Discussion in 'Transformers 3rd Party Discussion' started by deathsheadII, Jul 29, 2011.
off their facebook
interesting, and i was considering mp-10 but now who knows
Interesting. I missed this one the first time around, and would like the chance to get it again.
Makes sense since he's the "anchor point" of their PP-line. I picked up a v2 PP01 on the secondary market at a good price, but this will be a great chance for folks who missed him to get a second crack!
Ok, I'm going to be really, really honest here: this is a terrible move.
Why? Because Takara (and probably Hasbro as well some bit later) is coming out with MP-10 soon.
This is no longer a 3rd party company filling in gaps with characters people want that Hasbro isn't making - this is direct competition. Direct competition using the competitor's own product.
This will hurt the sales of MP-10, although it's hard to say just how much without a retail price - maybe a little bit, maybe alot. I'm sure there are people out there who would go and buy MP-10 but might switch over to getting PP-01 because they like the proportions of the figure better, or because they like the price better.
Stupid, stupid move that might finally get Hasbro/Takara to shut off 3rd party businesses, OR damage the chances of future Masterpiece figures - a line that is already relying heavily on collectors to move from the store shelves.
Or maybe nothing will happen but at least I got to voice my concerns
PP01 is smaller than MP10.
PP01 is made to fit the PP series and to be in scale with one another.
I for one find this to be great news because I had no intentions of buying him until the announcement of a PP line.
I picked up a PP01 2nd Edition and really do like the figure quite a bit. He's overall solid and poses well and looks greatly (aesthetically I prefer him over MP-10 for that nostalgic G1 accuracy.... New Prime is a cool update and all but his aesthetics are way too stylized for me to fit in with any other figures aside from MP-09).
I'm not surprised iGear would reissue the guy. What does surprise me is the timing since MP-10 is set to be released very very soon too. Direct competition with each other looks to be inevitable.
That said, I think most folks overestimate HasTak's reach when it comes to these 3rd parties. The sky is not falling, and this will not be the end of 3rd parties, this much I'm certain of. Most of these companies are based in China where copyright laws are not enforced in any meaningful way, for better or worse. That's just the harsh reality.
Even if HasTak wanted to take action against them, what can they really do? Do people actually think China will help HasTak enforce court ordered penalties against them? I highly doubt this. So unless HasTak has a private army inside China or paid off some police there, 3rd parties aren't going to get shut down cop raid style.
The only realistic course of action HasTak can take is to put pressure on retailers like BBTS (they don't carry the more KO-ish stuff anyway) and TFSource (the main North American retailer for iGear) to not buy up stock in 3rd party products. And by pressure I mean HasTak refusing to do business with that retailer ever again if they don't get their way, hurting the retailer's bottom line. And money is the only real effective ammunition in this battle.
When folks say, "Ooooh, HasTak is going to drop the hammer on the third parties for sure this time!" I just roll my eyes because it's nothing but fear and rumors talking. HasTak may well take action with this latest news of PP01 getting reissued, but probably in the form of stepped up competition by fierce promotion of their own products. But I bet HasTak will simply refuse to acknowledge PP01 in any way and continue doing what they've been doing all along, business as usual.
As for iGear..... I really hope this means that they'll release a separate reissue of just the cartoon accurate Prime head for PP01. That I would definitely buy, but refuse to get a PP01U Ultra Magnus just for the head (since I don't care for the repaint or the character he represents).
You win the rational and logical thought award for the day. Can we clone you?
Could this be a lead in for UM Armor if they rerelease PP01U.
maybe if its a good price i will buy it. last time it was a bit to high
He's in stock, no need for a re-release:
â˜…PP01U Ultra Leader(In Stock!)
And they did say they were planning armor for him, no updates since the intial announcement though.
That's be one BIIIG Magnus, really not sure how I feel about him in that size class...
well i hope they do the nemi ver..cuz i really want that...
Thanks but sorry, iGear's already cloned me and shrunk down my copies by 25%. =)
Not sure how much cheaper the reissue will be but I'd say the accessories will most likely be limited to just the Matrix, his ion rifle, energon axe, and mini Megatron gun.
To keep the price down on this reissue, I'm guessing iGear will probably cut out the extra heads (Orion Pax - kinda neat but ultimately useless - and the Megatron cartoon accurate heads; a shame PP02 Horror Monarch is in limbo, so again, useless), the extra Classics/G1 ion rifle, and the cape and truck light attachments (to hang the cape on Prime).
But this is just pure speculation on my part.
Oh yes, of course. When another (small) company is going to compete with you with a variation of your own product, you're going to put more money into promotion of your own product to make it sell better than the competitor. Uhhh, no. Especially not for something like the Masterpiece series, which is not so popular/hot to the 'masses' anyway. It would be a waste of money.
Hasbro can do multiple things if they really want to. Keywords: if they want to. It's probably all about the money lost and effort it takes, so they probably will not undertake action until they start losing enough money.
You're right that they can't really force China to do something about their copyright laws. Hypothetically though, depending on just how much work Hasbro offers in China, they could threaten to move away from China and use factories in another country, which results in loss of jobs and money for China. I don't think this event justifies such a big threat, and Hasbro is already moving to factories in Vietnam, so it's not going to happen anyway.
But you personally described a very effective and believable way of dealing with this:
Shut down the channels of buying these 3rd party products. What do you think a store like BBTS makes more money from, the official Hasbro products (TF + other franchises), or the 3rd party stuff?
Keep rolling those eyes, it's a healthy excercise but 3rd party companies are going a step further every month, or so it seems. If this keeps continuing, one day they will be big enough on Hasbro's radar for them to take proper action. Might result in 3rd party products like these being banned in whatever way possible, or it might result in lines such as the Masterpieces being canned - if people keep picking things like PP01 up instead of MP-10. Why bother spending money on designing and producing the things 'fans want' when the fans are buying the unofficial product? Alternators got canned because not enough people were buying.
Like I said before, we don't know how much this will affect the sales of MP-10, and it's possible it will only influence it a little bit - but that doesn't mean iGear isn't pulling a stupid ballsy move here. This is an even bigger middlefinger they're giving Hasbro/Takara than they already were, just when it seemed they were doing some proper, cool stuff like that Kup head.
That's why I included the qualifier "probably". And reiterated in my post that HasTak will most likely just ignore PP01 and keep doing what they're doing, business as usual.
Answer your own questions much? There are other means of distribution aside from the major online retailers. Even TFSource was/is selling PP01 via eBay on the side as an alternative to their main Web site. HasTak can't control and regulate all of these avenues available to consumers.
HasTak has other (very profitable) franchises aside from Transformers, you do realize? Transformers is very big business to them, of course, but it's only part of their overall business plan.
As you said yourself, it'd be a waste of money, time, and resources for them to go after third parties even over something like PP01 getting reissued. So why persist in this chicken-little-sky-is-falling-3rd-parties-are-going-to-get-shut-down-if-they-keep-this-up line of thinking?
You keep saying "banned" and "taking action" but these are just vague (fear mongering) terms. They'll only get "banned" when retailers find third party products are no longer profitable to buy up stock or if they no longer sell (as in bought up by us, the fanboys and consumers). "Taking action".... aside from my example, what other action can HasTak possibly take?
Well, if the MP line gets canceled, we all know who'll be there right there to pick up HasTak's slack, now won't we? The circle of life is a beautiful thing, yes?
As for Alternators/Binaltech, I assumed other factors had a hand in that line's downfall.... like say, Animated and the first of the Transformers Movie line of toys? Perhaps HasTak diverted their resources to other lines within the TF franchise. I wouldn't necessarily blame 3rd parties for the demise of AT/BT.
That's right, you don't know. None of us do. So that's why I find all this anti-3rd-party-sky-is-falling rhetoric irritating and just plain unreasonable. As for iGear, why worry about their well-being so much? If they fail, let them fail; like any other company, they'd have only themselves to blame for not doing enough or the right things to make money.
But if they're successful (and I hope they are), kudos to them. But even the largest of iGear's successes is just a drop in the bucket for HasTak (hence why I think HasTak will just laugh at this news and press on like nothing's happened). If HasTak blinks an eye or makes a move, I'd be genuinely surprised.
I buy 3rd party products, (not ALL of them, of course) but if it were my company, I'd definitely put the pressure on the online retailers. Tell them to stop carrying 3rd party stuff or they won't get official stuff through the official channels. Simple as that. Then people will go back to getting 3rd party stuff through the 3rd parties directly.
Two reasons: One, it's obviously an infringement of intellectual property no matter how much they fluff it up. Sure, they change things enough where suing is useless, but cutting the retailers off is the easier solution. Two, is that the safety standards aren't the same. If an iGear Hercules breaks and a shard of it chokes a child, HASBRO is going to get the flak, even if it isn't their product. All the news is going to report is that a TRANSFORMER caused the death of a child...
Now, I say all this because I understand WHY they would try to cut them off if it were to ever happen. I don't want them to shut down because I love my plastic crack as much as the next guy...
Hm, Hasbro can't do much in China, but isn't Igear base is in Singapore? I purchase the H02 Head from Igear and it was shipped from Singapore.
Unless in the case of shoddy reporting (imagine that!) I'd imagine the news story would be more geared towards "cheap Chinese KO's" (which is funny because they're all Chinese made) rather than "Hasbro's toys aren't safe for our kids."
In addition to that, if the child is old enough for their parents to be buying them a TFC Hercules, and it's bashing it on the table and putting it in its mouth. Natural selection dispensed by Devastator!!!!
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