help the real villians

Discussion in 'Transformers General Discussion' started by ssjkazer, Jan 17, 2010.

  1. ssjkazer

    ssjkazer mr dyslexia

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    warrning spoilers for those who havent read the orgins of megatron

    well i just read how megatron became the leader of the decpetecons and how the where forced to do labour and then they rose up agianst the autobots pushing them off the planet to try and bring it back to its galory days where it was fully functional

    dosnt this make megatron the good guy?
     
  2. Prime Noble

    Prime Noble Well-Known Member

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    I assume you are talking about Megatron:Origin?

    Those miners weren't Decepticons. They were all Autobots, including Megatron. Megatron, Rumble and Frenzy would go on to become Decepticons later.

    But yes, the Senate could be seen as bad guys through their lack of regard for the miners. But like anyone in authority, it all comes to money. These kind of cutbacks for which the little guy is generally the victim are an unfortunate, sometimes necessary evil even in the real world.

    The Senator is definitely a bad guy. He's portrayed as not caring about the miners and orders the enforcers to beat the first protestor to death.

    It might be for the greater good but it was definitely not a good way to go about it.

    We can all sympthise with Megatron for wanting to kill the Senator but it's still wrong to kill for any reason.

    Megatron may have been a victim but what he goes on to do is evil. He starts a war that costs millions of lives. Whatever tragedies shaped him are still no excuse for starting a war.

    So really, there are bad guys on both sides whose actions went on to start the war. Certain Autobots are as guilty as Megatron.
     
  3. ryan.j

    ryan.j Well-Known Member

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    and more importantly, Megatron: Origin was wrote fairly recently to be an interesting and thought-provoking spin on megatron's autobot blastin' ways.

    originally he just wanted to rule cybertron without much more explanation one way or the other.
     
  4. Aernaroth

    Aernaroth <b><font color=blue>I voted for Super_Megatron and Veteran

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    Depends if you think a person turning into a dictator who begins a brutal, devastating, abominable campaign of violence because he didn't much like his job to be a bad guy.
     
  5. Feralstorm

    Feralstorm I ship Nick & Judy TFW2005 Supporter

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    There's a lot of brutal dictators in our own history who rose to power based on motives which can be considered noble. Most folks don't gain many supporters by just going "I wanna rule everything and everyone!", after all. :) 
     
  6. ectoneon

    ectoneon Well-Known Member

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    I like Megatron Origin because it shed kinda a different light on things. It shows not everyone starts off as evil. Its almost like the story of George Washington in a way. We Americans view him as hero through rose colored glasses. In reality, at the time he was sick of being oprressed by a legitimate government an helped in a rebellion. Probably killing many British soldiers who were just doing their jobs. Where Megatron Origin differs is that Megatron became Violent and bloodthirsty, and thanks to the arena fighters that formed his troops-all were of the same mind. He also became addicted to power and expansionism, leading to the character we all know and love. I did like that the initial spark of conflict was caused by the Autobots though. I also like the interesting juxtaposition of Ratbat and Soundwave in this tale.
     
  7. SMOG

    SMOG Vocab-champion ArgueTitan

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    I don't see why we shouldn't trust Senator Ratbat. He sounds like a good guy. :D 

    Exactly... whether someone is a tyrant, a bloodthirsty renegade, or a hero and a great leader, often just depends on which side is telling the story.

    There are different ways of looking at it also. Absolute power corrupts... so a leader with good intentions can become tainted.

    On the other hand, sometimes it takes someone who is a driven, violent, borderline psychotic to even rise to such a position. There's a reason one of the number one things you do once you stage a successful coup is get rid of all the revolutionaries... every tool has it's use, and after it's achieved it's purpose, you may not want to keep it around.

    This was touched on in All Hail Megatron as well... when Megatron reveals that his army of brutes, bullies, sociopaths and petty self-serving scum is only a means to an end for him... that such monsters were needed to win the war, but would afterwards be considered undesirable in his new order.

    zmog
     
  8. ectoneon

    ectoneon Well-Known Member

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    I forgot about that part. I'm going to have to go re-read this after viewing this thread. Another reversal in this comic I just remembered. It's funny how back then the Autobot senators erected huge statues of themselves as symbols of their power and wealth, yet later in other fiction-it's the Decepticons who build statues.
     
  9. ssjkazer

    ssjkazer mr dyslexia

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    cause this kinda rings ture for movie verus as well otimusprime just want to protect all life where megatron wants to bring his planet back to life no matter what the cost
     
  10. Sso02V

    Sso02V Injector Has a Posse

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    Are you mad at your keyboard?
     
  11. ssjkazer

    ssjkazer mr dyslexia

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    i have deslixeya and have real trouble spelling and typeing but on the up side it makes me brillent at graphical things
     
  12. ryan.j

    ryan.j Well-Known Member

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    vaguely related to this - i always felt the G1 megatron felt more like a small-time hood than a genocidal galactic warmonger.

    it was only in subsequent incarnations that whole Big Bad persona got fleshed out a bit more. i like the IDW incarnation because whilst megatron might have been overracting to his lack of job satisfaction just a little bit, he has an air of manace about him beyond getting his gang to beat you up before running off with your energon cubes.
     
  13. Nachtsider

    Nachtsider Banned

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    You either die a hero, or live long enough to see yourself become a villain.
     
  14. Coeloptera

    Coeloptera Big, bad beetle-bot

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    Keep in mind that Continuum really screwed up the implications as well.

    The distinction between a worker who lost his job and a slave is tremendous. That sort of thing would drastically change the motivation for any uprising.

    So, ignoring Continuum, because it is garbage, Megatron's initial uprising for better conditions and protections really isn't an ignoble pursuit at all. However, his methodology began degenerating pretty rapidly after he rose to control the arena fights.

    "He who fights monsters" and all that.

    So while he may have started as a revolutionary, there's little argument that he became a tyrant.

    - Coeloptera
     
  15. SMOG

    SMOG Vocab-champion ArgueTitan

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    I sort of saw him as the ultimate amoral industrialist, going to new places, raping their resources to feed his military complex, and trying to build his new world order.

    I think it was the anger aspect. His revolutionary aspirations were only ignited by his murderous temper... and as he progressed, he became more and more excited by violence for violence's sake. In fact, the way Origin portrayed it, the elevation of Megatron from criminal thug to figurehead, and the political advancement of the Decepticon agenda was almost totally orchestrated by Ratbat and Soundwave... which sort of makes Megatron more of a pawn or a puppet than anything... though a dangerous one that sort of got out of the control of his handlers.

    The more I think about it, when you look at Origin, he's mostly a revolutionary by happenstance. There's no ideology or philosophy behind his actions... so while his rebellion sets things in motion, it also explains why he ends up as a pit fighter. He doesn't really have an agenda. In the end, Megatron Origin, for all it's pretenses, still portrays Megatron as little more than a canny brute.

    zmog
     
  16. ryan.j

    ryan.j Well-Known Member

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    you just made g1 megs sound far more interesting than i'd previously given him credit for! i can see where you're coming from, but i'd never looked at him quite like that before.

    now i'm going to have to get the DVDs out again to see for myself - which is double annoying because i bought myself the rubbish Metrodome ones :F
     
  17. SMOG

    SMOG Vocab-champion ArgueTitan

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    I was really only commenting on the way that Megatron was depicted in Megatron:Origin, but now that you mention it, that is sort of interesting. Megatron starts out as an angry thug that others figured they could turn into a figurehead, and control... but soon found he was too powerful to be controlled. Gradually over millenia, I could see Megatron maturing into a more self-conscious leader and plotter of course.

    zmog
     

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