Did I just buy a knock off Reflector?

Discussion in 'Transformers Toy Discussion' started by 2punish&enslave, Sep 12, 2012.

  1. 2punish&enslave

    2punish&enslave Starscream's Brigade

    Joined:
    May 27, 2010
    Posts:
    1,386
    Trophy Points:
    126
    Likes:
    +2
    Ebay:
    Ok so I just bought a Reflector last night after being assured that it was an original. After reading the highendtfs site (Comprehensive G1 Counterfeit / "Knockoff" ID Guide | HIGHENDTFS.COM - G1 Counterfeit ID Guides) though I'm thinking that I've bought a knock off. Here is the original listing.
    Transformers Vintage G1 Decepticon Reflector Excellent Complete | eBay
    I only see three sides on the plastic tree instead of four and I'm not seeing any factory applied stickers. Do you concur? If it is a fake I don't think the seller realizes it. He's got good feedback.
     
  2. lazerface

    lazerface Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2011
    Posts:
    1,595
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    172
    Likes:
    +149
    The package looks like legit ones I have seen. I'm not sure about the toys though.

    I wish Reflector wasn't bootlegged so much, otherwise I would have bought one already.
     
  3. deltagod

    deltagod Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2012
    Posts:
    1,437
    News Credits:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    142
    Likes:
    +24
    Go through this and let us know:
    eBay Guides - KO Transformers Reflector Vs the Original PART 1
     
  4. 2punish&enslave

    2punish&enslave Starscream's Brigade

    Joined:
    May 27, 2010
    Posts:
    1,386
    Trophy Points:
    126
    Likes:
    +2
    Ebay:
    I've been reading through that guide actually. The missile tree definitely looks like a fake to me. I'm having a hard time telling on the rest though. I'm not seeing the circles with dots or stars in them. The pictures are a bit grainy. That's why I asked for help.
     
  5. deltagod

    deltagod Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2012
    Posts:
    1,437
    News Credits:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    142
    Likes:
    +24
    Can you take a picture of the missile tree and a close up of your tray where the dots/circles/stars would be?
     
  6. 2punish&enslave

    2punish&enslave Starscream's Brigade

    Joined:
    May 27, 2010
    Posts:
    1,386
    Trophy Points:
    126
    Likes:
    +2
    Ebay:
    I don't have it yet. I just bought it yesterday so it is in transit. The only pictures that I have are the ones from the auction listing.
     
  7. whoamidri

    whoamidri Mumbling Madman

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2009
    Posts:
    1,212
    Trophy Points:
    137
    Likes:
    +1
    Good sir,
    I believe you have been taken. The instruction booklet appears to be a knock off, if you compare the grid lines. Also, I believe Reflector had factory applied stickers on Spyglass's shoulders and the missles appear to be tapered. I would take action, just my opinion though

    If I remember what I read a while ago correctly, the snapshot button won't make a click on the ko
     
  8. 2punish&enslave

    2punish&enslave Starscream's Brigade

    Joined:
    May 27, 2010
    Posts:
    1,386
    Trophy Points:
    126
    Likes:
    +2
    Ebay:
    Sigh. Should have did my homework beforehand.
     
  9. beanman

    beanman Not a Decepticon

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2010
    Posts:
    643
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    112
    Likes:
    +5
    I was looking for a reflector a few months back and had to sift through the majority of KO figures. I have a feeling the one you bought is KO, unfortunately. It's tough to be definitive from the pictures though.
     
  10. [Wing_Saber-X]

    [Wing_Saber-X] Fortress Maximus!

    Joined:
    May 24, 2004
    Posts:
    19,704
    News Credits:
    16
    Trophy Points:
    337
    Likes:
    +1,902
    Ah well don't beat yourself up on it. Ask for a refund and open a case thru Paypal. That's what I would immediately do if I discovered that my goods purchased were KO's/
     
  11. Composite Ghost

    Composite Ghost Motorized Transformer

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2011
    Posts:
    2,709
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    172
    Likes:
    +22
    The rub sign in the bag looks like a giveaway that it's a KO. If I recall correctly, all vintage G1 figures had the rub signs factory applied.

    And the condition of the box and foam insert is just a little too nice to be around 25 years old.

    It's possible the seller wasn't aware it's a KO but that doesn't change the fact that you deserve your money back. These Reflector KO's are nice, but definitely not $200 nice. Since it doesn't meet the item description, Paypal and Ebay will take care of you.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2012
  12. alldarker

    alldarker M.A.S.K. Crusader

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2008
    Posts:
    2,203
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    202
    Likes:
    +211
    Posted this as a reply to your question in the G1 Appreciation thread; this thread is however much more suited to my answer (although it repeats several aspects also pointed out by others in this thread).

    I recently bought a mint genuine Reflector as well, from a member right here on TFW. As was agreed to by both me and the seller, he did come in a newly made tray designed for the knock off Reflector. To be sure of what I was getting, this 4-part eBay Guide was extremely useful, as was HighendTF's.com. Mine hit all the right marks for the genuine real G1 deal (not even a Microx version).

    This one, however... First of all the photo's in the item description are vague. As far as I can tell, the missiles on the KO are slimmer; the ones in the photo's look to be original width. Also, the box in the photo has yellowed tape: a KO box would look a bit newer.

    Now for the bad news. Some other details definitely look fake. First of all, while the box seems real, the foam insert looks too new and too crude (large styrofoam pellets). Secondly, there are no factory applied labels visible (REFLE-CTOR, or even MIC-ROX). Harder to be sure, but it looks like the plastic mix in arms on Viewfinder is swirly: also a give away for a KO, considering the arms on an original Viewfinder are uniformly gray.

    The labelsheet included in the bag looks like a KO sheet: it is too wide: wider than an original labelsheet. And it looks like there's a tell-tale extra label sheet under the first one, with the factory applied labels. Also, there's most definitely a loose rubsign floating in that bag!

    And going back to the missile tree: it seems the injection points are way off, compared to the real deal as shown here.

    All these pointers are based only on the vague photo's in the item description; however, my assessment of this item is that is is, unfortunately, most probably a KO. No guarantees of course: as Alucard77 already mentioned, you can only be sure once you have this item in hand, and check it out yourself!
     
  13. Grimlocka go-go

    Grimlocka go-go Back from the Dead TFW2005 Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2007
    Posts:
    2,833
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    232
    Likes:
    +5
    Ebay:
    Looked through the sellers feedback and he's sold over half a dozen, "mint" reflectors, so that rings bells right off the bat. Yeah with the stickers, styro and all i'd agree with the asumtion that you bought a ko unfortunatly
     
  14. Composite Ghost

    Composite Ghost Motorized Transformer

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2011
    Posts:
    2,709
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    172
    Likes:
    +22
    I take back what I said about the seller maybe not knowing it was a KO. It's hard enough finding just one mint vintage Reflector with unapplied stickers and missiles still on sprue. Nobody is going to score a stash of a half dozen.

    I've seen some vintage cases pop up on eBay but those were most likely warehouse finds from distributors or retailers. Reflector never made it to those places.
     
  15. 2punish&enslave

    2punish&enslave Starscream's Brigade

    Joined:
    May 27, 2010
    Posts:
    1,386
    Trophy Points:
    126
    Likes:
    +2
    Ebay:
    I wrote to the eBay seller that wrote the guide and he said it is definitely a knock off. Once it arrives I'm going to leave it sealed and send it back. The seller has agreed to refund my money.
     
  16. [Wing_Saber-X]

    [Wing_Saber-X] Fortress Maximus!

    Joined:
    May 24, 2004
    Posts:
    19,704
    News Credits:
    16
    Trophy Points:
    337
    Likes:
    +1,902
    Excellent! great to hear that it's resolved. :) 
     
  17. opt1musaber

    opt1musaber Victory Saber's Recruit

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2010
    Posts:
    7,053
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    202
    Likes:
    +34
    Figures like this, Dinobots, Devastator, Menasor etc are all no goes, unless they're sold by legitimate sellers who I have developed trust with. Thankfully, I did buy a legit Menasor & Devvy from trustworthy sources. It also helps to do plenty of research beforehand, especially figures that you know have been KO'd.
     
  18. Transbot90210

    Transbot90210 Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2002
    Posts:
    14,849
    News Credits:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    236
    Likes:
    +7
    I would get the money back before resending the figure AND I would put in a complaint to ebay that this guy is selling KO's as original items.

    The fact that he has sold 8 means he knows he is selling KO's.

    I think I paid $80 for my KO Reflector at a show. It is a very solid high end KO but there is no need to pay original prices on a KO.
     
  19. Composite Ghost

    Composite Ghost Motorized Transformer

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2011
    Posts:
    2,709
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    172
    Likes:
    +22
    Yeah I also think ebay should be made aware of what this guy is up to. At this point he is fully aware they are not legitimate so there is no excuse for passing them off as vintage.

    I may even email ebay myself. I don't like being a snitch, but I especially don't like seeing my fellow collectors being scammed.
     
  20. 2punish&enslave

    2punish&enslave Starscream's Brigade

    Joined:
    May 27, 2010
    Posts:
    1,386
    Trophy Points:
    126
    Likes:
    +2
    Ebay:
    I think that waiting to get my money back before returning the package is a good idea. I'm not seeing where he has previously sold KO Reflectors. I do regularly report eBay sellers for selling KOs as "reissue" or worse yet as originals. I caught a lot of hell from people when I brought that up in a thread months ago but frankly I don't care. Personally I don't think that KOs should be sold on eBay at all whether they are correctly advertised as KOs or not.
     

Share This Page