Hmm, I hope I'm not being hypocritical, but that seems slightly different to me. I'm just not sure why.   I'll have to ponder this one.

Had this happen on an airsoft forum. I was selling a gun (Marushin 8mm Ruger Super Blackhawk, revolver fans) and some guy from Australia asked if I could hold it a couple of months as it would be difficult to impossible for him to receive it in Oz, but he'd be back in the UK later that year. Being an all-round awesome guy, I said yes. As time passes, I turn down some good offers of money and/or trades from other people. After a couple of months, the guy let's me know he can't afford it after all. I could have killed him

On the plus side, it did lead to me deciding on my policy regarding holding items for people in future. If someone asks you to hold an item, I suggest you take a non-refundable 10% deposit from them, for which you will hold the item for an agreed period of time. If they pay the remaining 90% by the end of that time, it's all good. If they haven't paid and have not contacted you in that time, the item goes back on sale and you keep the deposit. The main advantage is it makes people think about whether they can really afford the item.

 

I have no problem with "haggling" on prices.

Usually what I'll do is ask how much total shipped to me. If I like the price, I go for it, if I need the item, and the price is kinda high for my budget, I usually counter-offer and we go from there. If I dont need it, and its a want, and it's "too much"....I pass on the deal.

We are all here to get deals on stuff. If we were in it to make money, we'd be on eBay selling stuff, and wouldn't bother to come here to sell anything.

I know I have given out deals many times over....I sold a clear Alt. Mirage for $80 when he was going for three times that on eBay....why?....cause in my eye, we are all friends here, and we are all here looking for that deal....I sold Alt Swerve for $40....a couple of them....did I get the same deal in return?....NO.

But I dont do it for that reason. I know that someone here may have really wanted an item, but either missed the boat, or just couldn't afford it at the time so they had to pass on it....I've been there, I know what that feels like....it sucks.

So I do what I can to help out other fans/collectors/friends here....I'm a firm believer in you reap what you sew....you might not reap it when you want, but eventually all good deeds return.

Charging paypal fee's?....thats a tuffy....I have never charged them, and don't plan too. It's my choice to take paypal as a payment option. You aren't making me take it, so why would I charge you extra to cover fee's?....I look at is as its the price of doing business on my end.....to make you cover those fee's just seems unfair (IMO)

 

We at the Unicron booth did that because a face-to-face interface is useful for the hook. Nothing personal to anyone who came up to us for a set. ^_^

 

The lowball is easy to deal with. Just ignore it or respond with a "No."

What's the problem? Anyone who puts out an offer has to expect a rejection. And, they don't necessarily know what you paid or what it's current market price is.

 

Agreed, mostly...

I take into account paypal fees for almost everything under $100 by just adjusting the shipping fees. Shipping and handling encompasses most everything it takes to get the item to someone, including receiving payment.

Example, to send a loose deluxe sized figure to someone, I would probably charge $5.50 for Priority mail or $3.50 for 1st Class mail. This will cover the shipping, delivery confirmation, and part or all of the PayPal fee. Sometimes it's $0.50 off either way, but the day I start worrying about nickles and dimes with Transformers is the day I quit cold turkey.

 

I try to make my policies clear at the top of my threads. There are always gonna be moonbats who skip the rules and go straight to the list. When you expect people to be stupid, you rarely are disappointed.

My only real complaint is people who don't FINISH haggling with me. I have my price, you offer me yours, I reply with another amount, and..... 

If you wanna haggle fine, but as they say in Mortal Combat "FINISH IT!!!"

Thank You,

My name is Sunstorm, and I approve this message...

 

For those that are wary of people asking you to put an item on hold... why not ask for a deposit?

 

I hate when they get my damn order wrong at the drive thru!!!

But seriously... I feel you on the lowballing (especially, since you set the price). But ya know, thats how it is...

 

So here's a question... to put something on hold I always figure you have to pointedly say "Can you hold this?" or "I might want to pick a few more items from your list, can you hang on to that till then?".

If I just ask for information... like a price, or some shipping info, that's just an inquiry. Does it require a firm closure, a "yes" or "no"?

Yeah, there is that. Sometimes there's a legit reason for it, but most of the time... sketchy.

Funny... I do this all the time on Ebay, and never think twice about it. The seller is there to answer queries like that. But here I would never think of not responding after getting a shipping quote. I guess it's more personal here... also I guess the auction structure creates a different dynamic.

See, the way I see it, the Paypal fee is not the buyer's problem... it's your problem. Eat it, or factor it into your price as the cost of doing business, whatever... but charging the buyer directly for Paypal fees is like me counter-charging my Paypal currency exchange fees to the seller. Or charging them a fee based on a portion of my monthly internet bill, because I have to pay online.  

That's pretty outrageous. In my experience, house prices on that scale are negotiated around a few thousand dollars, not over a third-to-half of the total asking price!  

See, what you're talking about there is different than selling off parts of your collection. What you're doing in that case is more head-hunting on someone's behalf. I think that's a totally different service.

I have online buds that can buy stuff for me Stateside, but I try to make it clear that is absolutely contingent on how convenient it is for them. Asking someone to mount a grail quest on your behalf is a bit much.  

zmog

 

It's just a courtesy thing.

TBH, I've gone back and forth on how to do that. I do see your point, and I didn't realize how unpopular it was being clear about charging those fees. I'll likely adjust my sales in the future (most likely factoring it into the prices) so that the fees are invisible and I'm not stuck eating them.

My original rationale was that I don't like factoring the fees into all of my prices, because then people who pay with direct PayPal balance transfers (which is most of the buyers I've had) are paying extra to cover the few that don't. Plus, I usually price everything really low anyways, so eating the PayPal fee cuts even further into what I actually make, especially on small orders. And I can't fudge the shipping amounts to account for it either, since I give very detailed shipping quotes (my zip code, package weight, etc) that people can easily check to see whether I'm fudging the numbers. Also, by telling people I will charge the fees, I feel it's a bit more 'honest' than just hiding it in the price of the items somewhere.

 

If they just ask for a price or shipping info, I'll reply with that. And then I'll ask them how interested they are in buying to see if there's any potential for a sale instead of assuming they are.

I also have to disagree with your sentiment regarding Paypal fees. I don't think a person should simply "eat it". You really have to look at it from the perspective of a seller in this case.

 

I have to kind of agree with this statement. I have no problem with working the cost of paypal's fees into your price or S/H quote. Yes, it is a cost of doing business... but if it is factored into your price then no harm, no foul.

I like the idea of a non-refundable deposit on holds... I might have to do that in the future.

 

Lately, I've found myself working the fees into my S&H as well.

 

As with everything, I think you really have to look at it from all perspectives.

Taking a paypal payment can cost a fee for the seller.

Whereas receiving a money order will cost a fee for the buyer.

So as a seller, do I really care if I receive payment via paypal or via MO? Not really... except paypal takes a chunk of the change.

As a buyer, do I care if I pay by paypal or MO? Well, an MO costs me and paypal gets the item to me faster. So it's a "win-win".


So with those perspectives, going by paypal with out the seller adjusting a price is win-win for the buy but can be lose-lose for the seller. As a seller I don't care about the time difference between MO & paypal, so I think of paypal as a choice of convenience/speed for the buyer. Thus in that regard I think paypal fees should be charged to the buyer, making it "win-lose"/"lose-win" instead of "lose-lose"/"win-win".


I have some stuff I might be selling on the board later in the summer, so what I think I'll do is actually list prices that include a little extra for paypal fees and then offer a small percentage discount for buyers who chose to pay by MO.

 

In a forum, yes... but on Ebay? In that case it all comes down to the last minute of the auction anyway, doesn't it?

I would tell a seller here if I'm going to pass on an item... on Ebay, I just wouldn't bid.

There is that... and if you state up front what the Paypal fees will be, it's certainly not like you're being sketchy.

I just find it a bit petty on some level to bother with it. We all use Paypal (or most of us do), and depending on what kind of account you have, it costs you money to use it. Same for credit cards, interest, etc... but these are outside factors. Going back to the money order question, I wouldn't ask a seller to front me cash to help pay for the money order so I can buy their stuff.

"I need to pay by Money Order, so can you drop the price by $5?" It's comparable.

It's just a cost of doing business. You deal with that on your own.

I have sold hundreds of dollars worth of TF stuff through forums... not as much as many here, but enough. I've paid Paypal fees on payments received... so I have seen that perspective. It doesn't change my point of view on the matter.

Likewise, if you have a brick and mortar business, you don't charge your customers a "store rental fee" to help you pay for the space that allows you to display your wares. It costs money to accept Interac and Credit Card purchases in a store setting, but you don't tack on an extra fee.

Actually Car Rental companies do this... and it's pretty tacky. Here's our price... oh, and here are the 200 little extra fees we have related to our company, that bumps your rental cost up another 75%! Have a nice day! Grrrr.  

Your Paypal account is an expense, something that allows you to conduct business. You pay for those services out of your profits, not by taxing your customers. It's those expenses that inform where you set your prices.

Explaining that you charge a Paypal fee on top of the price of the item isn't dishonest... it's a useful transparency, showing where the money goes. But it's an extra detail that most buyers don't care about. Just show me the price, and I'll decide if I want to buy. Don't trouble me with "add-on" fees.

Just my feeling...

zmog

 

What about with international buyers? The fees are higher in that case. Do you still treat that as an expense? I'm thinking of dropping the paypal fees for U.S. buyers and only applying it to international buyers since there's a lot more involved there.

I really think it's just a matter of preference. I don't think it's inherently wrong for someone to tack on a paypal fee. It's just how a number of sellers work. It's more important for some than it is for others.

Clearly, you're more dismissive of it than I am, but I'm starting to see your point: that it's just better to pay (or "eat it") for the convenience if it helps you move stuff faster. It's also interesting how tacking on the fee to the listed price has a different effect on someone than mentioning it separately...when the results are essentially the same. It's all in how you say it.

 

Ah, I see where you're coming from here. I've only ever sold on the forums, so that's what I was thinking of.

See, I always stated in my sale policies that I'd add on PayPal fees of "$0.30 + 4.9%" on debit/credit card transactions through PayPal (pretty sure it was 4.9%, can't recall off the top of my head). Stated, up-front, what the fees would be and on what transactions they would be charged. The problem I had was that people would request a price quote and then not tell me they were paying by debit/credit through PayPal until after I'd given them a quote and they'd sent payment for approval. In those situations, I'd just eat the fee to keep the sale and avoid a fuss. However, I was being up-front about the fees, but buyers weren't being up-front with me about whether they would be incurring the fees. Now, I don't think any buyer was doing it maliciously or intentionally to screw me over, but it was a little frustrating that I had it clearly listed and explained, but people weren't reading it.

True, but stores do embed those costs in the price they charge for the goods they sell, they don't just 'eat' it and reduce their profits. There may not be a "store rental fee" line on you receipt, but it's been calculated and included in the price of the product; you just don't see it.

 

For me if someone outright asks me to hold something I will, but I'm starting to rethink that because half the time I never hear back from them(you know who you are) and lose other potential buyers because of it.

Now if someone just asks for a shipping quote I'll give it to them and ask if they want me to hold it for them, if I don't hear back by the end of the day I just assume no.

 

Different people react differently. You can't please everyone. I wish more people would be aware of the paypal fees when asking for cost+shipping on the boards. I build my pp fees into my price because I know a lot of people don't like to do the math. So I end up charging a +5% markup versus the the 4% paypal fee. I figure I get more sales this way ($50) versus ($48+paypal fee). There's also a bunch of people who don't realize that shipping ($10) incurs paypal fee ($0.30-$0.40) also.


If the paypal gift option becomes more widely used then I may change my pricing but I'm not holding my breath.

 

I'd disclose my magic formulas for reaching prices and such, but that might turn away potential buyers... Either way, I will say the only money that goes into my pocket is the money from the sale of the figures themselves... Everything else goes into making the transaction possible.

My #1 problem as a seller has been people mailing payments. 9 out of every 10 fails to show up ($10 says 9 of every 10 was never sent in the first place). I've gone to strictly-paypal for transactions because 1) If I buy something, I'll be paying with Paypal and 2) if I ask them to send me my money, they do.

I'm not too fond of shipping costs these days, either. I lose numerous deals because shipping makes it too expensive... I'm sorry, there's no way I can send 2 Voyagers and a deluxe halfway around the world for $4. It just isn't going to happen.

I'd throw in some other crap that bothers me, but I think it would be more fitting for a "buying pet peeves" thread where we bitch out dumb sellers.