Die like your Brother!

Discussion in 'Transformers Movie Discussion' started by RedWolf, Oct 20, 2010.

  1. RedWolf

    RedWolf Well-Known Member

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    "Die like your Brother!" "They were your brothers too!"

    Ok as we know the Fallen did not kill his fellow Primes of his generation. The Fallen seems to be afraid of descendant Primes like Optimus.

    The Fallen said brother not brothers. I'm going out the limb here but I theorize Optimus is not the first later generation Prime the Fallen fought. It was this fight that the Fallen realized the threat of Primes.

    There is one other Prime named in ROTF, Sentinel Prime of an expedition in Sam's rant.

    Jetfire certainly has fought Autobots before but does not seem to be aware of Optimus Prime. Lets say Jetfire did not participate in the civil war on Cyubertron but was part of a war in space.

    The Nemesis seems to have crashed on a moon. How did it get to that state?

    What if Autobots under a Sentinel Prime under the cover of an expedition fought the Fallen's Decepticons. Course Sentinel Prime died but it made the Fallen realize his own mortality when battling a younger Prime.
     
  2. cuad

    cuad VOK EMISSARY

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    So why wouldn't Optimus Prime "He was your brother too" instead of "they were your brothers too" if the fallen really said "die like your brother" instead of "die like your brothers"?
     
  3. Chopperface

    Chopperface Holtzmanned

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    1. Well, in one version, The Fallen does kill his brothers, but it's a continuity mess. The Fallen and the other Primes probably knew only they could kill each other, and that's why he ordered Megatron to kill Prime in ROTF, to keep him safe when he conquers the universe. And he actually did say, "Brothers", I believe. I'm pretty sure he did. While saying "brothers", the 'S' might've been cut off a bit by JetPrime shooting him against a wall.

    2. Considering Bay's lack of concern for little things returning like Barricade or Jolt, not gonna count on Sentinel Prime playing a role anywhere else.

    3. The Nemesis simply crashed, but no one knows why or how. In Defiance, it was still adrift in space, with only The Fallen on board. It would've crashed sooner or later with Soundwave and the ship's crew abandoning it for whatever reason.

    4. As far as I can tell, Jetfire did not fight against Autobots in the Great War; he went into stasis at the time of the battle between the Primes, and awoke in 18th century America. Currently, Jetfire's time awake in the 1800's is being covered by TF3 comic Sector 7, so stay tuned. I bet you in that time, he learned of the Autobot-Decepticon war.

    5. Could've happened. But Sentinel Prime most likely was among the brothers who died and became the Tomb of the Primes, with The Fallen himself claiming, "The Last Prime is dead..." Debatable if Sentinel Prime is still alive out there, but not likely.
     
  4. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP Dry built

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    The Fallen did say brothers, not brother.
     
  5. RedWolf

    RedWolf Well-Known Member

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    Actually in ROTF Jetfire said his ancestors have been around Earth for thousands of years looking for the Matrix.

    Jetfire wasn't part of the Great Battle 19,000 years ago. He also said to Mixmaster before decapitating him "I'll show you how we bring pain in my day". Jetfire likely predates the Great War on Cybertron as to not knowing Optimus but has been fighting a lot longer.

    Listen to what the Fallen said "Brother" without an 'S'.
     
  6. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP Dry built

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    I did, and I'm certain he said brothers, as in the past Primes. (they were brothers in a sybolic sense)
     
  7. Jolt Customs

    Jolt Customs Seacon

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    WAIT WAIT WAIT! sorry, but i have seen ROTF many times and i heard nothing about the nemesis.

    ANYWAY back on topic. Optimus called Megatron his brother after he killed him at the end of TF 1, so i don't think he means it as a literal brother.
     
  8. Chopperface

    Chopperface Holtzmanned

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    No, he really wasn't in the big battle between the Primes. Tales of the Fallen says he was teleported away and fought the Constructicons elsewhere on Earth before the battle began. He does indeed predate the Great War, but his line towards Mixmaster was probably just trash talk to a new generation that didn't "respect their elders".

    Yep. But like I said, guess the fact only moments later he got a bullet to the face didn't really help clear up what he said. But he definetly said, "brothers".

    And Jolt Customs, the Nemesis is never named in-film, but was confirmed by various tie ins, like toys, comics, etc.
     
  9. iwasherenotyou

    iwasherenotyou Medical Officer

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    I've got the movie on DVD and when I watch it I always use subtitles. The subtitles said brothers IIRC. Use subtitles more.
     
  10. TFtoycollector

    TFtoycollector I'm British i am

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    This is just like the forest battle scene, when prime says to megatron, junkyard crap. some people seem to think that he says scrap. i've watched ROTF so many times and sometimes i watch it on my laptop with headphones on. you can hear every thing and he does say junkyard crap.
     
  11. TranstechCat

    TranstechCat Cybernetic Chimpanzee

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    "Die like your brothers..."

    You're right. He killed many of the descendant Primes. He would've killed Optimus too if he hadn't been hidden away.

    I think it was more that the Fallen knew (or believed) that "Primes" are stronger than "normal" Transformers and thus the only ones that came close to "his level" in terms of power.

    In fact, true Primes like him aren't even "Transformers" at all. They're some other, older breed created by the AllSpark before the Transformers and posses powers and abilities that the Transformers don't.

    It's never really been established how the Dynasty of Primes originated. All that's known is that at some point they gained the same Transformational abilities that the Transformers have, and they were all (except for baby Optimus) slaughtered by the Fallen at some point.

    He wasn't aware of Optimus (and was surprised to learn of a living Prime) because as far as he knew The Fallen murdered all the Primes and their descendants.

    Also, he fought Constructicon drones during the first war between The Fallen's Decepticons and the Primes, but he went dormant long before the current Autobot/Decepticon war.

    That's a good question. One that I hope they answer sometime... Could be an interesting story.

    Unlikely, but not impossible.
     
  12. Poho

    Poho That's MISTER Poho to you

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    This makes no sense. Like many things in ROTF, actually. I think we're all reading way too far into this stuff.
     
  13. TranstechCat

    TranstechCat Cybernetic Chimpanzee

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    This... *nods*
     
  14. stepsongrapes

    stepsongrapes Well-Known Member

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    Honestly, your own quote makes it clear that the Fallen said "brothers". Why would Prime reply with "they" if the Fallen said "brother"?

    You're making a mountain out of a molehill. The movie showed primes dying to hide the matrix. Clearly, the conversation refers to what was shown. Why start reading in unreferenced stuff to make up a theory based on a mis-hearing a single "s" when the word "they" is so unmistakable?

    Apply Occam's Razor- avoid crazy theories when the straightforward one is right in front of you.
     
  15. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP Dry built

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    Prolly 'cuz he does. You can clearly hear the drawn-out "S" sound. Plus it makes more sense. The closest movie Prime's ever gotten to imitating human speech mannerisms was when he said "my bad" which was directed at Sam and was an attempt at seeming more sincere to him since he just crushed his fountain. Fighting Megatron he's not trying to sound like a human to talk to a human, but trash-talking another robot.

    Exemplary explanation, my good sir.
     
  16. UltraMagnus2008

    UltraMagnus2008 Autobot

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    ok so watched it with captions, he says "brothers" the end, trying to make sense of these movies or canonize it is like herding cats
     
  17. Sso02V

    Sso02V Injector Has a Posse

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    Actually, I think it's more like paying attention to a movie.
     
  18. Digilaut

    Digilaut My name is Drift.

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    I like how we've officially run out of material from the movie to discuss, so people start making up random shit from simple, self-explanatory lines.
     
  19. UltraMagnus2008

    UltraMagnus2008 Autobot

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    brings up my personal gripe why would skidsflap refer to leo as a chia pet? chia pets have green grassy hair and are cute little animals...what did he really mean by this?
     
  20. Wollstone

    Wollstone Banned

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    It was a derogatory reference to his curly hair.

    Chia pet is a common insult for people with curly hair.
     

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