Armada or G1?

Discussion in 'Transformers Toy Discussion' started by JBSideways, Dec 20, 2009.

  1. Motor_Master

    Motor_Master Lets the balls touch

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2002
    Posts:
    13,546
    News Credits:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    392
    Location:
    New Hampshire
    Likes:
    +2,428
    The sad part about Armada cartoon is that you had to sit through 40 - 45 episodes of pure garbage to get those few good nuggets of goodness. I was able to watch the episodes when they aired, but trying to watch them just a few months ago and I couldn't sit through more than 5 minutes at a time. The G1 cartoon I can sit down and watch without hesitation, even with the plot holes you could drive a semi through.

    As for the toylines I look at it as "are these figures better or worse than what came before." For G1 it's no contest that it was better since the concept didn't exist prior. There were cars or there were robot.

    For Armada there was nearly 15 years of Transformers toy lines to build from when Armada began development, yet the end product was several steps backwards from its predecessor RID.
     
  2. Autobot_Wall-E

    Autobot_Wall-E The Musical

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2009
    Posts:
    2,044
    Trophy Points:
    151
    Likes:
    +1
    Hmmm... I've gotta say G1. I never really liked Armada.
     
  3. gargunkle

    gargunkle someone

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2007
    Posts:
    4,735
    Trophy Points:
    212
    Likes:
    +35
    I'll be selling most of my G1s and keeping most/many of my Armadas.
    Plus there are some great recolors of Armada figures.

    Edit: I'm talking just about the toys. I've never seen the Armada show.
     
  4. megatronkicksas

    megatronkicksas Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2008
    Posts:
    5,106
    News Credits:
    33
    Trophy Points:
    176
    Likes:
    +36
    Armada.....seriously.
     
  5. Grimlock_13

    Grimlock_13 Currently facepalming at your post

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2002
    Posts:
    25,711
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    412
    Location:
    Boise, ID
    Likes:
    +4,495
    I prefer G1. But ignoring the issues with the toys and the gimmicks Armada has some better MADE toys since they came nearly 20 years later. You couls probably throw half the Amrada toys against the wall and you'd be left with an unbroken toy and a hole in your wall. Then try it with a G1 toy (ok, nevermind DON'T try it with a G1 toy...)
     
  6. megatronkicksas

    megatronkicksas Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2008
    Posts:
    5,106
    News Credits:
    33
    Trophy Points:
    176
    Likes:
    +36
    Back then? It's like that now.
     
  7. Tiller

    Tiller I don't know nothin'

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2009
    Posts:
    5,121
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    287
    Likes:
    +1,225
    Ebay:
    As an ArmaDURR (being seriously introduced into the series by Armada) and then later realizing that it wasn't as good as my childhood made it out to be, I will still have to give it the nudge. This is honestly because I have no history with G1 as a child, and as such I can't really relate to much of it. I've watched the show and I think it's the worst TV series in Transformer history (minus Energon) and dislike most of the G1 toys (bricks, headmasters, and pretenders are lame IMO). I liked the minicon gimmick when it worked well for the Transformers plus the minicons themselves, and despite what people say about articulation decline Armada still had more. I also love Super Pants Prime in his Jetfire pants and Overload backpack.

    Don't get me wrong. I respect the G1 line like a samurai master, but it doesn't stop me for looking at the line as it is now. I kind of grow frustrated when everyone keeps asking for classics remakes or MOAR GEEEWUN all the time over new and different things since I simply can't relate.

    Also, Galvatron is lame. Dildo cannon doesn't impress the ladies.
     
  8. mugen_prime

    mugen_prime Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2006
    Posts:
    1,744
    Trophy Points:
    287
    Likes:
    +273
    As far as I'm concerned, Armada just sucked all together. So G1 definitely wins.
     
  9. Polenicus

    Polenicus Warring At Play

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2002
    Posts:
    3,399
    Trophy Points:
    312
    Likes:
    +563
    Ebay:
    I'm not even a huge G1 fan, and I have to say G1.

    Armada had a few gems... Unicron, bendy Prime... even Megatron was good once you got past the completely brick lower half... but it just doesn't have anything to compare to G1

    Scope? G1 wins

    Engineering? Armada toys really weren't any more articulated than your average G1 toy

    Gimmicks? Minicons were kinda fun, but honestly, G1 had done everything Armada had done with smaller robots (Micromasters, Headmasters, Targetmasters) and generally had done it better.

    Cartoon? Directly compare the final Armada arc, the high point of the series, with the G1 movie. Nuff said.

    Armada was important, of course... it helped the designers re-learn what worked, and what didn't (Given it was aimed at a North American audience, and not a Japanese one like RiD), and is directly responsible for what we've got today. Still, it definitely starts off on a lower rung than G1.
     
  10. Bumblethumper

    Bumblethumper old misery guts

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2007
    Posts:
    9,749
    News Credits:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    332
    Likes:
    +1,647
    I just recently opened Encore Meister, and it really is a thing of beauty. I'd recommend it to anyone as an ideal introduction to G1. G1 Optimus too, Grimlock, Godmaster Ginrai there's a good few. The cassette-bots are fun.

    I don't recommend all of G1. I don't recommend Sparkabots. I don't recommend Pretenders. I don't recommend micromasters, actionmasters. I don't recommend most of the stuff Hasbro came up with that weren't pre-existing takara molds. I recommend the Furman comics over the show.

    Armada with very few exceptions I just plain won't go near.
     
  11. biscuits

    biscuits Sin from Genesis

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2008
    Posts:
    9,078
    Trophy Points:
    337
    Likes:
    +294
    ARMADA! (looks frantickly for some cover)
     
  12. Sizzle

    Sizzle Sparkabot

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2009
    Posts:
    1,577
    Trophy Points:
    126
    Likes:
    +5
    If this had been G1 vs. RiD, I would've said RiD without any hesitation.

    But clearly G1 toys are more desirable than just about any Armada toys. The only ones that I really like are Unicron, Bendy Prime and Blurr. I do enjoy the mini-cons, though, as they are fun to fiddle with.
     
  13. Empir3

    Empir3 Bedstructicon Empir3

    Joined:
    May 18, 2007
    Posts:
    1,887
    Trophy Points:
    126
    Likes:
    +3
    lol wut? G1!
     
  14. 03Mach1

    03Mach1 Logic has been replaced with blind ignorance.

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2002
    Posts:
    16,924
    News Credits:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    387
    Likes:
    +2,776
    Ebay:
    G1.
     
  15. Squall42080

    Squall42080 Autobot RSX Type-S

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2003
    Posts:
    4,691
    News Credits:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    332
    Location:
    Lancaster, PA
    Likes:
    +554
    Ebay:
    Facebook:
    Twitter:
    Instagram:
    Flickr:
    YouTube (Legacy):
    Well, I hope that when everyone is comparing Armada to G1 that you are all comparing Armada as a singular series to the first season of G1.

    If you really want to compare "Universes" the Armada series ran through Energon and into Cybertron...which is a fairer comparison to the expanse of G1.

    Its easy to say G1 is better than Armada (although I feel its not true) because it has that air of nostalgia that our minds will always protect. I have to admit, and hopefully I'm not alone here, that everytime I've re-purchased a G1 toy that was lost since my childhood, I am sorely disappointed, and the same applies to everytime I try and watch a G1 episode. Sure it has that "old skool" goodness, but each episode is actually more of a joke. We simply hold the series in such high regard because it is the cornerstone of our hobby, and there is nothing wrong with that. I also hope that we all realize that 20 years from now, kids that grew up with Armada will cherish that series the same way we cherish G1, and hopefully there will be some type of anniversary line to celebrate that. Sure, value wise, if someone put a G1 Bumblebee and an Armada Hotshot on a table, and said you could only have one, the collectors are gonna go with Bumblebee...but a kid would go for Hotshot, and that is the key audience for the hobby we all follow.

    If we are really comparing "Universes," than the Armada/Energon/Cybertron series would dominate toy wise. Sure the cartoons are iffy in there own individual ways and don't tie together as well as G1...but the toys are infinitely better thanks to modernization and design improvements.

    Personally though, I favor Armada as a standalone series over anything G1 can offer. I was born in 1980 and grew up watching G1, but that's it. Its time has come and gone. Its nice to have an homage here or there, and I understand the rules of there always having to be a Prime and a Megatron...but Armada is what brought Transformers back into the limelight and restored that classic battle that was lost since G1. The series should be appreciated for at least that.
     
  16. Dinobot Nuva

    Dinobot Nuva Johnny 3 Tears Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2006
    Posts:
    9,106
    News Credits:
    16
    Trophy Points:
    347
    Likes:
    +5,618
    Meh, I'm not a big G1 fan. But Armada wasn't my favorite line either.

    Guess I'll go with Armada.
     
  17. grimlock1972

    grimlock1972 Optimus, serving up the primest of ribs since 1984

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2009
    Posts:
    20,361
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    362
    Likes:
    +2,406
    The only Armada molds i really love are Unicron, Tidal wave ( ill finally own one very soon) and many of the minicons
     
  18. Aernaroth

    Aernaroth <b><font color=blue>I voted for Super_Megatron and Veteran

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2004
    Posts:
    28,212
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    422
    Likes:
    +10,072
    Let's level the playing field here a bit.

    Which subline is better, the minicons, or the micromasters?

    Personally, I'd side with the minicons. Granted, micromasters were made a decade earlier, but the armada minicons not only had better articulation and detail (which is to be expected), but really pushed the boundaries of what features could be included in a figure that size, such as a 2nd alt mode, moving parts like winches and projectiles, etc. Micromasters come extremely close, as they originated the design and tried to move it into some interesting areas (such as the mix and match 2-combiner teams, and the much later micromaster gestalts), but the minicons really built on the concept more significantly, and I hope we continue to see their kind. I'm inclined to give the Armada line a pass on many of its faults, if only because it introduced the minicons.


    What's a better gimmick, Targetmasters/Powermasters, or Minicon linkage?

    In terms of a concept, I'd go with the idea of minicon linkage, but it was a concept that was only really followed in a few figures, and it showed in the toys that there were a lot of ideas that never really made it through the design process. The ____Masters were a much simpler concept from a simpler time, but they arguably accomplish the idea of interchangable partners that truly interact during play with the larger figures, outside of a few select examples in Armada.
     
  19. Prime Noble

    Prime Noble Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2008
    Posts:
    13,524
    Trophy Points:
    362
    Location:
    Ireland
    Likes:
    +37,036
    If we're going to compare universes where Armada leads into Energon and Cybertron then look at the G1 Universe that leads into G2, Robotmasters, Classics, Alternators, Beast Wars/Machines, Universe.

    Personally I preferred Micromasters to Minicons. For one, they all had cool robot modes. Mini-cons had an awful lot of hideous robot modes that looked like they hailed from the mindscape of a certain Mr. Bay.

    As for Armada relaunching Transformers. Didn't it come out the same year the reissues and the Dreamwave comcs started? I got back into TF's that year and no way was it Armada that swayed me.
    More recently, the Baymovies relaunched the franchise and in some ways, there are parallels between the Movies and Armada.

    Horrible robot designs.

    Bad writing with more focus on the annoying humans.

    Carlos and Leo.

    Now it's been said that the G1 cartoon has a lot of us older fans captured by nostalgia. Not so, even as a kid, I thought most of the G1 cartoon was, and still is, rubbish. Alpha Trion, Kremzeek, WTF? Now it wasn't all bad. Had a great voice cast and background music which would have elevated Headmasters to Beast Wars levels.

    Also had the best pilot ever and the Animated Movie can still hold it's own against most modern offerings. Lent it to a few workmates in recent months and they thought it was great. But for the most part, the G1 cartoon was terrible.

    While I'm at it, I couldn't help but notice the Actionmaster bashing. It boggles the mind that people love the cutesy, terribly proportioned Robot Heroes yet attack Actionmasters.

    Actionmasters had character ala some nice tech specs (always loved Kick-Off). They had little companions that came in a myriad of forms (Top Heavy and Catgut are awesome) and nice little hand guns.

    Some came with cool vehicles like Prime's Armoured Convoy and the line was a great way to cheaply procure classic characters. Let me tell you, growing up in Ireland, we missed out on a lot of TF's that everyone else got like Shockwave, Devestator and Blaster so the Actionmaster line was a great way of getting them.

    I grew up on the UK comics. Even moreso than the toys, the UK comics were what kept me collecting for 6 years. When they stopped, I lost interest in TF's for a decade.

    As much as I loved Dreamwave, the Marvel UK comics will always be my canon. Not too happy with IDW I'm afraid. At least Dreamwave made a cool attempt to characterise all those Mini-cons AND Micromasters and their Armada/Energon comics were as Shakespeare compared to the cartoons.

    I know I've probably irked some fans but I'm only expressing an opinion. I probably sound like a G1-er but that term suggests I have no time for any other line. Not true. All the series have their magic but unfortunately all of them have their flaws, some more than others. Armada's cartoon and some of the toys are really what cripples it when comparing it to other lines but it's not without it's charm.

    It gave us a PS2 game that has yet to be bettered. Even if you weren't a TF fan, it's one of the best games ever and after 6 years, I sometimes like to return to it. Not many games have that longevity. If the people behind the cutscenes had done the cartoon, it would easily surpass any other series.

    Toywise, Armada greats include the Seekers, Demolisher, Megatron, Bendy Prime and Hoist. I also like Sideswipe, just wish he were a Basic/Scout.

    Anyway, I suppose I'm a bit defensive when it comes to G1 so sorry for the logwinded rant.
     
  20. Omnius

    Omnius Guest

    Joined:
    May 14, 2006
    Posts:
    12,031
    News Credits:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    312
    Likes:
    +334
    G1. Armada felt like a huge step backward in comparison to RiD, I'm not a fan of it.