Scraggin

    Scraggin Banned

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    No, I said the opposite. "Casual" fans are more likely to be upset since they only remember the G1 TFs and are more attached to the characters rather than just cool transforming toys.
     
  18. Scraggin

    Scraggin Banned

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    Guys, might want to read the rest of Rodimus's post whether he was refering to me or not:

    Makes it a bit more ambiguous who that comment was directed at.
     
  19. Rodimus

    Rodimus The Prime Producer

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    No prob dude. :thumb . It appears I had started to post just before you submitted yours. My post was with the expectation it would appear under nuopus'. :thumb 


    Edit: Okay it happened to me again! You guys are quick on the trigger tonight. Alright here's the skinny....

    My previous post was in response to what nuopus and Scraggin was getting into. The later part of it was in response to the thought that VAwitch's post gave me.

    This post was in response to Autobot X and Shaun C and should have appeared below Shaun C's post.

    Sorry for the confusion.

    Clear? I like fresh air! :D 
     
  20. Scraggin

    Scraggin Banned

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    Ah, now it makes sense.

    Maybe you meant to say Scraggin and not VAWitch too? You seem to be disagreeing with VAWitch, she's in support of the designs, I like some of the designs but am somewhat against it in principle(I wanted a mix of this and alternators).
     

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