Is Starscream genuinely evil?

Discussion in 'Transformers Robots In Disguise / Prime Discussion' started by Rumblestorm, Oct 10, 2016.

  1. Rumblestorm

    Rumblestorm Well-Known Member

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    The recent episode got me asking this question. To start off, his malicious ways seem to stem from eons of abuse from Megatron. He was always to some extent always trying to impress/amount to Megatron, particularly in Season 3 of Prime. His master, whom he is expected to look up to, always treated him like trash, and so he now holds great resentment to the point of wanting to kill Megatron. But beneath all that, I feel like Starscream is repressing the goodness and nobleness- so much so that he is completely oblivious to it. Think about it; When he served others, he accomplished a lot more than when he was on his own-- yes he would always failed nonetheless, but he got closer to victory when being more noble (as noble as he could have been, at least) than full-on treacherous. Its as if Starscream was born to be noble and good, but was lead astray down a dark path that corrupted him, and imprisoned his goodness in a place where Starscream would unlikely ever free his goodness. This is furthermore supported by the fact that the Dark Star Saber (which, may I remind you, is made from the blood and essence of the Transformers' god of evil himself) rejects him. Starscream was a bot made for goodness and nobility, but fell down a path of malice and corruption. He was meant to serve others in the name of goodness, which explains why he fails at everything malicious, but goes a little further when he is serving Megatron (because it subconciously comes from a place of nobleness). He resents Megatron for abusing him when all Starscream ever really wanted was to impress and serve his master. The Dark Star Saber rejects him because of that goodness that remains hidden deep within his spark.
    I am not the best speaker, so I apologize if this didnt make too much sense, but I hope you guys can understand what I am trying to suggest.
     
  2. Rumblestorm

    Rumblestorm Well-Known Member

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    Regardless I hope this is explored further, but I doubt it given this show's lack of delving further into its characters.
     
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  3. kittycatusername123

    kittycatusername123 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, Bumblebee would have told his team that he lost his voice box during the war.
    I wonder why he didn't tell them that.
    Was he embarrassed to?
     
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  4. Spin-Out

    Spin-Out "It's just... Asinine."

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    He killed Cliffjumper and gloated about it to Arcee. He's pretty evil to me, but in a likable and funny way.
     
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  5. Rumblestorm

    Rumblestorm Well-Known Member

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    Like I said, he's gone down a dark path and had lost himself.
    But its possible that deep inside, unbeknownst to him and everyone else, there is goodness. He's just broken and morally poisoned.
     
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  6. EnergonWaffles

    EnergonWaffles Autobot's Head Chef Moderator

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    I don't think he was ever "corrupted." I think the war let the insecure, dark side of him come out. Throwing WFC/FOC in there, Starscream probably would've been fine with his respectable job if the war hadn't happened. He'd be a terrible boss, but he had his own little domain to rule up there.

    I think in Prime/RID, his motivations are more sympathetic. Starscream is after power, sure, but before that I think he's after respect and acceptance. Fowler hinted at that in Prime. Sadly, he lacks the ability to get either one of those properly. Misery loves company.

    Starscream is that guy who nobody likes, but he wants respect so badly he'll bully everybody else until they pretend. And to make himself feel better, he'll make sure everybody else is knocked down a few pegs. His strategy for getting to the top is pushing everybody else down below his level, or eliminating them outright.

    So imho he's still evil- he's just a more complicated evil than Megatron or some of the other baddies.
     
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2016
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  7. soundwaverulls

    soundwaverulls Well-Known Member

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    Pretty much this. Besides, the only time he ever accomplished anything was when Megatron wasn't around. Before arriving on Earth, his troops captured Arcee, and with Shockwave's help, discovered the location of Optimus Prime. He set up energon mines that he ran for years in secret. His troops captured Cliff and he killed him. On his own, he managed to secure all of the Omega Keys. Then towards the series' end, with Shockwave's help, he created two Predacon servants, who he (accidentally) managed to kill when they turned on him. Meanwhile, under Megatron he achieved... What did he achieve? He did come up with the plans to use the kids as hostages to protect the Omega Lock, and to place the blame for the unborn Predacons' destruction on the 'Bots, but that's nothing compared to what he did on his own. Not only was Megatron such a bad leader that he accomplished little, but he also dragged down Screamer with him, though I don't think causing him to be evil.
     
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  8. AlexaStar

    AlexaStar Starscream is love

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    Well, there was that one time in Prime when he saved Arcee from being killed by Airachnid when he was under absolutely no obligation to do so. And this despite saying he hates "two-wheelers" more than "insects" (or something to that effect).

    In addition, he did this to repay Arcee for sparing him in an earlier episode, even when she was fully intent on killing him and would have done so had Bumblebee not given her puppy-dog eyes.

    But nothing more is made out of this (kind of like many things in Prime), so whatever.
     
  9. Fallout

    Fallout Well-Known Member

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    a murderer who supports genocide and oppression is still an evil being, regardless of how they got there. you're responsible for your own choices.
     
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  10. RedWolf

    RedWolf Well-Known Member

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    I think Folwer had the right idea about Starscream. He doesn't know what he wants.
     
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  11. DOTM Bumblebee

    DOTM Bumblebee I must be some kind of nut...

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    I do think Starscream's motivations - having the respect of others - are sympathetic, but this is the guy who executed a wounded prisoner (Cliffjumper) and gloated about it to his partner (Arcee), mocked Bumblebee for essentially being disabled when said Autobot was already feeling inadequate for the same reasons, constantly abused a newborn Cybertronian (Predaking), devised plans that and tried to absorb seven Mini-Cons without their consent. I won't deny Starscream is after respect more than anything else, but he goes about it by acquiring as much power as he can, and bullying others into at least pretending to give him the respect he's after. Megatron clearly had a role to play in making Starscream who he is by using him as a whipping boy when things didn't go his way, and perhaps that led Starscream to believe that using superior power to bullying others weaker than you was how to gain respect, but Starscream still has chosen to commit numerous evil actions and gloat about it to those emotionally affected by it. I think he has the potential to redeem himself, but because of not only what he's done, but his attitude towards his evil deeds, no one wants to give him that chance to become a better person.
     
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  12. Thilda

    Thilda Treat your mother right!

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    Well in this universe Megatron gets a redemption arc, so how can Starscream be genuinely evil.
    Starscream does a lot cruel things, but so do a lot of other characters. In "Rock Bottom" Arcee and Bulkhead leave Screamer stuck in a cave under a crushing boulder with a guy who just tried to execute him. Knockout likes to torture. Bulkhead brutalised Starscream's clone (thinking it was the real Starscream) just because he got mad. Autobots want to use "less civil ways of interrogation" on Soundwave. The list goes on. They are at war and both sides do bad things, it's just that Starscream is the only character who gets called on his bad behaviour (and rarely, if ever, learns from his mistakes). We get to see him go through a lot of traumatising experiences, so it's hard to say how truly evil he is when most of the time he's mentally in a really bad place.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2016
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  13. ThePendulum

    ThePendulum Active Member

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    It's the equivalent to Austin Powers losing his mojo :D 

    Sounds like Armada Starscream. I too would to see this fleshed out. But likely we'll never see that happen.

    This. Megatron the bad boss. Plus, in Deadlock, Starscream manages to hold up well against Arcee.

    Also, this. Optimus never being called out for his "no killing of defenseless combatants policy", Arcee's quest for revenge which ended up giving Megatron control of the Insecticons in the Armada ep, Ratchet being partly responsible for the destruction of the Omega Lock for not taking care of the kids, and I think there's a recent example of Bumblebee being racist in that RID ep Metal Meltdown; they couldn't ID Saberhorn as a prisoner of the Alchemor. For all they knew, this is an relatively innocent Decepticon hobbyist pursuing an ore collection.
     
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  14. Shodi

    Shodi Member

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    Starscream is "evil", then again, he might have his own "code", but, yeah, he's basicly a decepticon and does whatever benefits him most atm.
     
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  15. ILoveDinobot

    ILoveDinobot Not today Galvatron!

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    Honestly, I think the only decepticon who is truly evil is Airachnid. War can change a person. So can any kind of power. I interned in a domestic abuse shelter and I was taught that police officers and war veterans are the most common offenders. Why? Because they have a job to do everyday where they force their authority on people or are trained to use force if someone doesn't obey them. Then they come home to their families and can't leave the job behind because it's their way of life, what they do most of their day. Not all are like this, but it's difficult for a lot of people to be at war or have a job where they are in danger everyday and come home and be the person they were. I hope that makes sense without offending anyone.
     
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  16. Ruizu1990

    Ruizu1990 I'm a girl, not a boy.

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    He does truly have some bad personality traits. But I remembered this description from one of the figure boxes:

    Which made me wonder: did Starscream go mad because of loneliness? Long periods of isolation are not good for you, health wise.

    I believe he has a crappy personality combined with years upon years of fighting a terrible war, which has made him into the person he is.

    I kinda wish he would improve himself some way. It would be nice to see some character development and maybe even a more hopeful ending for our Cons. Megatron did it, why can't he?
     
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  17. Thilda

    Thilda Treat your mother right!

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    The thing with Starscream, aside from his crappy personality traits, is that mentally and emotionally he is in a very bad place. It's not clear (even to Starscream apparently) what he truly wants. In the latest episodes his main objective was to get revenge on Megatron, and conquest was an afterthought after he got his hands on the Dark Starsaber. Back in TFP he seemed so intent on becoming the leader of the Decepticons, but now instead of gathering Cons that are still loyal to the cause he's on a quest to get revenge on Megatron for abandoning him. Like, he should be happy Megatron got himself out of the way.

    Starscream seeks approval, wants to be important, respected and cherished (in "Patch" he not only relives the memory of becoming the leader, but fantasises about troops cheering on him)- and what he gets is the exact opposite, no matter how hard he tries. Starscream is always made to feel worthless, especially Megatron excels at devaluating him (that's why it was so easy for Bee to bait Starscream). For Starscream Megatron is the embodiment of everything he wants to be (over the course of the series there are many moments where he mimics Megatron). He sees power as the only reason someone can be worthy and of course Starscream's quest for power is a horrible and unhealthy mechanism that not only will never grant him love, but also isolates him from others and as of recently, put him in a coma.

    Actually the only thing that gives me hope that there is a better side to Starscream is when he saves Arcee' life. Because it was more than just Decepticon bushido. Starscream could have just easily let Airachnid finish the job, because sparing Arcee' life and engaging a dangerous enemy while injured, unable to transform and homeless are two entirely different things. And he did it all because she spared his life. After Megatron choose him over Dreadwing Starscream became absolutely dedicated to his leader. Acts of kindness go a long way for Starscream apparently.
     
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  18. transmasterc

    transmasterc Well-Known Member

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    Well, in the G1 series he was more a sniveling coward. Though he has no problem wanting to take Megatron out. not sure how he is in the TF RID series.
     
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  19. kaijuguy19

    kaijuguy19 Keyblade Wielder

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    Pretty much this. He's very much an arrogant self righteous sociopath who's willing to go to pretty nasty and terrible lengths to get what he wants even if it means to lie and beat down anyone to do it even if his feelings of being kept under the likes of Megatron are at least understandable. This makes his hatred towards Megatron ironic since in reality he's no better then him some can argue may be worse because despite how much of a murderous tyrant Megatron was he was at least honest about who is he and what he'll do.
     
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  20. kittycatusername123

    kittycatusername123 Well-Known Member

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    I think Starscream is a psychopath, to the end. His whiny voice will never ever make anyone take him seriously. But he can make good threats.
     
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