I'm not a fan of most of the reimagined alt modes of late but Scourge would be an exception. The robot mode may be a bit small but looks really nice and I may well get both the Takara and Hasbro versions if the color schemes are different enough.

 

Not really. Cyclonus is a funky space-jet that just happens to have backwards wings. He doesn't really look like any existing prototypes for anything from this Earth besides having wings that face forward.

And I feel I should correct you about Scourge's alt-mode. He's not based on an "unused space shuttle"... although there are concept shuttles that have similar shapes (the old GIJOE Conquest was based on that). Scourge is based on a flying wing, which is an actual type of aircraft. They've been building planes like that since WWII, but they are real planes... just because they haven't been mass-produced doesn't make them "sci-fi", any more than Autobot cars that blend elements of more than one car design to avoid legal obligations becomes "sci-fi".

I LIKE the vehicle mode, and there is something creepy and modern about it.

But to me, Cyclonus looks outer-space weird. Scourge is a far-out design, but it still looks like something humans built (even if it does look kind of far-out). But to put it another way, Cyclonus looks very close to his G1 self, while Scourge's vehicle mode is just the vaguest of homages. Wouldn't bug me that much, but I always found Scourge's shape rather unique, and he won't match with Cyclonus' bold G1ness.

zmog

 

So how many are you guys getting?

 

The only flying wing-style aircraft that I'm aware of that is currently in service is the B-2. Aside from being a flying wing, Scourge looks almost nothing like one. The cockpit seals it for me: if Scourge *is* anything, he's that space shuttle concept. He certainly doesn't represent a single real plane any more than Cyclonus does.

A flying wing is a general type of airplane design, yes, just like the forward-swept wings are. Now, for the very first time, both Cyclonus and Scourge are fictional spaceships that are inspired by real-world Earth planes. As opposed to Scourge being Seaspray with a beard.  

True enough. While I appreciate Cyclonus' faithfulness, Scourge's different approach doesn't bother me. I don't really nitpick altmode show-accuracy because the robot mode is far more important to me. In fact I like a little altmode creativity if they nail the robot. That's just how I display.

Not all CHUG Deluxes can be Cyclonus, who's probably in my top 5 figures ever. And I don't expect them to be. And you know, even then, Cyclonus' "space jet" (a contradiction in terms if ever there was one) just barely serves. It's noticeably inferior to the G1 version. We just don't care because Universe Cyclonus is ALL about the robot mode.

 

Northrop disagrees...
Northrop YB-49 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Northrop N-1M - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

That's ancient history, but if you want to see the REAL thing that Scourge is based on, it's probably this Boeing prototype:
Boeing X-48 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Except that this Scourge is a very direct quotation from existing or in-development Earth planes (not spaceships), while Cyclonus really doesn't look like anything from Earth, except that he has wings, which is a pretty vague criteria.

Actually I agree and disagree. G1 Cyclonus' "space jet" mode is actually GORGEOUS, while the Classics version looks sort of like a folded up robot. It doesn't compare. My issue is not with giving old characters new twists on their alt-modes... it's just unfortunate that this approach was handled differently for Cyclonus and Scourge. One was imitating (imperfectly) his G1 incarnation, while the other is consciously imitating an Earth-designed vehicle fairly closely. They're both pretty cool, but as a pair they don't go together as well now.

And "space-jet" is only a contradiction if you ignore the possibility of trans-atmospheric flight. A space-jet can be a jet-powered airplane with space capabilities... not necessarily something uses jets in space.  

Obviously jet engines and indeed, even WINGS are completely pointless in a spaceship... unless that spaceship wants to land on planets with an atmosphere, and be able to fly effectively in that environment. Which Obviously Cyclonus does.

zmog

 

I see your point. I still going to get this figure because I need a Scourge to go with Cyclonus and Galvatron. Even though the alt modes are different, but to me at least they capture the spark of the characters.

 

I said "currently in service" not "never in service," LOL.

Forgive me for not Googling every flying wing ever built...sure Scourge is pretty close to an X-48. However, he does lack the swept-up wing tips, not to mention adds a giant pew-pew head laser.

I didn't say they were exact equivalents, however Cyclonus is not dissimilar to a scaled-up forward-swept-winged fighter jet. Were more liberties taken? Probably. Old!Cyclonus and New!Scourge were designed in different decades after all. However, now they both bear some (differing) amount of resemblance to something that has actually flown. Their designs did not have this feature in common before. I believe that the designers' choice of a relatively obscure type of fixing-wing flight is an intentional reference to the fact that Cyclonus' jet mode is similarly obscure. So they both take inspiration from prototype aircraft to look like "spacy" planes.

I think this can be forgiven. See above. Moreover:

1) Their robot modes are actually similarly styled and both highly show-accurate.
2) Scourge HAD to change more than Cyclonus as he is a notorious shell-former and moreover it's hard to get a kid to purchase a blue iron.

Then that's a jet in space, not a "space jet," friend.  

 

Still an existing, current earth design, even if it's not finished yet. It's not an overt sci-fi machine like both of them were in their original incarnations.

I knew I'd seen Scourge's alt-mode somewhere before. It wasn't hard to find... a simple Google image search, or a visit to Wikipedia will find that stuff in about 5 seconds. Internet!

You're right about the wing tips. Hasbro brilliantly decided to use swept-down wing-tips instead... so NOW he looks TOTALLY different!  

Interesting, isn't it, how the iconic Scourge head laser almost mimics the exact placement of those jet pods on the back of the X48? Almost as if the designers chose that alt-mode for that very reason. The larger jet engines (his arms) are a bit more of a departure, though you see very similar engine humps in some of the old WWII german flying-wing planes, as well as on the B1.

End assessment... not a space shuttle.

Definitely. In the case of Cyclonus the only element of the design that is derived from the reverse-wing experimental fighters is, well... reversed wings. The rest of him feels like a pretty clear attempt at a "spaceship" rather than a slightly altered version of a real Earth design.

Maybe. But I suspect it was more in the vein of "we need a triangular-type earth vehicle for Scourge's alt mode" and they went with the X48, while with Cyclonus they were only imitating the G1 design, rather than trying pointedly to make him look like something from earth. In the end, the style of the two new versions don't really match stylistically.

Admittedly, Classics Galvatron doesn't match very well either. He's interesting because he's rather clearly based on a real military vehicle, but with a totally new turret stuck on top. So is it a "sci-fi" mode, or an "earth mode"?

I disagree. Hasbro is not afraid of shell-forming, especially when that could yield some pretty sweet G1-style evil wings. And a cool looking oldschool alt mode would still grab the kiddies... even if some of them still thought he was a boat (my first impression in 1986).  

I think the change to Scourge was more just due to the fact that with Generations, besides the WFC guys, they seem to be pointedly trying to give all the characters "real earth" type vehicle modes, even if they were originally "futuristic" designs... Blurr, Kup, Straxus, Perceptor, Wreck-Gar, etc... it'll be interesting to see if they continue that approach with the announced Arcee.

I think a space-capable jet could very easily be labeled a "space-jet". It's really not that big of a stretch, dude.  

zmog

 

So you think they should bring back the "Mega" price point?

 

At least 3. One for robot, one for vehicle and one to hang

 

What were "Megas"? Were the Armada Seekers the last time we saw those? Didn't "mega" just become "voyager"?

zmog

 

Mega was the $15 pricepoint. There is no modern equivalent. What we know as Voyagers now are closer in mass and complexity to what were Ultras prior to Armada.Essentially, the $15 level was dropped and $20 was renamed.

 

Bigger than a deluxe, smaller than a voyager. Guys like BW Inferno, BM Tankor, and the individual RiD Trains

 

Got it. I didn't pay much attention to stuff during the "Beast Era", so I never really gave the size of those figures much thought.

In any case, it's weird that Transformers now has that gap, but Crossovers is pretty much exclusively based around that intermediate size class.

zmog

 

My take here.

 

While Scourge isn't exactly the Lockdown of Generations, he's not THAT short. Not when you compare him to Rodimus or Galvatron. It's just that his hetero life mate Cyclonus has tall bunny ears and his wave mate Kup is pretty tall as well.

Scourge may be slightly below average, but he doesn't feel undersized like Galvatron does.

Here's a pic with Roddy, where he's noticeably taller and bulkier.

 

Hm. Cyclonus is a bit tall... Roddy a bit small. But Scourge doesn't look as tiny as he did in earlier pictures, so that's good news.

zmog

 

Mega Maid mode?

 

Or Mega Man mode! Who needs a targetmaster when you have the X-Buster?

 

Just random bad mistransformation. Although I kinda like Scourge's Rumble Piledrivers look.

Indeed!