Is it in bad taste to say the Decepticons are like the Nazis?

Discussion in 'Transformers General Discussion' started by Bass X0, Jun 8, 2012.

  1. Bass X0

    Bass X0 King of Muay Thai

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    and that Megatron is like Hitler?

    (yes, obviously the Decepticons are fictional and the Nazis were real)
     
  2. Cybermnky

    Cybermnky Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I would really just avoid this whole line of thought - it won't end well.
     
  3. Autobot Burnout

    Autobot Burnout Hammer of the Gunplas

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    As in a chaotic, splintered, not-nearly-as-well-organized version of the Nazis? I guess you could say that. Megsy just bypasses the idea of the Aryan Race and just kills anybody he doesn't like.
     
  4. Yggdrasil

    Yggdrasil Banned

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    Depends on the continuity.

    But in every continuity they aren't nearly as well organised as the Nazi military was.
     
  5. flamepanther

    flamepanther Interested, but not really

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    Besides that I don't think they're very much like Nazis, it is probably in bad taste one way or another.
     
  6. Tripredacus

    Tripredacus K-Mart-ian Legend

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    Its a bad comparison.
     
  7. Gingerchris

    Gingerchris Telly-headed Tyrant

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    They're just bad guys. Like the Nazis were. One isn't trying to be the other. They're just both bad.
     
  8. doomboy536

    doomboy536 Universe Onslaught fanboy

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    It's a pissing awful comparison. The only simliarity they share is that they are both committed to conquest.
     
  9. Aernaroth

    Aernaroth <b><font color=blue>I voted for Super_Megatron and Veteran

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    Pretty much, yeah. I mean, you could try to draw parallels, but with the cultural context of the Nazis, it would not go well.
     
  10. Ravenxl7

    Ravenxl7 W.A.F.F.L.E.O.

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    I don't think it's in bad taste, but I'm not seeing the comparison. If I were to compare any group of fictional characters to Hitler and the Nazi's, it would be Voldemort and the Death Eaters.
     
  11. Gingerchris

    Gingerchris Telly-headed Tyrant

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    There certainly is main focus on pure blood and 'ethnic cleansing' when it comes to those guys.

    Although Voldemort doesn't have the nose for a toothbrush moustache. :p 
     
  12. Cyber-Scream

    Cyber-Scream Well-Known Member

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    The only similiarity I see between them is they're both evil. I see the Galactic Empire from SW to be much more comparable.
     
  13. flamepanther

    flamepanther Interested, but not really

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    I don't see any more similarity there either. The Galactic Empire lacks the nationalist, socialist, and racist aspects that would tend to indicate a Nazi analogue--especially the nationalist and racist parts.
     
  14. Maximo Prime

    Maximo Prime Bassist of Ill Repute

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    I think it's in very poor taste, and I don't see the point in bringing it up.
     
  15. Russian fan

    Russian fan Proud Autobot Ally TFW2005 Supporter

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    Yes, this is something to think. Decepticons also refer to people like the Nazis consider "lower" races. You can find a parallel between Megatron and many human tyrants, not only to Hitler. But unlike other tyrants that their subordinates were often the same villains, but here the opposite - all the other Decepticons are also convinced cruel egoists, but their appetites in power is less. It was in this they are similar to the Nazis - Hitler had a lot of fanatical helpers. It is ideology: if you can take something - so take it, stepping over other lives, and even other world.
     
  16. bossman328

    bossman328 Well-Known Member

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    Bad taste...yeah. Did Megatron want to eliminate the autobots and conquer the galaxy like Hitler wanted to slaughter Jewish people and conquer the world...I guess
     
  17. SMOG

    SMOG Vocab-champion ArgueTitan

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    First off, I don't think it's really in poor taste. It's not "too soon". The Nazis have become the go-to bad guys to be referenced in just about every bit of pop culture produced since WWII, so I don't think that suddenly it's in bad taste to do so. It's weird how it's become such a taboo topic all of a sudden. The war happened, and it's long been part of our cultural baggage, but people who FOUGHT the Nazis weren't so hush-hush about it. It's just evolved into this weirdly unbroachable topic in recent years... which is hilarious considering that Stephen Spielberg's been using Nazis as goofy cartoon villains since Indiana Jones rode onto the scene, and I'm sure 90% of us grew up playing with army men molded in that iconic grey with those distinctive little Stahlhelms. It's not like we need to suddenly pretend they're not there.

    The Nazis did very bad stuff... as have lots of other fiendish dictators over the centuries. It just so happens that the Nazis had a very distinctive aesthetic movement behind their agenda, that made them extremely iconic ambassadors for evil, and we've been looting that stylistic legacy for the last 70 years, whether it's Star Wars or Gundam or Hellboy or whatever...

    Not unlike Hitler, who seemed to use the Aryan rhetoric to deal with whoever he had a personal beef with... or maybe Stalin who was just as death-crazy, but who seems to get less publicity.

    Depending on the version of the fiction, Decepticon and Cybertronian supremacy DO play a pretty big role in his platform, so it's not that far off. A lot of it IS about Decepticon pride, and returning Cybertron to its rightful place as the seat of rulership for the universe, and the old motto "everything is fodder" does fit the totalitarian "socialism" of Megatron's vision. Of course, in IDW, the flip side is that the Decepticons were form in reaction to severe class/race inequalities in Autobot society, so you could make the comparison with them too.

    I think he meant that the Decepticons could be better compared to the Galactic Empire. Of course, the fact that the Galactic Empire is heavily molded on the Nazi aesthetic should not be ignored. I don't know about the nationalist, socialist and racist aspects of the Empire (though I do notice that most of them are human and white), but they are founded on fanatical devotion to a totalitarian figurehead who preaches the virtues of hate (Palpatine). And they are an expansionist empire that works on the basic Roman model, which was also the model for the Nazis. So it's kind of impossible to separate the Galactic Empire from those associations, I'd think.

    On the other hand... is Megatron big on extermination? It seems to me that he's more keen on using every resource to the utmost. He doesn't have a personal beef with humans or other alien races... but he'll happily suck your planet dry of resources and turn your people into slaves. In a weird way that at least seems less petty and hateful.

    And in fairness, he treats humans like we might treat cattle... we are insects to him. The real measure would be how he views Autobots or other "races" of Transformers. Every war uses an inherent rhetoric of superiority and nationalism, but with Megatron I think it's ideological, not about racial divides within the Cybertronian species. I don't think he sees Autobots as a sub-species. At least not in the comics. In the old cartoons, the Autobots actually WERE a distinct "race" so maybe there was an element of racism there.

    However, if you look at the variety of deranged, monstrous psychopaths that fill out the Decepticon ranks, you might wonder if they might be even worse than the average Nazi soldier, who in the end was most often just a naive, brainwashed patriotic schlub who drank the Nationalist kool-aid. Not every Nazi was a sadistic concentration camp commandant. But if you read the bios for the Decepticons, at least half of them are probably that morally bankrupt and despicable.

    All Hail Megatron actually touched on this, and provided one explanation for why Megatron surrounds himself with such monsters... ironically, a page straight out of Stalin's playbook. Hm.

    zmog
     
  18. flamepanther

    flamepanther Interested, but not really

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    At the risk of sounding political, I've seen most of those same accusations levelled against the United States. Enough said on that though. You're dead on with the aesthetic thing though. It's become so ubiquitous that I overlooked it.
    I think Megatron makes a very good imagining of a Randian Objectivist dictator, if such a thing could exist, for the reasons you state here.
     
  19. SMOG

    SMOG Vocab-champion ArgueTitan

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    Well, like I said earlier, in times of war or empire-building, nationalism and pride based on exclusivity always gets pushed to some degree. It doesn't matter what country you're in. But the Nazis turned all of that up to eleven, and didn't seem to be too concerned about hiding it. The other benefit of them being so "iconic" is that they serve as a valuable cautionary tale to remind other industrialized nations of the dangers of getting caught up in propaganda, nationalist fervor and victimized self-righteousness. The whole point of remembering is not to make a monument of shame, but to remind us "it could happen again, it could happen here, it could happen to us... if we let it". Hopefully that message takes root, at least.

    Hahaha! Brilliant! Yeah, if played properly, I think that's pretty much Megatron to a T. :) 

    zmog
     
  20. Noideaforaname

    Noideaforaname Pico, let's go up to Zuma

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    I don't think it's so much bad taste as it is Nazi/Hitler comparisons are so obnoxiously overdone and all to often have little in common with whatever they are being compared to. You really lose the whole scope of their wickedness when the common landlord is labeled one.
     

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