Afternoon to night sequences..

Discussion in 'Transformers Movie Discussion' started by iheartarcee, Oct 17, 2007.

  1. iheartarcee

    iheartarcee Idonotheartbeastwars

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    I remember noticing this in the theater but it was noticed much more now that I can analyze the movie a bit in my home. Starting with the first act and continuing through the movie it seems to go from about 3 pm or maybe 4 pm to like 9 pm in 10 minutes. I'm not hating the moving because of it, but I wonder if its Bays way of being able to not show as much detail or save on cgi costs.

    I would imagine that the barricade/bumblebee fight would have cost more to shoot in day light because of the amount of detail he couldnt hide in the dark. Starting from the very beginning of that whole sequence where Sam gets up and tells Mojo to stop barking because its to early to the end of the fight seems to only happen in maybe an hours time. Just a thought..
     
  2. Valkysas

    Valkysas Attack Buffalo

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    just think of it this way:

    stuff happened between the transitions, but because they couldnt dedicate 2 or more hours for the scenes where this happens to show everything, they just showed the beginning and end of the scenes.
     
  3. Mr. Jiggles

    Mr. Jiggles loves your mother.

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    Those sequences are incredibly hard to edit. It takes a long time to set up a shot, so you kinda have to ignore them, even though they are annoying. A better idea would have probably been to cut away to a different location for a bit, then come back to give the audience a better sense of time lapse.

    The only movie that has ever really pulled this off, IMHO, is Terminator 3.
     
  4. Team Jetfire

    Team Jetfire Pop-POP!

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    I thought I heard Sam say something to the effect of 'I have been chased by by car all day' to barricade. That would be a long time on that little bike, but could explain the incredibly quick day.
     
  5. iheartarcee

    iheartarcee Idonotheartbeastwars

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    Well they didnt imply that things happen between the transitions. Are you saying that Sam rode his moms bike at around 8 am, for, lets say, 4 hours with bumblebee chasing him, then her ran into Mikaela at burger king while she was eating lunch and he continued to ride his bike from there for at least another 6 hours before running into barricade? Again.. I know its just a movie and I dont have hate, I just wish it was edited better or shot over several days to maintain daylight correctly..
     
  6. Lock Cade

    Lock Cade Tarn Fangirl TFW2005 Supporter

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    Time is an issue here, folks. It seems like a day has been compressed down to an hour, but you know that they couldn't film everything, from insignificant to significant events, that had happened in an entire day. Besides, the movie would have been too lengthy if they showed Bumblebee's chasing Sam on a bike for a good chunk of the day, Barricade's chasing Bumblebee with Sam and Mikaela in tow, etc.

    Just accept the fact that they filmed parts of this movie at different times of the day as seen fit. They're on a set budget, and I'm sure there's a limitation on the length of a film in order for it to be in theatres, so... need I say any more on the subject?
     
  7. seeker311

    seeker311 The Collector

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    Its interesting that the chase scenes are the ones to go into night real quick. The actual CGI scenes seem to stay at the same lunch time.
     
  8. Valkysas

    Valkysas Attack Buffalo

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    We've been over this several dozen times on this forum.

    Sam was at the police station all night. his dad got him out in the morning (we know this). he then went back to sleep and got up late in the day, and his line about it being "too early" to mojo is a result of him just getting up, not of it actually being too early. when he leaves, the sun is high in the sky, and mikaela is either eating lunch or dinner at burger king. that's when he meets up with barricade, and the chase lasts the rest of the day.
     
  9. Team Jetfire

    Team Jetfire Pop-POP!

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    works for me.
     
  10. iheartarcee

    iheartarcee Idonotheartbeastwars

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    The search function never works for me in the forums here lol... Thanks for pointing that out.. Although lets say that he woke up at noon, that still gives him a 5 to 6 hour bike ride.
     
  11. Lock Cade

    Lock Cade Tarn Fangirl TFW2005 Supporter

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    If this doesn't clear things up with those who have trouble with the time in certain events in the movie, then nothing will. People, just take Valkysas' word and let's put this discussion to an end.
     
  12. Valkysas

    Valkysas Attack Buffalo

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    No it doesnt, because he got in bumblebee while it was still day time. it gives him a long car ride.
     
  13. DeathsHead

    DeathsHead Well-Known Member

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    Almost. But it not quite. There is no 6 hour bike ride or car ride. And the Barricade/Bumblebee fight was clearly intended to be a night time event. I would be stunned to dicover it happened because of lazy scheduling.

    So Micheal Bay has to get from afternoon to night. He does this with an artificial compression of time, hoping that the audience won't notice. He could easily and explicitly sign-post a time transition in myriad of different ways (slow mix through, fade, George Lucas style cheesy wipe) and that he doesn't should be enough to tell anyone that what we see happens in a (very) rough approximation of (movie) real time. Look at the lighting in the underpass when Sam meets Mikaela after escaping Barricade - long shadows, orange glow, lit from the side - a sun low in the sky - it's late in the day. Bay loves to shoot scenes at sunrise/sunset for no other reason than it looks cool, look at any of his films and you'll often find him squashing time into strange shapes to enable this to happen. Filmmakers call the period pre-sunset as day turns to night 'magic-hour' and relish shooting in it. Sadly it's a short space of time in which to accomplish anything as the light level and color temperature alter very quickly, which means different shots are hard to match. You can see this in lots of films that have sunset love scenes, often the backgrounds vary a lot.

    By the time Sam and Mik are in Bumblebee being pursued the light level has dropped again - I'm not suggesting this was shot later the same day, merely that taking it down another notch helps with the transition. When we finally emerge from the (intentionally fairly dark) warehouse it's becoming properly dark. Unfortunately Bay only has one quick tight shot of Bumblebee rounding the corner in semi-darkness before we see the wide of the Chemical Plant or whatever it is and Barricade with his flashers on - and it's obviously night. And that is the shot that makes everyone go "huh?" because there is no obvious time-skip. It's sort of dark-ish...and then it's night.

    This will always present problems for any filmmaker it's just that Bay is rather unapologetically blunt in his "no-one'll notice, I lets just make it look cool" attitude. That in real life at LEAST a couple of hours would have passed to achieve this is basically treated as irrelevant. You're supposed to just buy it. That it bothers some people won't trouble MrBay one iota, however it suggests he could do with crediting his audience with more intelligence.

    You can see problems like this all over the film in other bizarre leaps in time, odd edits and general areas where internet nerds can gleefully pick.

    You can find faults in pretty much any film, Michael Bay just doesn't try and hide them as well as he could or as others do.
     
  14. wheeljaxx

    wheeljaxx Banned

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    As a photographer, i have noticed how fast the sun actually sets in the evening... to our perception, it seems to speed up the later in the day, but this is imposible, becuase teh sun moves at a constant. untill i HAD to rely on the light, i never noticed before. When i have to get that shot in before the sun gets to low and changes the color temperature of my shots.

    if the scenes were filmed in the late afternoon/ early evening, then yeah, the sun WILL seem go down much faster, take that into account, and time lapse for story telling, i just shrug it off, and enjoy the movie
     
  15. Fit For natalie

    Fit For natalie tfwiki nerd

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    There is a kind of lazy mistake once Bumblebee arrives at the abandoned power plant and backs into the corner. After he restarts his engine, you see a close up of his right rear wheel spinning... except the wheel spinning was filmed inside the warehouse they just raced through.

    And it's daytime in the closeup.
     
  16. HyperGeek_1984

    HyperGeek_1984 Herr Doktor

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    I agree 100%.



    It really seems to me that people are making mountains out of anthills with this. It's not as if Transformers was the first movie to ever compress or extend time to get a dramatic shot, and it's probably not even to worst for it.

    You want a real-world explanation for the time discrepancies? Bay likes dramatic sunset-sunrise and nighttime shots because they look cool and fit the mood/scene.

    You want an in-continuity explanation? The chase took a long time with Bumblebee and Barricade playing cat-and-mouse though the city for a long time.

    This stuck out at me.

    Personally I don't need my hand held through an entire movie with every little thing laid out for me perfectly and ever little detail explained right at the outset.

    At the risk of sounding pompous or arrogant (and that’s really NOT my intent), I can put pieces together myself without expository dialog or director commentary, so maybe it's not Bay who’s not giving the audience enough credit.*




    *That's not ment as personal attack, just to be clear.
     
  17. DeathsHead

    DeathsHead Well-Known Member

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    You seem to titanically miss my point here. This has nothing to do with explaining plot points through characters or commentary, merely that Mr Bay as a director is rather prone to leaving his 'mistakes' (if you really want to call them that) on show in his films, presumably on the understanding that people won't notice. It's here that I think he doesn't credit his audience. People are ever more film literate these days and do see this stuff. The endless pages on this board devoted to discussion of continuity errors etc etc certainly suggests this. I say again, you can find this stuff in ANY movie, but Transformers is rampant with it.
     
  18. Draven

    Draven Banned

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    Yeah, yeah, yeah. People dig at Bay over things they take for granted in other movies, just because a) it's him, and b) he directed the TF movie. We get it.
    Transformers is no more "rampant" with errors than just about any other movie.
     
  19. DeathsHead

    DeathsHead Well-Known Member

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    Whatever. It's still full of 'em. Which is why this entire movie board is devoted to discussing them. Got anything actually relevant to the topic at hand?
     
  20. Draven

    Draven Banned

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    In a discussion littered with comments moaning about Bay because of these errors, I would say that pointing out that other movies have them too is extremely relevant. Any more snippy little comments you feel like making, or are we done now?
     

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