G1 Mirage question for the G1 connoisseurs

Discussion in 'Transformers Toy Discussion' started by FreshDebesh, Jul 5, 2009.

  1. FreshDebesh

    FreshDebesh <b><font color=brickred>oye chak de phatte!</font> Veteran

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    So recently, I got a boxed 1984 pre rub symbol G1 Mirage which is near mint. I've never seen a Mirage with joints this tight. Anyways, I already have a loose G1 Mirage from a few years ago and I put them side by side and noticed my older loose Mirage has a deeper blue whereas the recent boxed pre rub Mirage has a bit of an almost turquoise-ish tint to it. Is this due to sun damage over the years or did the earlier '84 Mirage figures have a more turquoise like color to the blue? Any help would be appreciated!
     
  2. GAUGE

    GAUGE In Art, Nothing Is Impossible.

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    Are you sure your old Mirage is the Real Deal? heh just asking :D 

    There are tons and tons of fakes floating around that are being passed of as the real thing these days?

    Also if you have actual photos that could help me answer your questions better.

    The Real Mirage is Turquoise or rather more Teal looking (click link below) and if it's got really tight joints good for you but it still could be possible it's the KO the was rumored to be issued.

    http://www.tf-1.com/articles/pretf/joustralig_template.html
     
  3. FreshDebesh

    FreshDebesh <b><font color=brickred>oye chak de phatte!</font> Veteran

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    Thanks for the quick reply! Didn't know anyone was up right now :D  The new Mirage that I got is the real deal from what I can tell. The box says "Ages: 5 & Up" whereas the KO box uses a period instead of a colon. Also, the tires on my Mirage say GoodYear, whereas the KO tires say Dunlop, I believe. I would describe it as more of a teal than a turquoise, now that you mention it. I'll see if I can take some pics tomorrow and post em.
     
  4. mrclean08

    mrclean08 G1 FOR LIFE

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    I'm also interested in the outcomes of your findings on this one.
     
  5. megamus

    megamus Overworked and Underpaid Veteran

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  6. mweeuser

    mweeuser Well-Known Member

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    I recently a second g1 thundercracker and ultra magnus to compare to my existing collection and I can say there is a consistent turquoise nature due to the sun damage yellowing that occurs. It's just tougher with the blue to know if it's a variant cause it looks, by itself, like a decent color.
     
  7. Lunar Archivist

    Lunar Archivist Well-Known Member

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    I've had this same problem myself, actually. While I can't give you a straight answer, I believe this picture illustrates your problem:

    [​IMG]

    The Mirage on the left is a pre-rubsign I recently purchased and the one on the right is a rubsign one. The middle one I cobbled together from parts, but, as far as I know, had his blue parts taken from a pre-rubsign version.

    The greening of the blue and yellowing of the white plastic - both of which are actually thoroughly masked by flash photography - seem to be defects that almost every pre-rubsign Mirage I've ever handled have had. Moreover, the color change is thorough and usually spreads to all almost parts of the plastic, even those not exposed to direct sunlight (such as the inside).

    While it's not definitive proof, if you have a screwdriver, I suggest you carefully remove one of the screws holding the rear-mounted engine halves down and lift it up. Since the engine pieces "protect" the blue plastic beneath it from any and all exposure to sunlight, you may notice a color difference between the exposed and non-exposed sections. Given my aforementioned statement about the greening "spreading" across the blue plastic, though, this isn't guaranteed.

    UPDATE: I made a small mistake with the above description. The Mirage suffering from greening on the left is also a rubsign version and not a pre-rubsign version. Sorry about the error. :(  Even so, comparing its color with the other rubsign one on the far right shows you that something is definitely wrong...
     
  8. FreshDebesh

    FreshDebesh <b><font color=brickred>oye chak de phatte!</font> Veteran

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    That is exactly what I was trying to say in my original post. My prerub Mirage looks like that greenish one on the left. I took some pics but my camera made it seem more blue than green. So is this something that seems to happen to most prerub Mirage figures? Here are some comparison pics that I just took:

    Prerub Mirage:
    [​IMG]

    Prerub Mirage on left, loose rubsign Mirage on right:
    [​IMG]

    Same as before, prerub on left, loose rubsign on right:
    [​IMG]

    I might have to do what you said and inspect the plastic underneath the engines. I need to get a better Philips set since I want to be fairly gentle with it. I've already had a previous mirage snap at the waist before while transforming it. Thanks for the input guys. Keep it coming! Also, is there anything that can be done to get back to the original color or is it forever destined to be Mirage's turquoise twin?
     
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2009
  9. Lunar Archivist

    Lunar Archivist Well-Known Member

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    As noted in the correction to my previous post, I think it might be a problem with Mirage in general. Just like with G1 Jetfire, whether he'll end up yellowing or not appears to be completely random. The middle Mirage, which I cobbled together from two Mirages, is more or less normal blue in color. However, the original white hood he came with was a light urine yellow when I got it. By contrast, the left Mirage with the seriously greened blue plastic has a hood that, while not bone white, is only very slightly off white.

    I share your pain. That happened to one of mine while I was applying stickers to him. :( 

    Well, aside from painting him the shade of blue you want (which would be dumb) or trying to use very fine sandpaper to shave off the greened layer (an even stupider idea), your best bet would be to immerse the affected parts in hydrogen peroxide solution (with or without and "Oxi" laundry whitener added) and leave it in strong, direct sunlight for several days. While this treatment has gotten rave reviews on this board and elsewhere, in this case, I strongly recommend against it for two reasons:

    1. There's a chance that this process might damage the minty stickers or paint on your Mirage. While others have reported no problems with it, I can personally attest to the fact that prolonged immersion in the liquid resulted in, for example, the black "26 Elf" on Mirage's hood to smear to the point where a few strokes of my finger was enough to rub the ink clean off it. It also caused the ink on the stickers for Ultra Magnus to literally lift off the surface and dissolve, leaving a clear, clean silver sticker. Also, after leaving it in the liquid for a while, I noticed a milky white substance on my fingers while handling the pieces and realized to my horror that the "26 Citanes" along his arms and legs was starting to dissolve so I immediately stopped the treatment. The damage was minimal and barely noticeable, but you can be damn sure I won't risk that again. On the other hand, the paint on Mirage's face and eyes was completely unaffected even thought it spent the same amount of time immersed in solution.

    2. There's a chance that this process might permanently damage the blue plastic. I once experimented on a Scourge which had suffered so much sun damage that his dark blue plastic was practically copper green and the light blue plastic was urine yellow. After a week, the green plastic had been bleached to this hideous pale blue shade and looked extremely brittle and the yellow parts, while closer to the original baby blue shade, didn't look that great either. I think that this restoration technique has a "point of no return" beyond which trying to reverse the yellowing does more harm that good. Also, the results are invariably better when you treat plastics that were originally light-colored (white, yellow, gray) rather than dark-colored (dark blue or purple).

    If you want to read up on a streamlined version of the technique and the associated risks, here you go:

    Retr0Bright - home

    Of course, it's entirely possible (though unlikely) that this shade of blue is simply a variant color for Mirage and any treatment you give it will therefore prove ineffective. I suggest doing the "engine removal test" to see, even if the results are inconclusive.

    Honestly, though, the safest choice for you would be to invest in a new Mirage if his color bothers you that much. Otherwise, just enjoy him. :) 
     
  10. FreshDebesh

    FreshDebesh <b><font color=brickred>oye chak de phatte!</font> Veteran

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    Wow, that treatment sounds like it can create even more problems. The thing is the blue green Mirage is so nice and tight and the stickers are awesome on it. I got the engine cover off and the blue underneath is the exact same blue as the rest of Mirage. Maybe we really do have some early 84 variant blue Mirages?


    I think I'm just gonna invest in another Mirage. I was wondering if this is a variant shade of blue for the prerub Mirage but I couldn't find anything about it. Thanks for all the help dude!
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2009
  11. Lunar Archivist

    Lunar Archivist Well-Known Member

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    Sorry, didn't mean to scare you there. To be honest, what I was describing was the worst case scenario. Plus, my life is ruled by Murphy's Law so your results may vary. This technique is not nearly as disasterous as I've made it sound, but I figured you'd better know the risks before you accidentally destroy your Mirage.

    As mentioned earlier, I messed up: my turquoise Mirage is actually a rubsign one, but with the same "defect" as yours. It could just be a variant, like you said. Hell, my other rubsign Mirage has no eyes (the yellow color is missing) and I thought it was a knockoff until some people on this board figured out it wasn't. :) 

    No problem. Glad to be of service. :) 
     
  12. LigerPrime

    LigerPrime Well-Known Member

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    I believe my G1 Mirage is also er, fading and mine is confirmed an original because I bought mine a few years back before the KO came out. Is it due to aging that the colour fades?
     
  13. FreshDebesh

    FreshDebesh <b><font color=brickred>oye chak de phatte!</font> Veteran

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    Yeah, as Lunar Activist and I were thinking, it might be that some Mirages are predisposed to the color change over so many years. Or maybe they are variants.
     
  14. LigerPrime

    LigerPrime Well-Known Member

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    I think if the joints are tight then its a minor problem. Mine are moderately tight - darn, I just wish Hasbro or TakaraTomy will just reissue all the 1984/1985 Autobots and Decepticons. I need a new Wheeljack!
     
  15. shadowfall1976

    shadowfall1976 The Alpha and the Optimus

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    Shedding a little light on a dead topic..perhaps

    I know this topic has been gone over a year, but my original Mirage is also
    greenish, but very brittle, a few pieces of him have snapped off, making him
    somewhat worthless, but it is what I am guessing an age and old formula plastic factor.

    On a similar note..hardly ever exposed to sun, parts of my Super Nintendo slowly yellowed
    over the years. The older ABS plastics had a hard time holding their
    colors without yellowing and growing more brittle I am guessing they corrected
    this slightly because of all the Mirages and others who have after 25 years or
    so have never greened, but some whites still yellow...Magnus, Wheeljack, Ratchet.

    As far as I know every G1 TF was made from this flawed plastic, which is why almost all
    of the ones that were played with broke...Prowl, Mirage, Megatron, but of course with
    time comes perfecting things, and now almost all TF's reissues included benefit from the
    improved formula of modern ABS. All TF's are still made from this but hardly break.
     
  16. Lunar Archivist

    Lunar Archivist Well-Known Member

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    One of my seller friends gave me a couple of Mirage junkers to play with. The worst of them slowly crumbled to dust in my hands. It's like trying to play with a cracker. :crazy: 

    Ratchet and Ultra Magnus are worse than Wheeljack. To be more specific, the rubber-tired Ultra Magnuses are the real problem. The plastic wheel ones suffer from yellowing less often.

    Honestly, it's all pretty much a gigantic crapshoot, as the following article demonstrates:

    Vintage Computing and Gaming | Archive ยป Why Super Nintendos Lose Their Color: Plastic Discoloration in Classic Machines
     

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