It may not be as pronounced in the animation model but the rib cage does sink in:

 

For me it's less the ribcage and more so the intensive amounts of panel lines. I know these are transformers, but I prefer much less panel lines and gaps. And I know it's a tough transformation to do, but this is why I'm just not on board with strict accuracy.

 

I mean, there's only so much you can do. In order to be the most accurate in one mode, the other mode usually suffers, especially with Beastformers. Cars have the advantage of an undercarriage to hide a bunch of parts. In that case, I'd rather it be the beast mode that suffers, since it will be in robot mode 85% of the time.

 

Right right, but at that point, why not just release a $60 action master equivalent of Dinobot? Yes, I get that these are transformers, but going for show accuracy and transformation can be quite difficult. Especially considering the minimal kibble design, Dinobot would almost benefit more from that. I think a number of characters would.

 

And that's why MP-43 is a downright miracle:

 

You answered your own question right there

 

Yeah, exactly. I'd still like to have something that actually transforms. An action master would sit on the shelf with no real purpose. MP Dinobot will be fiddled with when I need a distraction and a challenge.

In fairness, Megatron's design is a lot more straightforward than Dinobot's. Dinobot's animation cheated a lot.

 

So about that PE: TM2 Megs...

 

I disagree, I think Transformers is more about the ability to transform or not. This is a brand about characters and their expressions as individuals too, with some series barely featuring transforming at all. Transforming transformers are never going anywhere. So we don't have to pretend a hypothetical new action master line with good articulation would replace transforming figures. However, because of the fact that these are characters, some of whom who have ridiculously complex designs allowing for minimal kibble and such, I don't see why it's out of the question. MP Dinobot wouldn't leave anywhere, but wouldn't it be better in some cases to have a super poseable non transforming figure, which would be far more show accurate than any transforming figure would possibly hope to be? For a fraction of the cost? The obsession with the necessity to transform in a line with some characters who barely transform after certain points, even admitting that he'd be in robot mode "85% of the time", as you put it, I think it's okay to let go of that final 15% in exchange for better accuracy and better posability.

 

Yes, as long as MP Beast Wars are not going anywhere, I'll be more than happy to welcome an action master line of the BW characters. But if you want me to choose then I'm gonna pick the transforming masterpieces anyday.

 

Yeah I understand, I think "You can only have a transforming BW MP or an action master BW and there won't be an option for the other", the obvious choice is for the transforming figure. But I still think posable non transforming characters in lines of characters with difficult transformations to replicate as an additional option, I don't think is a bad idea. Kinda like the Flametoys model kids of IDW characters.

 

T'was a lovely try…  

 

We have those and they’re not a fraction of the cost. What you describe is the flame toys figures

 

Exactly right. Fifty percent of his bot mode is his alt mode.

 

I'm not talking about the flame toys figures I'm talking about the upcoming model kits for $40 not the $300 figures

 

Exactly, there are options. We tend to like those things.

To take a line called Transformers about robots disguised in alternate forms and pretend that you can move forward with an MP line that is the definitive representation of the character without using the alternate mode on any figure is a failure. The alternate mode is an intrinsic part of the character as surely as the robot. Lets look at this from two angles. Much of the identity that defines the character comes from the alternate mode. The Seekers stick together. The cars identify with cars. Constructicons stick together. Hell, Aerialbots initially identify with Seekers instead of Autobots. No matter how much better the robot looks without transforming kibble, to remove the alt mode from the figure is to remove part of its identity. Second, the prime examples for the reverse of this would be the Dinobots. They are almost always in dino mode. Why do we bother to get them for the robot mode? It's part of their identity. It's what ties them to Autobots because they remember where they came from as much as they like to bond with nature and act like dinosaurs. They have duality. Arcee is a complex and compromised transformation from which Fans Toys received a lot of flack. Although its still very posable, compromises were made in a waist swivel and other features of both the car and robot to make it all work. Did we really need the car? Hell yes, because Arcee statues and crappy robot versions had been available but no one had nailed the car and robot. It only took us 30 years to get what we wanted because it was so damned hard. As stated above, its fine to have robot only options but those will never be the MP or definitive version because they are missing half the character. Each transformer DESERVES a figure that satisfies the main duties of the character whether it's a shuttle, locomotive, or robot or the arm and chest plate of a combiner.

 

Please reread what I posted, I never said the MP line was going anywhere. In fact I explicitly stated

Transforming figures are not going anywhere, it is the option to also in addition have a non transforming line for these characters with heavy cheating of which I am suggesting. That gets around the issue for people, like myself and others, who take issues with heavy panel lines and such. Hasbro even did it with the Robot Replicas line, with sculpt advancements on their part imagine what they could do now. And look, none of that impeded the movie lines at the time.

And what about the characters whose alt mode isn't even known or barely scene? Take most of the cast of More Than Meets the Eye, like Megatron who never transformed in the body. It was not intrinsic what he turned into, it was his character. In fact, even though this most likely wasn't intentional by any means, but I can make the arguement that this is symbolic of his character and his beliefs of not wanting to be tied down to his alt mode the way Functionalists wanted him to be. In the case of Dinobot, his shining episode, Code of Hero, of which he is most remembered for, had him briefly as a raptor to run out his ship. He then spent the remaining time of the episode making his character shine in robot form. His code of honor, his sacrifices, emotions, those were all conveyed through robot mode. I'm not saying trash the MP. I don't like the MP personally because of how the transformation looks. I'm not saying everyone else should. All I'm saying is "Hey, wouldn't the option to have a non transforming Dinobot be a good idea considering how heavy his transformation cheats.

And for the last time, please actually read what I'm saying. I'm saying more robot only options is a good idea but I'm not saying replace the MP line with them. Transformers are not getting replaced with action masters, stop acting like that.

 

*reads last few pages*
I knew logging back into this site was a mistake

 

If somebody had time, I would love to see a photoshop of this in Starscream colors. My MS paint skills aren't quite up to par...

 

You would think the already existing threads with hundreds of pages for the MP BW figures would be a better place for the last several pages of discussion. I guess it's time to unwatch this thread.