Beast Machines Musings

Discussion in 'Transformers General Discussion' started by neospark1, Jun 24, 2006.

  1. neospark1

    neospark1 Well-Known Member

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    Just finished watching Beast Machines ... again.

    Hmm ...

    Is Cybertron still technorganic? If so, how are things now on Cybertron?

    Is ALL of Cybertron technorganic? Parts? Just what type of balance was the Oracle looking for? A complete melding or a balance on both sides? Both?

    Were all Cybertronians reformatted? If so, did each Transformer WANT to become a cyborg? Did planting the Seeds of the Future also plant the seeds of the next Great War?

    If there are still pure tech Cybertronians. If so, how do they feel about their reformatted siblings?

    What of bringing the organic to Cybertron? With the introduction of flesh and organics, you also invite viruses, bacteria, etc. Has there been sickness? A flu? Is there a plague coming?

    Hmmmmmm ....
     
  2. Rattrap587

    Rattrap587 Maximal Ground Operations

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    BM was cool if we consider an independent TF series... What the hell they did to the BW guys?!? BW was so close to the perfection... Hasbro shoud make another sequel to BW or produce the Transtech series for good.
     
  3. Autobus Prime

    Autobus Prime Transit Former

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    The Universe comic briefly addressed some of these questions, I've heard.
     
  4. Megatronwp38

    Megatronwp38 Megatron? Is that you!?!?

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    I like how Primal says the Oracle sent them to earth to bring back the organic.....yet their ancestors...the autobots and decepticons...were already there before them?!? LOL. It looks to me like it is a balance of technology and organics, and resistance to assimilation IS futile. I like the show a lot actually. It is so deep and just well written.
     
  5. Backscatter

    Backscatter Autobot Brainmaster TFW2005 Supporter

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    I tried hard to appreciate BM, and even bought the DVDs. I still can't stand the ending. It's a nightmare to think that's how Cybertron looks today in the G1 universe. So I'm all in for calling BM an independent TF series like RID/CR. However, I really would like to add Transtech Transformers to my collection and a Transtech series would be radical.:rock 
     
  6. Omega Supreme-1

    Omega Supreme-1 Autobot Sentinel

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    You know you could always say Beast Machines was a divergent timeline. Meaning that at the end of the Beast Wars, the normal time flow splits off with a reality where Megatron escapes causing the "Beast Machine" wars. However, you could always have him in the normal timeline being returned and captured thus leading to whatever you want it to be.
     
  7. Viper_486

    Viper_486 Cobraaa!

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    Thats how I take it.
    In my head BM *never happened* It exists only as a part of the multiverse, and not the prime reality.
    That, and its a little more open minded than ZOMG, IT NEVER HAPPENED !!1!
    BW was more like a continuance of G1, while BM was more like WTF?!?
    But held as its own reality, I quite liked it.
     
  8. Sol Fury

    Sol Fury The British Butcher Administrator News Staff

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    I know there was meant to be an extra scene that never got made at the end of Beast Machines, showing the fate of Strika and Obsidian. They return to the planet, but are meant to decline reformatting, so presumably that answers that question. I guess you could argue it doesn't count since it didn't get animated, though.
    Also, Botanica proves there were other TFs offworld while this was happening - colony worlds, perhaps, that weren't affected. I'd say its less a race-wide redefinition and more just those on Cybertron at the time. Some must have gotten offworld in any case before the plague got them I'd imagine.

    I definately think that's not the end of it, though. Just as Megatron and Rhinox believed that technology was superior, so will there be those who strive to restore the "true" Cybertron and rid themselves and their world of the organic. It'd degenerate until there are two factions again - organics and technological. One side fighting for Primal's ideal, the other for Megatron's. In a sense, what Megatron did will not go away simply because he is gone. That is their true legacy.
     
  9. Primus_feather

    Primus_feather Well-Known Member

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    it was my impresion that when megatron broke free from the Autobot Shuttle, and landed on Cybertron Earlier then the rest of the BW crew. He supposodly have enough time to re-call ALL Cybertronians (if they wernt ALL there to begin with) and then removed all their sparks, thus when Cybertron was re-formated and the trapped sparks were released, they too were re-formated. Now weather the approching crowd of TFers @ the end of BM were coming to thank the BM heros or slag them, no one knows.
     
  10. Frognal

    Frognal Prodigal Son Returned

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    I like to think of BM as Wheelie's feverish dream. That way it's not canon and you can blame Wheelie.
     
  11. neospark1

    neospark1 Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for such a well constructed post.

    You hit the screw right into the cranial compartment.

    How can you have free will (harmony per Primal) when you have no choice (reformatting)?

    =====

    God how I miss beautifully animated, well written Transformers.

    Would it not be a dream for a new Mainframe Entertainment and our beloved voice actors (both BW/BM and G1) take up the next chapter of Transformers (Armada/Energon/Cybertron do not count)?

    Aaron did say and strongly hinted that he REALLY wants the next show to be done on this side of the Ocean.

    Hmmmmmm ...

     
  12. Feralstorm

    Feralstorm I ship Nick & Judy TFW2005 Supporter

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    I can understand that a lot of people dislike the ending of Beast Machines, but, as already implied here, It makes for a ton of story possibility for what could come next. The only post-BM story stuff was the Universe comics, and those never really explored the potential on difference of opinions on organic/techno-organic/mechanical.
     
  13. Sol Fury

    Sol Fury The British Butcher Administrator News Staff

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    He may have tried it, but Botanica does say when she arrives that her and her crew were on a planet where the indiginous lifeform were plants, so presumably her crew was still out there. Also, the backstory to the Beast Machines Dinobots, while a non-show addition to the toyline, does state that they were also offworld. I think it was in Magmatron's bio.

    At the end of the day, even if Megatron did manage to get most Cybertronians back on planet, there would have been those too far our to make it, or who were out of touch with their world so couldn't possibly have known. That's not even going into those who refused to return out of principle! At best, I think Megatron could only have got 95% of Cybertronians.
     
  14. Fairlady_Z

    Fairlady_Z Official Voice of Flareup

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    I pretty much agree with BM happening in an alternate reality. Is BM a good cartoon? Yes. But is it a good Transformers cartoon? No. I just can't get over techno-organic Cybertron especially when the very opening dialogue of MTMTE establishes Cybertron as the only completely metalic world that I know of in all sci-fi. (And even if Cybetron isn't the only one, it's certainly the coolest.)
     
  15. Night Flame

    Night Flame TFW2005 Supporter

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    I'll never understand those who try to say Beast Machines never happened. Granted, I have my own theories on how Cybertron came to be, how Transformers came to be, and Beast Machines not only reinforces my theories, but plays into them very, very nicely, so I'm probably a weirdo in Transfandom. But still, it's an awesome story, and people freaking out about techno-organics being a part of Cybertron just seems a little odd to me.

    As for whether those who were "reformatted" were happy about it? I would guess there were probably a few around who didn't care for it, but if their choice was, A) Be sucked into Megatron's super-spark, B) Be a body-less, essentially lifeless, free-floating spark, or C) Be "reformatted" and given a new body, a new life, and another chance to be with your old friends, most bots probably didn't get too upset at the idea of reformatting.

    However, there is no doubt at all in my mind that somewhere amongst all those reformatted, the next "Megatron" was waiting in the wings, and would bide his time and gather like-minded individuals around him to try and repurify Cybertron to be purely technological again.

    As far as being a good Transformers story? It was an AWESOME Transformers story. It tied back to G1 stories in ways that no other series has done, including occassionally even tapping the same writers to re-explore old ideas. The Plasma Energy Chamber, the references to old Cybertron from G1, the Oracle/Vector Sigma connection, the Key to Vector Sigma, and all the other little ties back made it more tied to cannon than some of the early episodes of Beast Wars. Not that I'm saying Beast Wars was bad, just that Beast Machines seemed to pull in more G1 references. Good, bad or indifferent, for an old-schooler, there were many more moments of "HOLY COW! I REMEMBER THAT!" in Machines than in Wars.

    All together, the entire Beast saga, Wars and Machines, was the best run of Transformers cartoons we've ever seen. I can only hope at some point we get back to that kind of story telling. I don't care whether it ties to G1 or not, I just liked that type of writing. No talking down for the kids, no simplifying things for simple minds. Just a good story about war that showed not only the consequences, but also why fighting is sometimes our only option.

    I'm about five episodes away from finishing Beast Machines for the second time since getting the set, and I'm liking it even more this second time through. Part of me kind of hopes the new movie gets this type of writing, quality wise. I know there'll be a lot of action, but it's probably our best hope for non-stupified writing in non-comics for Transformers for a good long while.
     
  16. Fairlady_Z

    Fairlady_Z Official Voice of Flareup

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    BM was well written, no doubt about that. The problem for me was in making EVERYBODY and Cybertron techno-organic. Had the techno-organics remained a sub-group of their own (just like Headmasters, or Combiners, or Micromasters or whatever) I don't think a lot of people would have had a problem with it. If Cybertron really is Primus and not just a normal planet than reformatting him is kinda silly. But BM is still a lot better than most of the Japanese series in my opinion. And I really do like most of the BM characters and all the G1 references in the show. I agree that the next cartoon or whatever for TFs should have the same quality of writing.
     
  17. Fortress_Wise

    Fortress_Wise Head of Dalyst

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    BM would be a Excellent Series.....If it wasn't the Sequal to Beast Wars. I think there is a lesson to be learned for Mankind in there......Somewhere.
     
  18. Brave Magnus

    Brave Magnus Hecho en Argentina

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    And the lesson is: NEVER TRUST A TF, EVENTUALLY THE GOOD GUY WILL CONSUME YOUR RESOURCES AND KILL YOUR PEOPLE. :D 
    I have the crazy theory that BM Cybertron is Earth, otherwise I can't explain the Earth animals burried deep Cybertron.
    I love BM, I was not happy at the beginning but I start to appeciate almost at the end. And the last scene is cool because it leaves the door to a sequel, a techno-organic world and everyone is suppose to be happy? I think Primal blew it. There will be a new war, that's for sure.
    Hail Megatron! The real savior of Cybertron. ^_^
     
  19. CompuGlobal HyperMegatron

    CompuGlobal HyperMegatron Nobody summons Megatron

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    I could never really get into Beast Machines. The whole concept of bringing organics to Cybertron seemed really wrong to me.
     

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