While we do agree that F22's were part of the final dimise of Megatron, there still is speculation to whether SS had lead the attack or if it was all the humans.

IF bay kept SS character than yes he would want to take out Megs to get leadership...BUT...in ALL circumstances when SS tries to take out Megs, that I can remember, he is making it clear that he is doing so, and he is normally no more than a few feet away from him. It isn't in SS character to not let it be known that he was behind trying to kill Megs. So in my eyes SS was framed by the other F22's. Now with the line in the movie, "they won't fly that low" I think that the F22's did fly that low after the fight began because it was only way to get target. Like when they shot at Blackout. So I believe it was the humans flying the F22s that led to the demise of Megatron!

 

I really don't think SS participated in shooting Megs down at the end, since Tyrese's line about Raptors "not flying that low" was mentioned when SS initially attacked Ironhide and Bee' (resulting in his legs being destroyed) and I would think Bay would have made that very apparent.

The way I interperted it, SS blew up a bunch of the initial Raptors and then decided to leave because he saw how poorly the situation was becoming, even with Megs appearing to have the upper hand on Ops momentarily.

 

This debate could easily have been avoided through better character development of the Decepticons. Would be a cool sub-plot for TF2, though.

 

That's a good story idea, Spoiler.

I don't think we saw it happen that way at all though. It's too bad, too. I rather like your idea. I'll have to watch with that in mind when I see the film again, but I doubt it was in there.

You'd need some dialogue and more characterization of Starscream to explain it being included in the story. I loved the movie, but that was one classic element that was missing.

 

I haven't read the novel yet. What's it's take on the scene?

 

easy way to figure out if he was in the attack:
how many F-22s were sent by the military?
how many F-22s does screamer take out?
How many attack megatron?

 

I'll let you know when it comes out on Blu-ray.   It is an interesting theory.

 

Starscream took out the F-22's and that was it. Remember, the entire time after that he was just standing on the building. Things went sour and he chickened out. Simple as that.

 

It seems to me that when SS transforms back into the F22 prior to the last barrage on Megs the human pilots lost track of him. It is very possible that SS aided in the attack to weaken Megs.

 

Well, If I can recall correctly, he took out 5 in the one scene. There were quite a few raptors flying around. At least 10 or more. And there was about 4 attacking Megatron. I truley think it would be out of character for SS to attack him from such a distance making it not so obvious that he did it. Starscreams character is that he wants Megs to know he was trying to kill him. For instance, if SS were to attack him and be within character. It may have been when Megatron was trying to get the allspark from Sam, and SS was on the roof nearby. At that point Megs would know SS did it because he is the only one in plain sight. The raptors wouldn't of made an attack with Sam being so close. That's why they sent in the Blackhawks.

 

not for the entire time. he actually left before Megatron knocked Sam off it. when the camera pans around sam, it shows the building Starscream was standing on. he's not on it anymore.

you're judging this based on what you expect Starscream's character to be. This isnt G1. For all we know, this Starscream would be happy to do it in stealth.

 

Ok this is what happened. SS was taking the raptors out, he transformed back into alt mode, then 3 raptors (one was SS) passed over megs and one of those fired a shot at megatron it was really hard to see who it was.

 

It was difficult to see and to speculate until I watch it again. I was sitting way too close on Monday.

 

Not sure on counting the raptors, but:
It seems to me there were two formations of 4 raptors each. SS took out one formation entirely (I think), and then a couple more, but not all of them.

In the final missile barrage against Megs, I think the key point is that there is more than 1 raptor attacking. So even if SS did fire on Megs, he's managed to get the humans to help out / cover up.

 

SZtill, he could've just booked. He was noticably absent for some of the brawl, and I don't mean hiding amogst the F-22s.

Plus, what would he have done without Megs or the Allspark? After Megatron went down he never made any attempt to seize the Cube. Without the cube, Megatron or an army, he was boned, so he ditched.

 

Lookin back on it, I really wish that they gave Megatron and SS just a little bit longer of an exchange. Here how it should have went down.

Megatron: "You've failed me yet again, Starscream."
Starscream: "Who was stuck in ice for a century?"
Megatron grabs Starscream's throat (If that is possible that is) speaks in cybertronian: "You dare challenge Megatron? You are my servant, don't forget that!"
Starscream snidely in english: "Yes, Mighty Megatron"

That to me would have been a great exchange and really solidify the theory that Starscream helped kill Megatron.

 

It was a great movie. But the TF's are (or should have been) well developed and defined characters. I wish there had been a bit more character development and dialogue among the bots (in a subtle, but visible way), but there were just too many. Its too many personalities to develop in the 2hrs 24 mins, on top of all the comedy and the humans. Oh, the humans....

 

I thought about this situation yesterday after seeing the movie again. I'm going again tonight and tomorrow, so between the two showings maybe I can try to do the math.

 

As long as Starscream shoots down one F22 it gives him the opportunity to blend in.

I thought that there were three left in the group inbound into the city, and four that shot Megatron. BTW, what about the first set of F22s that fired missiles, and we never find out what they hit?

 

But don't forget his character in the Prequel.

NOVEL [BOLD] SPOILER [/BOLD]

BTW Ice Man was en route when?
When did he arrive at the Hoover Dam?
I hear 1935 and the book occured after Vietnam war