Galloway was a better human antagonist than Gould

Discussion in 'Transformers Movie Discussion' started by QLRformer, Mar 18, 2012.

  1. QLRformer

    QLRformer Seeker

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2012
    Posts:
    15,090
    News Credits:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    302
    Likes:
    +1,886
    Both ROTF and DOTM had humans in a supporting role as antagonists to the Autobots: in ROTF there was the alien-hating bureaucrat Galloway, and in DOTM there was the Decepticon agent Dylan Gould. Though the two are different types, I found Galloway to be the better human antagonist.


    Galloway is a presidential advisor: an armchair strategist and a bureaucrat who is bigoted against aliens, especially when they’re at war and Earth is in the middle of it. With his dislike towards them and his influential government post, he presents a fairly realistic threat for any alien trying to settle down on Earth.

    For all Galloway’s obnoxiousness (which, I admit, came off as rather theatrical and shallow), Galloway is thinking of how to preserve Earth. He raises some relevant issues: the Transformer war is a blood feud, before it became a resistance against Decepticon invaders – the Autobots, in making the Earth a new home, have attracted the attention of their age-old Decepticon foes. In his POV Earth doesn’t have/need to be involved at all; if the Autobots left so would their foes, and Earth would be in peace. He also alternately considered giving the Decepticons Sam Witwicky, to get them to leave Earth or at least spare more innocents. He wants the right thing (saving Earth and getting rid of the Decepticons), but he’s doing it the wrong way.

    Obviously the Decepticons would raze Earth without the Autobots to defend it, but it does seem to be an interesting theme: Does Earth, by taking in Autobots, risk Transformer conflict taking place? Would the getting rid of the Autobots remove the Decepticons as well?


    Dylan Gould is a Decepticon agent, a reflection of Sam: his family deals with Soundwave, and in return for doing their bidding were supplied with tech that made them rich and successful. He ends up the last living Decepticon agent, as he is expected to be human slave leader. A smug self-satisfied businessman, he is in reality terrified for his own life, prepared to have others die/be enslaved to preserve his own hide.

    Despite how good he sounds, he doesn’t. He was nothing more than an evil version of Sam and Scud from BLADE 2: a traitor who moves the story along. If you think about it, no sane person would serve an army of mass-murdering aliens and expect to stay alive; in Dylan’s case he was inherited the job of agent and is being kept alive for further use, but that just makes him look pathetic and inept – which he is (I even made a previous thread about it). Such people don’t make great villains; especially considering his rival Sam nearly died twice from Megatron and managed to kill Starsceam, he is kind of a letdown.

    Also in consequence, I never really bought the idea that this guy is willing to let his own race suffer and face doom so that he’d stay alive, he lacked that vibe of edgy desperation; he seemed more like a frat boy running with a tough gang.


    In my verdict, Galloway makes for a better human antagonist than Gould. He was more realistic, more sensible a adversary and arguably a better threat for the Autobots.
     
  2. Autovolt 127

    Autovolt 127 Get In The Titan, Prime!

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2006
    Posts:
    82,270
    News Credits:
    16
    Trophy Points:
    412
    Likes:
    +690
    I agree.

    I always wanted Galloway to secretly be part of a Decepticon-Human Pact forged by Gould's family and with his involvement with screwing over the Autobots he will be promised to be the president of the United States.

    I know cliche but still.
     
  3. Overlord Balder

    Overlord Balder Voices Slugslinger!

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2011
    Posts:
    6,306
    Trophy Points:
    176
    Likes:
    +5
    Galloway was not an atagonist, he was an obstacle, but he meant no harm to the Autobots or Earth, he merely thought the United States Government could face the 'Cons on their own, he didn't mean harm to either. In short, Galloway was a jerkass moron. but a well-meaning jerkass moron.

    Have him again in DOTM, repeating the same old sthcik after ROTF proved he was wrong would be really pointless, in fact, it would be pretty hard for him to say that the 'Cons are just here because of the 'Bots again because they were here on the fifties, conspiring with the governments, long before the 'Bots were here. In other words, Galloway's sthick makes no sense in DOTM.

    He could try to go for the "America doesn't need the 'Bots" thing, but then we'd just have to remind him the Decepticons [More precisely, The Fallen] utterly curbstomped human military on Egypt and on Diego Garcia, his whole argument is a moot point after ROTF.

    Charlotte Mearing, on the other hand, was Galloway's concept only done better: She disliked the Autobot's involvement because she thought they caused too much collateral damage and were too wild to control, so she tried to keep them at bay as long as possible, but she was still helpful to them [Hell, she revealed the entire moon conspiracy] and wanted their help, only thougth they should be sancitioned by the US Government on a tigher grip, but still values their help.

    Long story short, the entire point of Galloway's character [an Obstructive government agent who believes the 'Bots should be gone] makes no sense after ROTF, he'd need to be clinically insane to still be using his ROTF-era logic on DOTM.

    As for Dylan..

    Correct, but no sane person would expect to refuse to serve an army of mass-murdering aliens and stay alive.

    He was going to be killed either way, he chose the route that would make him live longer.

    And to the 'Con's credit, they looked like they were going to keep their promise of leaving him alive.

    That's the point of his character, he's just one poor bastard thrown in the middle of a firestorm, he is not a scheming mastermind, he's just a run-of-the mill selfish man who is too afraid to die to think straigth, a good chunk of humanity fits under that description.

    This serves as a nice parallel to Sam, who even upon seeing all the chaos and destruction, remained attached to his morals and tried to do his best to save his species, while Dylan dropped his morals and betrayed his kind at the first sign of trouble.

    He lived his entire life under the rule of the Decepticons, it's to be expected he'd be calmer by now.

    However, he loses his shit entirely when the Battle of Chicago begins, that's what he truly is: A coward bastard trying to not to live, but to survive. So he goes entirely berserk when the Autobots start to win, fearing for his life [and not thinking clearly, such as the scene where he lectures Sam, little tip Dylan: Don't lecture the guy with a giant metal rod who also hates you].

    Dylan represents how pathetic humanity becomes when we drop our morality and ideals, Sam represents the opposite [i.e how great we become when he embrace our ideals], it's a nice nemesis relationship to me.

    In fact, that seems to be recurring theme on the third movie: Optimus explicetly mentions how Sentinel betrayed his own ideals, and that's why he's an evil one. Dylan did the same. It appears the movie's message is "Never forget your ideals".

    Also, WALL OF TEXT-GOODNESS.
    Now, I'll bet you only Tyler Mirage will even bother to read.
     
  4. Ephland

    Ephland Let's Go Rangers

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2008
    Posts:
    8,992
    News Credits:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    247
    Likes:
    +2,388
    Oh I disagree full stop... Gould was a better character in every way.
     
  5. Chopperface

    Chopperface Holtzmanned

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2009
    Posts:
    11,343
    News Credits:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    277
    Location:
    Holtzbert
    Likes:
    +1,543
    Tyler won't/wasn't the only one to read your wall of text awesomness.
     
  6. Honorbound

    Honorbound The Reclusive Semi-Lurker

    Joined:
    May 23, 2010
    Posts:
    2,049
    Trophy Points:
    222
    Likes:
    +317
    Huh. That's just how I was about to respond. Your whole post, as usual, is full of wisdom. I especially like how you pointed out the thematic difference between Sam and Dylan. The two are truly each others' foils.
     
  7. Maximo Prime

    Maximo Prime Bassist of Ill Repute

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2002
    Posts:
    5,173
    Trophy Points:
    287
    Likes:
    +16
    Ebay:
    I just wanted to say this is the first well thought out, mature thread I've seen in the movie forum in forever. well played, gentlemen.
     
  8. ARCTrooperAlpha

    ARCTrooperAlpha Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2011
    Posts:
    1,418
    Trophy Points:
    126
    Likes:
    +1
    Ebay:
    agree with Overlord, Galloway wasn't so much of an antagonist than another disgruntled third party player (Autobots and Nest on one side, Decepticons on the other).

    Sure, his position probably makes him a great threat compared to Dylan. But in all out analysis, Dylan's a better choice, cause his allies don't give about procedures and politicians. They are brutal, murderous, treacherous, drooling, robot animals, much to my utter displeasure. (shakes fist at Michael Bay)
     
  9. Optimus1138

    Optimus1138 Minecraft Addict

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2011
    Posts:
    3,503
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    151
    Likes:
    +7
    Ebay:
    Galloway wasn't an antagonist, he was just an @$$hole. I liked having him in the movie simply because he was fun to hate. I kind of wish he had an on-screen death.

    I thought Dylan was a good villain, and was done surprisingly well. I agree with Overlord Balder about him.
     
  10. Silk Spectre

    Silk Spectre The Evil Queen

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2010
    Posts:
    2,386
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Likes:
    +0
    Dylan and Galloway didn't really serve the same function. Galloway wasn't techincally a bad guy.

    But for me personally, Dylan didn't work. He was weakly developed and though I have nothing against Dempsey, he seemed like he didn't fit into the movie series at all. Just didn't buy into the character

    I found Galloway to be much more believable in the role he played.
     
  11. Jazzfan0217

    Jazzfan0217 Just chillin'

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2011
    Posts:
    2,109
    Trophy Points:
    202
    Location:
    Texas
    Likes:
    +155
    as much of an annoyance i think Galloway was at times, i never beleived him to be an antagonist against the Autobots. its just that the well being of Earth was his biggest and main priority and all he seemed to really care about, that's why he gave all the 'bots the cold shoulder. Gould?...ehh not much to say about him really, a low selfish coward what else is new. i didn't like him at all really. so all in all i think Galloway was better, actually i did find it a bit amusing how Galloway always seemed to find a way under the 'bots "skin" to a point where there might have been an even bigger arguement, perferibly between Galloway and Ironhide in the base when Galloway was first introduced. that would have been interesting to see.
     
  12. QLRformer

    QLRformer Seeker

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2012
    Posts:
    15,090
    News Credits:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    302
    Likes:
    +1,886
    “Have him again in DOTM, repeating the same old sthcik after ROTF proved he was wrong would be really pointless, in fact, it would be pretty hard for him to say that the 'Cons are just here because of the 'Bots again because they were here on the fifties, conspiring with the governments, long before the 'Bots were here.”
    Each film has its own continuity, which doesn’t overlap with each other:
    - the first film had Sector Seven with Project Iceman and the Allspark
    - the second film had the Seekers and Primes hiding out on Earth
    - the third film had a Decepticon spy ring (arranged by ROTF’s new arrival Soundwave in the 1960s)
    You have to take it with a grain of salt, I guess. But if Galloway appeared in DOTM, I would expect him to be more condoning of the Autobots, similar to what happened with Simmons. He’d probably have Mearing’s role: still pissed with the Autobots causing collateral damage, but more accepting of them and their role. But at least Simmons got a love interest.


    I think my main beef with Gould is that he isn’t that well developed/executed to be convincing:

    - he needed some solo scenes with the Decepticons, scenes where he is toyed with (Soundwave sics Laserbeak on him, just for fun) or threatened (they hear from him the Autobots are alive, they want to kill him for his “failure” since it was on HIS word that the Xanthium was destroyed, but decide to deal with the Autobots first). He needed to be seen as seriously in fear of his own life, that whatever happens he is indeed disposable and will be treated as such if anything goes wrong.

    - like I earlier said, I never got the desperate vibe from Dylan. I needed a scene where he is uncaring to sacrificing his own race to achieve victory. I don’t mean the Chicago massacre but something more intense: he spots a group of civilians, and orders the Decepticons to use them as hostages to draw out the Autobots. Instead, they showcase him with ordering Autobot prisoners to be executed (which the Decepticons were going to do anyway, and would have done on the spot without even rounding them up).

    Galloway doesn’t have that kind of issue; he made his position and stance clear enough, and anyway he’s a supporting role. Gould, as a Decepticon agent, demanded more meat to his considerably larger role.
     
  13. TylerMirage

    TylerMirage I vawnt my berdt.

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2009
    Posts:
    7,355
    News Credits:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    176
    Likes:
    +14
    :lol  Oh, nonsense, Balder. A lot of people will probably read this. And with good reason. :D 

    And I think Silk Spectre summed it up perfectly in her first sentence: "Dylan and Galloway didn't really serve the same function". They were two different characters mean to do two different things. One was an antagonist, a rich, well-off businessman working with the Decepticons. The other was just an @$$hole, a government bureaucrat who didn't really trust the Autobots.
     
  14. SoundwaveFanboy

    SoundwaveFanboy Decepticon

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2012
    Posts:
    339
    Trophy Points:
    76
    Likes:
    +2
    Gould was a better human antagonist than Galloway.
     
  15. RedWolf

    RedWolf Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2004
    Posts:
    2,791
    Trophy Points:
    237
    Likes:
    +117
    There is a difference between the two. Galloway is a scared and arrogant official loyal to his country.

    Dylan is scared and arrogant agent willing to sell his own world. Part of it is that he has Stockholm Syndrome being associated with Soundwave since childhood.

    He and Soundwave are evil counterparts to Sam and BB.
     
  16. Autovolt 127

    Autovolt 127 Get In The Titan, Prime!

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2006
    Posts:
    82,270
    News Credits:
    16
    Trophy Points:
    412
    Likes:
    +690
    Man I look back at my old posts. :lol 

    but still Galloway as evil president of America please.
     
  17. Crainy

    Crainy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2011
    Posts:
    1,041
    Trophy Points:
    136
    Likes:
    +0
    I applaud you.
     
  18. bumblebee22

    bumblebee22 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2011
    Posts:
    740
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    127
    Likes:
    +77
    What if Galloway was actually workin for soundwave to get the autobots to leave earth thus making it easier for the deceptions to find the matrix and allow megatron to proceed with his plan from DOTM
     
  19. Gingerchris

    Gingerchris Telly-headed Tyrant

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2005
    Posts:
    14,917
    News Credits:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    287
    Likes:
    +223
    They did what they needed to for the story. I'd kinda like a new outspoken human against Transformers in TF4, maybe a journalist or some other ranting public div trying to scare the population for the sake of their own public career. And then that person gets caught up in the TF war and has to deal with all the shit they spouted and troubles they caused.

    It's nothing original, sure, but with the Autobots possibly being in hiding a raging pundit publically banging on about the Chicago event and against Transformers in general would perhaps fit the story. Plus it would also be interesting commentary on real public assholes that rage against subjects they know bugger-all about or personal experience of and have no authority to try and influence others on.
     
  20. Muramasa

    Muramasa Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2012
    Posts:
    657
    Trophy Points:
    101
    Likes:
    +1
    I agree on everything that was said basically. Galloway may have been an a-hole but he had humanity's interests at heart. Had Dylan been arrested, he wouldn't last too long in prison.
     

Share This Page