A tad curious

Discussion in 'Transformers Toy Discussion' started by TheDemonDzko, Feb 20, 2012.

  1. TheDemonDzko

    TheDemonDzko °-{[●□●]}-° {Beep. Boop.)

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    Is it socially acceptable on this site to say:

    "Are you seriously complaining about a toy geared at children?"​

    We are a fandom that at this point range from kids to adults. If the toys where geared twoards children, and only children we wouldn't have the C/H/U/HFTD/G/U lines, as well as the various Web-forums dedicated to Transformers.

    Understandably though, yes Hasbro's over-lined intent is that the toys are meant for children, but that is like saying so are all video games. However, for the most part we are all collectors here, and I think it is a bit silly to say that the toys are meant for children, and only children.

    Now as for complaints towards toys I think people mis-understand the level of complaining that is expressed via the internet. I assure you, nobody is losing sleep because they are disappointed in reveals or at the information they are told at Toyfairs, and other conventions. In all reality we only are vocalizing a expression that perhaps, for example: The First Edition toys, being canceled.

    That is something that I think we are entitled to complain about, due to the nature of the subject. Is it unfortunate that we have a rise in threads of that nature? Yes. However, unless it gets stuck or popular, it's going to happen. Moving on.

    Let us look at the reveals of Toyfair 2012. There where was quite a large amount of negative opinions geared towards the majority of reveals, due to a nitpick here or there. However, i'm sure the people that expressed their opinion here are not necessarily going to commit an extreme act over their disappointment, so I find it to be in poor taste to criticize a fellow collector over their own personal disappointment in a product.

    Honestly it is just my thoughts on the subject, especially since it seems lately with as the amount of negative threads rise, the amount of generally cool people decide that their own anus is a lovely place to be this time of year, due to the weather and low gas prices, and it scientific terms becoming complete assholes. Which, as you know isn't cool in the slightest.

    So, ya'll. Thoughts?

    __________________________________________________________






    Also, in before "Tl;dr", "this guy clearly doesn't understand economics.", and "stick it up her pooper."
     
  2. Agent Adam

    Agent Adam Well-Known Member

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    I think complaints are sometimes warranted. The hyperbole some people employ while doing so however is not.

    Perhaps warranted isn't really what I'm going for. Critiquing and stating your opinion is fine, some people just go a little overboard.
     
  3. SHINOBI03

    SHINOBI03 Well-Known Member

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    Just because they are mostly geared toward children doesn't mean we can't complain on their quality.
     
  4. Agent Adam

    Agent Adam Well-Known Member

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    True, but some people take it too seriously and treat the lines as if they should be produced with mainly collectors in mind and kids second, instead of the other way around.
     
  5. Erland

    Erland Well-Known Member

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    If they were only geared towards kids then we would only have the cyberverse versions and not deluxe, voyager, and leader class. You know good and well the leader class were geared towards adults/collectors and not for kids.

    I haven't found a kid with the patients enough to transform a Deluxe DOTM yet much less a voyager/leader class.

    Shit the way it was, when I was a kid my brother had to come to me to transform all his transformers cause he couldn't do it and that was back in the G1 days where they were simple compared to the new versions.

    So if someone is complaining that someone on this forum is complaining about a toy line I would suspect they are just trollin or just tired of hearing about it..
     
  6. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP AKA Beve Stuscemi

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    Complaining about quality =/= making outrageous demands, believing Has/Tak should cater soley to the minority, and flouting a misplaced sense of entitlement.
     
  7. Agent Adam

    Agent Adam Well-Known Member

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    Seriously? First, no one said they were ONLY geared to kids. Just mostly. (Because they are)

    On the leader comment.. do you really think collectors typically prefer sound boxes and extra gimmicks that potentially limit what a figure can do? I sure don't. If leaders were geared towards collectors, I doubt BumbleBee would be about to get his second one. I also don't see how having toys priced above and bigger in size than Cyberverse implies in any way they a geared towards adults.
     
  8. jinx23

    jinx23 Wrecker

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    hasbro is geared towards kids, but the kids in us make us love them; if hasbro thought of mainly adults then they would go bankrupt

    3rd party is geared towards adults - price points, limited runs and filling in gaps in our collections
     
  9. Erland

    Erland Well-Known Member

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    When I made that comment I was thinking about the details and complexity of the toy rather than the price. Their are a lot more details on the leader class then the cyber or deluxe versions.

    Your telling me that you, as a collector, would rather have a very generic easy to transform version of a character rather than a more detailed and more complex version (even with the gimmicks) that is closer to the actual character than a cyberverse? How else do you plan to have a bigger, better, more complex and detailed version without raising the price of it? (Better might be the wrong word, because obviously not all collectors think they are better)

    The gimmicks were put in to try to attract the few rich kids that could talk their parents into buying them. I didn't say they were directly geared to the adults/collectors but, they wouldn't be around if adults were not the main purchasers of them.

    You can't tell me that those "secret/hidden" sounds are not geared towards the adults who watched the shows as a kid?

    I have yet to see a parent buy a leader class for their kid mainly because I'm not rich and don't live around rich people who can waste an extra $30 on the same toy but bigger. The only people I have ever seen buy a leader class was either a collector or an adult that thought they were bad ass (mainly because they were drunk at walmart at 3am) and they had money to burn (cause they were drunk).

    Just curious but, how is there a second DOTM Leader Bumblebee coming out if the DOTM line has been canceled? or is it from a different line?

    Maybe I'm wrong about it all but that is just my opinion...
     
  10. Agent Adam

    Agent Adam Well-Known Member

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    A lot of that has to do with the size. Of course a larger figure can fit in more details and be more complex. There is more room for it.

    That's not what I'm saying at all. Not sure why you thought I was.

    The gimmicks are there to attract kids, period. Adults are the main purchasers by default since kids don't have jobs. But the gimmicks and all that are there to attract them in general. I think you underestimate how much many parents will spend on their children.

    No I can't, but a single feature doesn't mean the entire product is meant for the one segment that feature is for. If the toy itself was designed mainly for collectors those features wouldn't be hidden, they would be advertised.

    Unless you pull up a chair to the toy aisle and camp out all day (or longer if you're at a Wal-Mart :wink: ), your odds of seeing anyone buying a leader class figure is fairly low. Again, I think you are underestimating how much some parents will spend on their kids. Some friends of mine bought an Ipad for their 4 year old to mess with. And these people are not even close to being rich.

    I was refering to Prime Leaderclass/Weaponizer BumbleBee from toyfair last week.

    I'm not gonna say you are flat out wrong. I just think that if leader's were made mainly with collectors in mind, pretty much all of them would be very different than what we get.
     
  11. videriant

    videriant Well-Known Member

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    Yep. There's not clear cut yes or no. The appropriate use of the statement depends on what it is in response to.
     
  12. Gingerchris

    Gingerchris Telly-headed Tyrant

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    Well, it's not like the packaging states a maximum age. What's it say these days? 5+ ? Without it saying something like 'Ages 5-15' or the like these figures are intended for everyone, no matter their age. Just because these figures may cater more towards the minimum end of the age range in general doesn't mean they have to limit themselves to just that standard.
     
  13. Grandum

    Grandum Well-Known Member

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    Hell must have frozen over...we finally agree on something.

    We probably don't agree on what an outrageous demand is, as I'm quite comfortable in voicing my opinion about the choice of what color plastic to use, paint apps, keeping the old deluxe size or maintaining show accurasy.

    But I really think it would be silly of has/tak to cater to cater to the minority, I really don't want them to cater to a small fringe group that wants to go back to brickformers or something like that - HOWEVER, I find it equaly rediculus to think that something can't appeal to both kids and collectors alike. It doesn't have to be one or the other.

    The self entitlement bit can be anoying, like when someone says that if they don't get to pay the same prices they did 10 years ago for a deluxe then they won't buy any deluxes. But, again I think we judge what is self entitlement and what isn't differently. I mean I'm perfectly fine with people express a wish for what toys they would like to see, but I draw the line at people demanding things, that's just childish.
     
  14. videriant

    videriant Well-Known Member

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    Because they cater to a certain age range there's a price point that has to be met which inherently limit the standard as the norm.
     
  15. Grandum

    Grandum Well-Known Member

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    To answer your original question - yes, it is unfortunatly. I wish it wasn't, but it is. I would say that if you go back some 6 or 7 years ago, then it would have been taboo - but with the influx of the movies the fandom got swarmed with kids who thought of themselves as collectors, since they had a few well played with movie verse toys that they've gotten from their parants, and to them it might very well just be toys - but to the oldschool collectors who pay $2000+ for a MISB Black zarak or $3000+ for a MISB Grand maximus it's not just a toy - it's an investment and a holy grail.

    I am an optimist when it comes to the future though, I think we will go back to being the kind of fandom we were before the movies. Right now the Movie generation is going through the whole "omg, they are canceling movie verse and moving on" bit, closely followed by "am I too old to be playing with toys?" but hopefully they will stay with us, mature, open up to new (and old)incarnations and a little bit more in tune with the rest of the fandom...I'm really sick and tired of this whole divide, and I really, really hate that they strayed so far from all other incarnations of transformers and thereby dividing the fandom like this.
     
  16. Transbot90210

    Transbot90210 Banned

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    To keep it short I think it is idiotic to use the "are we seriously complaining about a toy for kids" arguement.

    Yes it is serious, we are a fandom based around a toyline developed for kids. But it has grown past that. Classics is a fan wank, Takara produced items are for the collectors, 3rd party stuff IS NOT FOR KIDS.

    I think there is a line to be drawn when complaining about TFs produced by Hasbro but even then a stupid call is a stupid call and you can complain about it.

    At the end of the day when you log on to TFW2005 you are here to discuss every single last fibre of the thing called Transformers.
     
  17. Grandum

    Grandum Well-Known Member

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  18. Soundwinder

    Soundwinder I wind sounds!

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    This. Entitlement is one thing, but it is ultimately our money. When people lambast someone for perfectly valid criticisms because "it's a kid's toy" is ridiculous. Similarly (but less maliciously) claiming that it being a kid's toy/kid's company automatically excuses any decision that Hasbro makes is just silly. It excuses a lot, automatically, but it being for kids doesn't mean a figure has to automatically take a nose dive in quality.

    We can't always get what we want, but we have the right to mention it.

    That said, I think that the "kids toy" defense came up because, yes, a lot of us are over entitled and really expect so much and are ridiculous. So yeah, case-by-case basis.
     
  19. EShadowP

    EShadowP Well-Known Member

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    "Are you seriously complaining about a toy geared at children?"

    is just as acceptable as

    "stick it up her pooper."

    Both are high-larious to some, inappropriate to others, and a very serious statement to a very small minority.

    Some will feel that the clearly demonstrated attention given to collectors over the years allows them to complain about it when it misses their personal mark. I personally don't think collectors are owed anything from hasbro that the kids/parents aren't owed.
     
  20. Aernaroth

    Aernaroth <b><font color=blue>I voted for Super_Megatron and Veteran

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    Oddly enough the majority of video games are purchased and consumed by people above the age of 13, unlike toys.
     

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