Delays or fill-ins?

Discussion in 'Comic Books and Graphic Novels' started by Primal, Feb 27, 2007.

  1. Primal

    Primal Moderator

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    Just wondering how everyone felt about the recent fill-ins being announced by DC since they are having delays in titles like Action Comics, Superman and Wonder Woman.

    Do you prefer story arcs broken up with fill-ins or would you want to wait to have the story as a whole. I don't mind the delays too much, I think of it as saving some money.

    Is this a practice done more by DC? I haven't been collecting Marvel as much as I have DC so I'm not sure if they do. With Civil War they just waited out the delays (they did offer fill-in titles that were seperate entities).
     
  2. j3

    j3 Kiefer is my Big Boss TFW2005 Supporter

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    I'd rather the stories just come out on time, even if it meant dropping the headline artist. There are plenty of other good artists out there who could do the work. A fill-in artist then would be my choice. I guess of the two options though, I suppose fill-in is a nicer choice, you aren't then completely deprived of the character/book/whatever then. At least on the next Action, the story even ties in to the arc that it'll be interrupting (though the 3 immediately following it do not).
     
  3. DevilzFan

    DevilzFan CobraIsland.com Veteran

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    If DC can keep putting out weekly books, why the fuck can't they, and especially Marvel, put out a friggin MONTHLY book on time?

    I'd love if the comic readers of the world just stopped buying constantly late books. Books like the above mentioned Wonder Woman, Action, ect. Books like Ultimates, Ultimates 2, and all the other shit that are late 90% of the time because the artists are either too fucking lazy, or get caught up in too many projects.

    Just what exactly is Bryan Hitch doing other than Ultimates that takes all his time away from you know, actually working on the god damned book?
     
  4. Switchblade

    Switchblade Just a raggedy man

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    In a perfect world, all these books would come out on time. But that clearly doesn't happen. Personally, I'm okay with a bit of delay, but if it gets to the point where you're missing months between issues, then it's time to start doing the fill-ins. I think that was a really good call on Wonder Woman, and I applaud DC for not putting up with Heinburg's shit anymore. It would be nice if Marvel would follow suit, too. I don't read Ultimates, but I understand the delay is ridiculous. And there were children conceived and born in the time it took Civil War to run its full course because of the delays.
     
  5. Edge

    Edge weapon of destruction

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    The one question I have always asked is, if an artist is always delivering late. Then why not just get the writer to write the whole thing then send it off to the artist? Then when they get to a point that's deemed safe solicite the book. I understand that art takes time as does writing, but if your job is to deliver a book monthy then you should deliver it MONTHLY! The whole late artists thing I think falls on 3 people: The editor, the writer and the artist.

    This is all my opnion mind you but it really is something I often wondered about
     
  6. OmegaScourge

    OmegaScourge Custom Made TFW2005 Supporter

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    and to me, if the artist cant make it on time, let him start on the next issue while a filler artist works on the current issue (that way it gets out on time, and there'd be no need for a filler issue)

    but if its the writer who cant make it on time...then just delay it.
     
  7. The Spider

    The Spider Well-Known Member

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    That depends. As much as I like, say, Mark Bagley or John Byrne's art, I totally wouldn't want either to fill in the middle of Ultimates 2, since their style is way too different and would give a jarring tone when read altogether. I think Alan Moore's Miracleman might've been better if there was one artist working in sync with him (Thankfully, John Totleben did a whole storyarc--even though issues were delayed heavily because of his eye disease).
     
  8. Primal

    Primal Moderator

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    How about number jumping? If an arc is being delayed, would you like to move onto the next arc (if available) while you're waiting for the current story to end? Like if a series is in a 6 parter (starting at issue 10) and it only makes it to issue 12 before major delays. Would you want issue 16 to come out next and then go back to issue 13 when its ready?

    Granted it might be confusing to casual/new readers and problematic if the second arc requires elements from the first arc to be set up.
     
  9. OmegaScourge

    OmegaScourge Custom Made TFW2005 Supporter

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    Spawn was the only title that i knew of that skipped issues than printed it later (though it was a tale that didn't really screw up anything (nor wasnt spoiler by the issues that were printed)
     
  10. Lumpy

    Lumpy Taylor Swift Actionmaster Super Mod

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    i hate how DC is doing it...id much rather not read the book for 3 or 4 months, instead of getting crappy fill in (grotesk, anyone?) and now with all this stuff in wonder woman and action comics? these are the 3 big superheroes of DC, and they are all having this issue....i dont like fill in artist, cuz i like the stories to flow with style, and sometimes a fill in artist can get it right, sometimes they cant. your idea of changing the numbering is pretty cool, but i doubt that would ever happen. and yet i keep buying this crap....oh well, at least i have plenty of comics arriving on time to read. i think im just gonna not buy filler issues, unless they end up being a good story. i'll just read them in store, and buy if i like em....
     
  11. Ogami Daigoro

    Ogami Daigoro Blue Lantern Bearer

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    I'd rather that they delay things as well. I really like art continuity. Story is a close second. I only really buy comics because they are a unique visual medium. If I just wanted a good story, there are plenty of other options.

    And I would tend to wait for trades anyway, given the choice. Having one story or arc in one collected book is the way to go, IMO. That said, I still have been frequenting the comic book store for monthlys and my free copies of 52 (I won a raffle on last year's FCBD).
     
  12. Wreckgar

    Wreckgar Anthony Stark Veteran

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    Remember the days when comics were alwaws on time? Those were the days.

    It's funny because comic companies constantly wonder why sales are down. Well maybe it's for this reason. Why bother buying a book monthly when it doesn't come out monthly. People lose interest in a story if it's taken to long.

    And why artists can't get stuff out is beyond me. And it's always the big name guys. Kubert did how many issues of Batman and has been on delay, and he got a head start to work on it! But then there is Billy Tucci who was taken off Heroes For Hire because they wanted that on time. So wait, HFH has to come out on time but McNiven gets to slack on Civil War and Adi Granov on Iron Man? It boggles my mind. Firestorm is an okay book and I actually just dropped it but Jamal Igle was always on time. I never had to wait more than 4 weeks for an issue. But Wonder Woman is in limbo for months.
     
  13. The Spider

    The Spider Well-Known Member

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    Both Kuberts are experiencing delays (Adam on ACTION, Andy on BATMAN), and I wonder, if we go back to their X-Men work, how many pages did they end up doing each month? Even Ultimate X-Men during the Millar run wasn't all done by Adam Kubert. Are they doing teaching jobs at the Joe Kubert School? Could probably be something taking up time.

    Put it this way: Civil War is still consistantly at the top spot regardless of delays. Heroes for Hire #6 (the January 2006 issue) is ranked at #71, has only est. 27,000 copies ordered.

    Which do you think they'd rather allow delays on?

    Iron Man, though, I'm not sure about but maybe having Granov doing the art was a part of the deal or something, or it could be another case of trying to keep things consistant looking for a TPB (more on that later). Worth noting--Granov was originally going to be the artist for the NEW AVENGERS Civil War tie-in spotlighting the Sentry, and was replaced with Pasqual Ferry instead.

    Also--your Firestorm example pretty much indicates why they'd try to make allowances for a popular creative team who's selling high numbers, whether or not they're on time. They didn't reward John Byrne's BLOOD OF THE DEMON for being on time, for instance.

    I think a part of this is that they're now allowing delays because they're thinking in long-term, thinking of the TPB market and all that. IIRC, Joe Quesada used the example of WATCHMEN as his reasoning for allowing Civil War to be late (in one of the Joe Fridays, I think; but there's others who might've used this reasoning too)--the idea is that even though WATCHMEN had delays in its schedule, it ended up not being really important since most of its readers read it in TPB form.

    BTW, in case anyone was wondering: According to this Joe Madureira is said to be finishing the second issue of ULTIMATES 3 right now. Thankfully though, they haven't solicited it yet so they can't really say that it's actually "late" yet.
     
  14. Denyer

    Denyer Shooty Dog Thing

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    I'd rather wait. But I also massively prefer comics where each issue functions as a satisfying read anyway, so delays on a book where the story is stretched out kill interest.

    Best case scenario would be to get shorter series reasonably complete before starting to publish.
     
  15. Switchblade

    Switchblade Just a raggedy man

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    Can't speak much for Adam, as his X-Men run was short and I didn't read Wolverine, but I don't remember any of Andy's issues that didn't have his art on every page.
     
  16. Wreckgar

    Wreckgar Anthony Stark Veteran

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    Tucci isn't doing HFH anymore. He was only slated for 1-4. And it doesn't matter on what it sold. If it was late, I don't think it would matter in sales. If "Civil War" was plastered across it, it would sell. Ghost Rider and Moon Knight are just getting into Civil War last month as it ended. And Ghost Rider doesn't have "top" talent at all.

    And thw whole Big names vs regular guys is a crap standard. Just because Patrick Zircher isn't a huge name, he doesn't get special treatment. His Thunderbolts, Deadpool, and Iron Man stuff have all been on time . But because your name is Lee or Kubert, you get slack. I'd rather see a timely artist on a book than a big name. Yea you make a big deal on Kubert coming to DC and doing Batman. But guess what? It doesn't mean crap if it's not on the stands to sell.

    Then there is the big talent vs the big talent. Ethan VanSciver has always been on time with his Green lantern books. Ron Garney has always hit the mark with Spierman. David Finch was on time with Avengers and Moon Knight. If they can do it, why not can't they all?
     
  17. Lumpy

    Lumpy Taylor Swift Actionmaster Super Mod

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    amen wreckgar....i think that absolutely makes sense....and should be taken into account when putting people on books.
     
  18. Fairlady_Z

    Fairlady_Z Official Voice of Flareup

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    Delays have partly killed my interest in Astonishing X-Men. I was also thinking about trying Wonder Woman again, but at this point I'll just wait for the trades.
     
  19. j3

    j3 Kiefer is my Big Boss TFW2005 Supporter

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    Well now Wonder Woman should be very much back on track. Heinberg's final iss is cancelled (to be finished in an annual or something sometime down the road). Like we even need to read it though, we've know Diana will be WW by the end of it since before the series even relaunched. But anyway, issue 5 is now a pre-Amazons Attack issue by that series' writer Will Pfeifer, and Picoult is still set to launch her arc at issue 6. So I may just give WW a try again.
     

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