In This Thread: A former "hater" explains why DOTM changed his mind (Spoilers)

Discussion in 'Transformers Movie Discussion' started by roy_flagg00, Jul 7, 2011.

  1. roy_flagg00

    roy_flagg00 I want more life....

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    I have been a hater since the designs of the transformers for the first movie leaked. Needless to say, I was expecting to hate DOTM. But you know what, it wasn't that bad. I still have many gripes that I have had since the original film, but I would still give this movie a passable rating. I am going to lay out here things that I thought were good, and things that I think really weren't good or were missed opportunities. First the good:

    -good overall story
    I did not fall asleep

    -decent robot screen-time
    There was a decent variety of robots and okay screen-time for them.

    -Action scenes were more visually coherent
    I was actually able to understand what I was looking at. The highway chase was pretty damn good, but these types of scenes are bay's strong point as a director. I wish the whole movie could take place on the highway at 70 miles per hour.

    -Brains and Wheelie should have their own movie
    I was expecting to be annoyed by them, but I laughed every time they were on screen. They served as perfect comic relief.

    -The agent Simmons portion of the plot was pretty good
    Again, I was expecting to be annoyed by him, but him and Sam searching for clues was a pretty interesting part of the movie.

    -Sam's parents screen-time
    I'm on the fence on this one, but since they were funny, I'll say this was positive even though they overstayed their welcome in the film by a few minutes.

    That being said, there were some areas that if improved could have made this an incredible film, not just a good one, for me:

    -Are transformers robots, or some kind of humanoid/robot hybrids?
    I was under the impression that the transformers were robots, but I have had the feeling since the first movie that Bay and company did not feel that way. After seeing DOTM, it is clear that there is some type of humanoid/insect theme that the designers of the transformers were going for. The bleeding by the dreads and the spitting of Starscream were suspect, but the honeycomb construction of Cybertron was the dead giveaway. I never agreed with this, and if anything it took attention away from the transforming aspect of the transformers.

    -WHY NO SEEKERS?
    This really ticked me off. In the Chicago battle, we see Decepticons piloting airborne vehicles.
    Why not just have Decepticons that transform into planes?
    This to me underscores the lack of understanding of the source material that the writers and Bay had. How much better would this movie have been if they had the seekers in some form? These guys all had simple personality traits that could have easily made their scenes really cool. Also, if the seekers were in the movie, There would have been a good reason to have a confrontation between them and the Airialbots :D ream:
    ultimately, there really was a missed opportunity here to bring in more bots with personalities rather than generibots. The same goes for the dreads. They weren't so bad (actually, they were kinda cool) but the chase would have been better with the stunticons. Motormaster could have had a rivalry with Ironhide with the setup and backstory dialog being a literally a minute. Ironhide could have fought off the Stunticons but been killed by Sentinel. Later in the movie, Menasor could have faced off against Superion :D ream:

    -Sentinel prime and Shockwave should have been combined into a new character called Shockwave
    Shockwave was obscenly misused in this movie. What has traditionally been his calm and logical demeanor was changed into a caveman.
    AND HE DIDN'T EVEN TRANSFORM! THIS IS A MOVIE CALLED "TRANSFORMERS", RIGHT?
    Seriously though, A calm and logic-obsessed Shockwave, Looking to make peace by any means neccessary, enslave earth to rebuild cybertron, and hunting down the Autobot and Decepticon rebels would have made much more sense for the movie, and would have provided a better reason for Megatron to lend Prime an assist at the end.

    -Prime should have been two characters called Optimus Prime and Sentinel Prime
    Prime shooting off one-liners while savagely murdering his opponents does not fit with his other character traits (wise, fair, etc). He should have kept his moral highground and another character should have been the psychopath who swoops in at the end and saves the day.

    -Carly, you are the weakest link
    This movie did not need a female love interest if for no other reason than it becomes hard to suspend disbelief for the more important action scenes in the movie when you are already constantly suspending disbelief about how the lamest, most losery loser phag like Sam could possibly score a girl like that. She added ZERO value to the story in any sense. The laughable "love" story portion of the plot was clearly an attempt to satisfy female viewers. Sam has already dealt with these issues in the previous two movies, so it just felt like something recycled for the sake of having a hot girl in the movie. I could go on about this for much longer, but I'd rather move on and not get side tracked.

    -Sam has had no character ark throughout the three films
    Sam's character is the same as in the first movie, which is strange considering all that he's been through. One of the best parts of the movie for his character is when he gets pissed at Malcovich's character and tells him how he saved his ass twice and he didn't even know it. The rest of the movie, Shia Laboof (spelled wrong, I don't care) is playing the same guy he played in part one and two, who is the same character he played in Constantine, who was the same character he played in I robot. It's getting old. I for one am glad that he's gone and hope the Statham rumor is true. This movie franchise needs a real injection of 80's style sweaty, bare chested, face punching, body-count-increasing, no female romantic lead, rated R testosterone.

    -Major missed opportunity for jetpack
    I loved how early on they showed Special forces guys training to take down decepticons, and the Stick-bombs and Grapple hooks were awesome, but they were waisted on having Sam use them. Tyrese or not-Tyrese-white-guy should have used them to take out Starscream with some style. Also, jet-packs should have been used for the paragliding scene over Chicago :D ream:

    -Ironhide's death
    Again, another missed opportunity here. Ironhide should have been Shown to be the heart of the team, and a quiet moment of grief over his death by a gathering of both his human and autobot comrades together would have been a really cool touch. It would have also made the audience care a bit more about the Transformers.

    -Q dying
    Having the equivalent of an old man getting shot execution style was not good taste. There was another missed opportunity here I will explain. It should have been Dino who got shot. Dino should not have been Dino, but Sunstreaker, Sideswipe's brother. If this was the case, and the sibling rivalry angle was established earlier, his death would have had a much greater emotional impact in the film. Also, An old man would not have to be shot execution style.

    -the wreckers should not have been cars
    There are other vehicles on the planet earth. I wish someone told that to Bay and the design team. On this note, Springer should have been in the movie.

    -comic relief: too much of a good thing
    Bay seems to not realize that the effect of comic relief serves a purpose, and that effect gets diluted if overused and eventually can turn into a distraction, breaking the flow of a scene.

    -The end?
    The end was tacked on very badly and did not provide a good sense of closure.

    -If I see Leonard Nemoy on the street, I'm going to perform a citizen's arrest
    How dare he ripoff a line from "Wrath of Kahn". I wanted to cry in shame when he said it (no, I'm not going to repeat it). I hope the ghost of Ricardo Montalban haunts his dreams till he dies.

    I realize that my dislike outnumber my likes, But that's only because I did like the film and I just wish it could have stood up to great action films of the past, given that it had such an enormous budget and incredible special effects.The problem is Bay. His strengths as a director make the movie good, but his weaknesses are very prominent (especially the basic film making ones) and are what prevent the movie from really being something special.

    Ultimately, this movie was like a perfectly baked and incredibly tasty chocolate cake, but instead of using chocolate frosting on the outside, the baker used dog poop to frost the cake instead.
     
  2. shroobmaster

    shroobmaster Well-Known Member

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    Neeerrrd!
     
  3. roy_flagg00

    roy_flagg00 I want more life....

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    Also, I forgot to add: Does anyone have an industrial strength foot-from-mouth remover?
     
  4. ColdRod

    ColdRod Well-Known Member

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    I cant believe i just read all that lol

    Cant say i agree with you on much, though there are some good points.
     
  5. the goth rat

    the goth rat Well-Known Member

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    hey you know what if i had just been beaten to an inch of my life had my arm sliced off i think i'd probably be pissed off!!! and with all my remaining strength i would of returned the favor on who ever did it to me and after all that if my arch nemesis had the balls to say something like "who are you with out me" i'd shove my foot UP HIS ass and break his neck and i like to think that i'm a nice person!!! i understand Primes feelings at the end of that film he was pissed and he had enough!!!
     
  6. Trypticon 2010

    Trypticon 2010 Well-Known Member

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    While I don't agree on all your points about the movie, I can at least understand why you feel that way about them.

    This part though just makes no sence to me. Why can't Leonard use his own line from a film he has previously been in? It's a great line and actually fitted really well into the situation, it wasn't like it was just tacked on for the sake of a Star Trek reference. Leonard Nemoy was the perfect casting for SP in my opinion, he can say whatever he wants as long as it fits the character and the situation.
     
  7. Ephland

    Ephland Let's Go Rangers

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    Wow, seeing as you have been one of the more outspoken critics of the film franchise, this was a good read.

    In the first movie, they described themselves as "Autonomous Robotic Organisms". So yeah, not completely robotic.
     
  8. thien425

    thien425 Well-Known Member

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    What do you mean?
     
  9. SkyfiRe71

    SkyfiRe71 Precursor

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  10. roy_flagg00

    roy_flagg00 I want more life....

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    Probably would have been better if he recycled a Galvatron line instead. I don't like any reference to Khan in an movie. Kahn is like the "declaration of independence" of sci-fi action movies.


    Yea, I forgot about that. Still, sometimes I can't help but think that the designs were originally supposed to be for a SCI-FI channel saturday movie called, "insectoid invaders", or, "transmorphasects", and they just got refined for the big screen and changed to transformers characters.
    That said, Megatron's new design was the best of the entire trilogy, and it's a shame he was kinda shown to be a bit of a crazy defeated nutjob.
     
  11. roy_flagg00

    roy_flagg00 I want more life....

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  12. Starscreamownz

    Starscreamownz Air Commander

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    He was a crazy defeated nutjob. And i wish they did it more. Maybe have him crazily talking to the animals in Africa as if they actually care.

    I don't see a problem with making the decepticons look alien. Its a story ploy to make the audience associate them with something strange and foreign. If they have more human features like a human face it would be harder for people to feel they're a dangerous force here to kill us. You need to make the antagonists look strange and foreboding.
     
  13. roy_flagg00

    roy_flagg00 I want more life....

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    EXACTLY THE PROBLEM.
    a good film maker can get this across without the obvious "make them look mean" shtick. When you make the viewer use their brain more, they feel they have more invested in the story because it took more effort for them to understand it, even if the increased effort is not that much. Hannibal Lechter was extremely evil, but we got this not from his appearance (he looked like a normal prisoner) but from his actions and mannerisms.
     
  14. Greyley

    Greyley Well-Known Member

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    Um, no. The laughable love story is an attempt to satisfy male viewers by giving them some T&A to leer at. Hence the casting of models instead of real actresses, and pointless lingering shots of said models draped over motorcycles and bouncing almost bare-assed up the stairs. It's also playing into the male fantasy of "I'm a loser, but I can somehow score an ultra hawt supermodel instead of a normal girl."

    Blame your own crotch for the pointless characters, not mine. :) 
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2011
  15. Lumpy

    Lumpy Taylor Swift Actionmaster Super Mod

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    i agree that the seekers should've been there... they could've reused the Starscream model a dozen times and it would've been sweet... but then people would be bitching because they didn't give Thundercracker, Skywarp, Dirge, etc enough character time...

    and the wreckers being earth vehicles makes sense, as all the autobots are shown to be ground based. the only Autobot who wasn't was Jetfire, and he was originally a Decepticon. makes perfect sense, and is just like g1 (up until season 2 at least)
     
  16. roy_flagg00

    roy_flagg00 I want more life....

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    I think we are both right.

    a simple scene exhibiting character traits like thundercraker being unmotivated, skywarp being stupid, ramjet crashing into something, etc. that would have been enough.
     
  17. Nachtsider

    Nachtsider Banned

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    A squadron of Seekers (or at least Skywarp and Thundercracker) would have been great. Also, the bolded portion is the main reason behind the Movie-verse's failings. Take note, everyone, and make sure we get people who are intimately familiar with TF lore to write subsequent TF films.

    A brilliant suggestion - one that I'm sure others besides us two had been hoping for with DOTM. But noooo.

    Another nice idea. Keep Prime noble and moral; relegate the bloodthirstiness to a more brutal and morally ambiguous Autobot. Grimlock would be my ideal choice.

    Capstone. The Wreckers will never truly be the Wreckers without the leadership of Springer.
     
  18. Megabattimus

    Megabattimus Reborn Comics Fan

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    You don't even need to do that. Hire Simon Furman, DJW, or someone who has worked on Transformers before as a creative consultant, it's what Marvel does with it's movies.
     
  19. Nachtsider

    Nachtsider Banned

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    Again, I'm shocked that nobody did this from day one.
     
  20. Megabattimus

    Megabattimus Reborn Comics Fan

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    I guess Hasbro didn't really give a shit, as long as the movie sold toys they were fine with it.
     

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